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Davies Report and the RL Challenge Cup Final


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#1 Marto

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Posted 01 December 2009 - 03:28 PM

The Rugby League All Party Parliamentary Group (APPG), the Board of the Rugby Football League and Supporters Direct oppose this recommendation. The RFL has given evidence to the Committee and responded to the Department of Culture, Media and Sport (DCMS) to this effect. An Early Day Motion (EDM) has been tabled by Neil Turner MP as Secretary and the Conservative and Liberal Democrat MPs who are Vice-Chairs of the Group, and we are seeking a debate in Parliament.

As a Rugby League Supporter, you can help ensure that this proposal is defeated, and that the Challenge Cup remains available to all supporters to see on free to view television.

Firstly as RL supporters, please write and encourage your local MP to sign the EDM (EDM48) to indicate their support for our view. To find your who your MP is and their contact details, check http://findyourmp.parliament.uk/. I should explain that only Back-bench MPs can sign EDMs, but your writing to your MP should they be a Government Minister or Opposition Spokesperson will show them the strength and depth of feeling on this issue within their constituency.

Secondly, please respond to the consultation by writing to DCMS and making your views known. The number of letters they receive will be a major factor in their accepting or rejecting the report's recommendations. Once open, the consultation, and contact details for responses will be listed at http://www.culture.g...ns/default.aspx.

I believe that we can overturn this recommendation, but only if we act collectively as Rugby League fans in the way I have suggested. I hope your Trust and its members will help, and we can keep the Challenge Cup on 'free to air' television, and allow all those many fans who cannot see regularly televised Super League games live to enjoy one of our games greatest spectacles, and top teams battle for one of our country's oldest trophies.

Once the consultation period is open we will be posting details of who to contact at the DCMS and how to sign the petition, we will send to the DCMS.

Below is a sample email to send to your MP -

CODE
Dear (Insert Name of MP),

Davies Report and the RL Challenge Cup Final

I am sure you will be aware that the Davies Committee has recommended that the Challenge Cup should no longer be on the 'A' list of events free to view on terrestrial television.

The Rugby League All Party Parliamentary Group (APPG), the Board of the Rugby Football League, Supporters Direct and the Rugby League Supporter Association oppose this recommendation. The RFL has given evidence to the Committee and responded to the Department of Culture, Media and Sport (DCMS) to this effect. An Early Day Motion (EDM48) has been tabled by Neil Turner MP as Secretary and the Conservative and Liberal Democrat MPs who are Vice-Chairs of the Group, and we are seeking a debate in Parliament.

As a Rugby League supporter, I would urge you to sign the EDM and show your support for this campaign.  Rugby League is one of the fastest growing sports in the country at grass-roots level and this growth can only gained with continued exposure from free-to-air TV.  The Rugby League Challenge Cup has provided some iconic moments in this country's sporting history and will continue to do so in future as the country's top teams battle for one of sports oldest trophies.

Best Wishes,

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#2 Steve Ashton

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Posted 01 December 2009 - 05:20 PM

It should be a free market where the sport gets its full worth for being on TV rather than reduced money by the limited number of terrestrial operators. If the BBC value RL they will pay a market price for it.

I really don't see in this day and age why anything should be made to be on free tv as at the end of the day its people choice whether they want to pay for it or not....

You pay you money and you take your choice


Steven Ashton

#3 Robin Evans

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Posted 01 December 2009 - 05:26 PM

and sod those who can't afford it eh!
Just what we need, fewer people watching and only available to those fortunate enough to afford it!

"i'm alright jack" eh?

Owt on sky can do without my support. But moving the cup from the bbc (a comp that in all honesty i don't give a toss about, but accept lots do), becomes even more divisive!
"I love our club, absolutely love it". (Overton, M 2007)

#4 oldrover

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Posted 01 December 2009 - 10:34 PM

QUOTE (Robin Evans @ Dec 1 2009, 05:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
and sod those who can't afford it eh!
Just what we need, fewer people watching and only available to those fortunate enough to afford it!

"i'm alright jack" eh?

Owt on sky can do without my support. But moving the cup from the bbc (a comp that in all honesty i don't give a toss about, but accept lots do), becomes even more divisive!


ditto
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#5 Steve Ashton

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Posted 01 December 2009 - 11:31 PM

[quote name='Robin Evans' date='Dec 1 2009, 06:26 PM' post='1911335']
and sod those who can't afford it eh!
Just what we need, fewer people watching and only available to those fortunate enough to afford it!

"i'm alright jack" eh?


I work hard and choose to spend money on Sky TV, which is well worth the 40 per month, much better sports coverage than the free channels, who mostly are not interested in sport, preferring to spend their/our money on reality TV rubish.

What about people that cannot afford the BBC license fee, what would you do for them ?.

As I said before, if the BBC want the challenge cup final they will pay the market value for it, if they don't the sport will get more money and be able to put into the grassroots.

In all reality, the cost of the competition will be well within BBC budgets, if they actually want to televise it.





Steven Ashton

#6 LOWFIELD

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Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:30 AM

Why the RFL think the challenge cup is important enough to be granted protected status is beyond me, it became a Johnstons paint trophy, zeneth data cup,FA Vase, FA trophy, Unibond league challenge cup, North east Counties league cup, Selby Cup, Captains Morgan Trophy, Floodlight Trophy the day teams in the cup started playing to different rules. God knows why sky or anyone else would want to pay good money to show a tournament where some teams can play 1 foreign player and others 5.
The people running this game are making a right pigs ear of it at the moment, how they keep there jobs i will never know

#7 Robin Evans

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Posted 02 December 2009 - 12:06 PM

QUOTE (Steve Ashton @ Dec 1 2009, 11:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I work hard and choose to spend money on Sky TV, which is well worth the 40 per month, much better sports coverage than the free channels, who mostly are not interested in sport, preferring to spend their/our money on reality TV rubish.

What about people that cannot afford the BBC license fee, what would you do for them ?.

As I said before, if the BBC want the challenge cup final they will pay the market value for it, if they don't the sport will get more money and be able to put into the grassroots.

In all reality, the cost of the competition will be well within BBC budgets, if they actually want to televise it.


We are both fortunate enough to earn enough to choose whether to spend 40 a month on a TV package. I don't dispute you work hard for your money Steve.
But the work I do involves me working with some families who's income means they haven't got that luxury.
The BBC represents the only access they have to our game through the cup and SL show- and as I understand it, if a 'means test' identifies such, they may qualify for help towards a licence fee!

As I said, I largely don't give a toss about the comp. But I know a lot who do. I would rather see what is left of 'free to air' game remain so to keep a wider audience involved. There's too much 'exclusion' in our game as it is!



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#8 Robin Evans

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Posted 02 December 2009 - 12:07 PM

QUOTE (LOWFIELD @ Dec 2 2009, 01:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The people running this game are making a right pigs ear of it at the moment, how they keep there jobs i will never know


Oh suggy, you short round bouncey dollop of numptyness! I believe I agree with you!!! cool.gif
"I love our club, absolutely love it". (Overton, M 2007)

#9 LOWFIELD

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Posted 02 December 2009 - 12:51 PM

QUOTE (Robin Evans @ Dec 2 2009, 02:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Oh suggy, you short round bouncey dollop of numptyness! I believe I agree with you!!! cool.gif


Spen Allison the barla chairman ought to be running the RFL i met him last week a true gent and a real RL man and unlike Lewis he as actually played and coached the game. But the main reason for me he should be involved is because in HIS main cup tournament the National cup every team from the smallest pub team to the might of holders Siddal play to the same rules, and any club playing an unregistered player is kicked out straight away no bother. In the National Conference league Brighouse Rangers played an unregistered player in a league game and were booted out immediatly no messing.
But even though the RFL have been seen to favour expansion teams they are just as likely to kick Celtic and Harlequins out before this season starts because they havent got a clue what they are doing no long term planning, decisions with out much thought, but people like Hetherington arnt much better they are always there lurking in the background with there self centred ideas.
WE ARE ALL GOING TO HELLL IN A HANDCART

Edited by LOWFIELD, 02 December 2009 - 12:52 PM.


#10 DMS

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Posted 02 December 2009 - 06:05 PM

I work hard and choose to spend money on Sky TV, which is well worth the 40 per month, much better sports coverage than the free channels, who mostly are not interested in sport, preferring to spend their/our money on reality TV rubish.

What about people that cannot afford the BBC license fee, what would you do for them ?.

As I said before, if the BBC want the challenge cup final they will pay the market value for it, if they don't the sport will get more money and be able to put into the grassroots.

In all reality, the cost of the competition will be well within BBC budgets, if they actually want to televise it.
[/quote]



I don't see how you working hard has anything to do with this discussion. I have mates who work hard and stil can't afford sky. The generalisation that free to air channels prefer to spend their/our money on reality tv is frankly rubbish. There are some fine programmes on free to air telly. They haven't got 3 channels to use for sport and being a public broadcasting organisation are legally bound to provide a wide range of programmes. On top of the tv license i think 40 a month is expensive.

I have to agree with Robins assesment of your comments. "I'm alright Jack"

Edited by DMS, 02 December 2009 - 06:06 PM.

"FEVVED UP AND RARING TO GO"

#11 Steve Ashton

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Posted 02 December 2009 - 07:55 PM

QUOTE (DMS @ Dec 2 2009, 07:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I work hard and choose to spend money on Sky TV, which is well worth the 40 per month, much better sports coverage than the free channels, who mostly are not interested in sport, preferring to spend their/our money on reality TV rubish.

What about people that cannot afford the BBC license fee, what would you do for them ?.

As I said before, if the BBC want the challenge cup final they will pay the market value for it, if they don't the sport will get more money and be able to put into the grassroots.

In all reality, the cost of the competition will be well within BBC budgets, if they actually want to televise it.




I don't see how you working hard has anything to do with this discussion. I have mates who work hard and stil can't afford sky. The generalisation that free to air channels prefer to spend their/our money on reality tv is frankly rubbish. There are some fine programmes on free to air telly. They haven't got 3 channels to use for sport and being a public broadcasting organisation are legally bound to provide a wide range of programmes. On top of the tv license i think 40 a month is expensive.

I have to agree with Robins assesment of your comments. "I'm alright Jack"



Yeah right, bring on the revolution brother.....
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#12 DMS

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Posted 03 December 2009 - 12:13 PM

QUOTE (Steve Ashton @ Dec 2 2009, 07:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Yeah right, bring on the revolution brother.....

Predictable. You don't like another view point to yours so resort to sarcasm.
"FEVVED UP AND RARING TO GO"

#13 Bob Fowler

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Posted 03 December 2009 - 05:27 PM

Can someone explain why we have to pay to watch premium sports on television anyway ? If the sport is good enough then surely the revenue from advertising should cover the cost as it does with football on ITV? I know the BBC don't have advertisisng but they take money off me every year so thatI can watch repeats or sub standard documentaries ( apart from Life) The idea initially was that the licence fee was brought in to cover the cost of broadcasting 1 television station and four radio stations ( Luxembourg existed on adverts) BSB and Sky launched in competition and then had to merge because there was insufficient response to both stations. NOw how people spend their hard earned is entirely up to them, but remember there are many unfortunate people who cannot afford 40 a month pensioners and people unable to work through illness or injury. I believe that prime sports should be broadcast by terrestrial television to reach the majority otherwise it becomes discrimination against those unable to afford 40. Should the Derby or Grand National only be available to those who can afford or available to those who love racing ? Should football become a sport only those in good jobs can afford or available to all ? should Rugby (league and union) be available to just those who can spare a few bob each month? Before anyone say's anything I could afford SKY I chose not to after 1995 and I still feel the same, I have no axe to grind with anyone who feels differently . Sport should be available to all no matter what their circumstances otherwise we get an us and them situation or an inferiority complex.
To be a ROVER is a privilege not to be taken lightly, with fans like ours, we will always be honoured.

#14 DMS

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Posted 03 December 2009 - 05:39 PM

QUOTE (Bob Fowler @ Dec 3 2009, 05:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Can someone explain why we have to pay to watch premium sports on television anyway ? If the sport is good enough then surely the revenue from advertising should cover the cost as it does with football on ITV? I know the BBC don't have advertisisng but they take money off me every year so thatI can watch repeats or sub standard documentaries ( apart from Life) The idea initially was that the licence fee was brought in to cover the cost of broadcasting 1 television station and four radio stations ( Luxembourg existed on adverts) BSB and Sky launched in competition and then had to merge because there was insufficient response to both stations. NOw how people spend their hard earned is entirely up to them, but remember there are many unfortunate people who cannot afford 40 a month pensioners and people unable to work through illness or injury. I believe that prime sports should be broadcast by terrestrial television to reach the majority otherwise it becomes discrimination against those unable to afford 40. Should the Derby or Grand National only be available to those who can afford or available to those who love racing ? Should football become a sport only those in good jobs can afford or available to all ? should Rugby (league and union) be available to just those who can spare a few bob each month? Before anyone say's anything I could afford SKY I chose not to after 1995 and I still feel the same, I have no axe to grind with anyone who feels differently . Sport should be available to all no matter what their circumstances otherwise we get an us and them situation or an inferiority complex.

Bang on the nail Bob.
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#15 jamescolin

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Posted 03 December 2009 - 06:59 PM

QUOTE (DMS @ Dec 3 2009, 05:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Bang on the nail Bob.

40 a month is just over a 1 a day. I am not getting into politics but I don't know anybody that can't afford that. I reckon it is what Steve says, choice. Four pints is 10 or there abouts and a lot of people who cry poverty drink that. In fact quite a few people on benefits get more than I do after 40 years of work. I have to pay for just about everything whilst freebees are flying about all over the place. If you want it you will get it.

#16 Robin Evans

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Posted 03 December 2009 - 07:18 PM

QUOTE (jamescolin @ Dec 3 2009, 06:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
40 a month is just over a 1 a day. I am not getting into politics but I don't know anybody that can't afford that. I reckon it is what Steve says, choice. Four pints is 10 or there abouts and a lot of people who cry poverty drink that. In fact quite a few people on benefits get more than I do after 40 years of work. I have to pay for just about everything whilst freebees are flying about all over the place. If you want it you will get it.

Colin. I work with people who Cannot aford that, who don't drink 4 pints a week as you suggest and don't get 'freebies' flying at them as you elude to. Despite wanting lots of things in their lives, they sometimes struggle to get things they NEED.
Sometimes, the people with learning disabilities I work with have just about enough to meet basic needs. What I would consider essential facets of life, e.g. social networking, travelling to meet/make friends to avoid social isolation etc is even beyond their budget.
It's nice if you have the money to make that choice. I have and do make a choice NOT to have sky. Despite the welfare state, social services etc, I know your " If you want it you will get it" Mark to be wide of the mark!


and you're right about it not being about politics! I know I come across as a leftist pinko trot at times (which I suppose I am like) but to me this isn't politics. This is about a little fairness.
Those who can and are so desired, will pay for their SKY subscription. This is about retaining a small portion of our game available for everyone - free!! The vast majority of our game is on SKY for those who can afford it!
Just a little social policy from the BBC and the "all party" select committee who originally devised the list.

Edited by Robin Evans, 03 December 2009 - 07:32 PM.

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#17 Robin Evans

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Posted 03 December 2009 - 07:19 PM

QUOTE (Bob Fowler @ Dec 3 2009, 05:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Can someone explain why we have to pay to watch premium sports on television anyway ? If the sport is good enough then surely the revenue from advertising should cover the cost as it does with football on ITV? I know the BBC don't have advertisisng but they take money off me every year so thatI can watch repeats or sub standard documentaries ( apart from Life) The idea initially was that the licence fee was brought in to cover the cost of broadcasting 1 television station and four radio stations ( Luxembourg existed on adverts) BSB and Sky launched in competition and then had to merge because there was insufficient response to both stations. NOw how people spend their hard earned is entirely up to them, but remember there are many unfortunate people who cannot afford 40 a month pensioners and people unable to work through illness or injury. I believe that prime sports should be broadcast by terrestrial television to reach the majority otherwise it becomes discrimination against those unable to afford 40. Should the Derby or Grand National only be available to those who can afford or available to those who love racing ? Should football become a sport only those in good jobs can afford or available to all ? should Rugby (league and union) be available to just those who can spare a few bob each month? Before anyone say's anything I could afford SKY I chose not to after 1995 and I still feel the same, I have no axe to grind with anyone who feels differently . Sport should be available to all no matter what their circumstances otherwise we get an us and them situation or an inferiority complex.

Couldn't have put it better myself Bob!
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#18 jamescolin

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Posted 04 December 2009 - 05:51 PM

QUOTE (Robin Evans @ Dec 3 2009, 07:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Couldn't have put it better myself Bob!

I know there are some unfortunates but they are not all they seem. Reguarly in the paper shop I am behind unemployed people who buy forty fags and spend 20 on the lottery. Further I have also seen lots of former Featherstone supporters both employed and unemployed in the pubs watching Sky on television. That is another avenue that is open to them. I still think it is a matter of choice. Having been extremely poor myself and unemployed I have every sympathy for disabled people in any form. I also have personal experience of that. I am simply saying that people have their priorities and it is a matter of choice. I get better value watching Sky than I do BBC. Now if you were advocating a reduction in the BBC licence fee I would be right behind you. People might not be able to afford Sky because they have put other things before it in their list of how they spend their money. It is still a matter of choice. Don't think Robin that I haven't got some thoughts that follow your line of thinking. I still believe that facilities for workers such as canteens and playing fields provided by employers are only provided bercause a happy worker, works harder and makes more brass for the boss. See You, Col.

#19 Robin Evans

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Posted 04 December 2009 - 08:26 PM

QUOTE (jamescolin @ Dec 4 2009, 05:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I know there are some unfortunates but they are not all they seem.


I can assure you the one's I work with are Colin. I know for definate because we work their benefits out for them!


QUOTE (jamescolin @ Dec 4 2009, 05:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Reguarly in the paper shop I am behind unemployed people who buy forty fags and spend 20 on the lottery. Further I have also seen lots of former Featherstone supporters both employed and unemployed in the pubs watching Sky on television. That is another avenue that is open to them. I still think it is a matter of choice.

Again, some of those I work with can't aford 40 fags, lottery or regular visits to the club! Again, you make an assumption. I have the evidence to know differently (for some peopkle)! For them it most cewrtainly isn't a matter of choice.

QUOTE (jamescolin @ Dec 4 2009, 05:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I get better value watching Sky than I do BBC. Now if you were advocating a reduction in the BBC licence fee I would be right behind you. People might not be able to afford Sky because they have put other things before it in their list of how they spend their money. It is still a matter of choice.

I Again Col, I know very differently. You're making a lot of assumptions there. Some of which are true. But I can assure you there is still a class of people treading closely to basic life management and sod all else. A growing number and a hell of a lot more than perhaps you give credit for.

All i'm advocating is that a tiny proportion of our game remains free to air to be enjoyed by everyone. Those who can afford it, can buy the coverage for the overwhelming majority of our game!


Edited by Robin Evans, 04 December 2009 - 08:58 PM.

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#20 Bob Fowler

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Posted 05 December 2009 - 01:08 PM

As I said earlier I have no axe to grind with anyone who decides to pay fro subscription television. The whole crux of the matter though is, should the major sporting events be available on free to view television ? My answer was yes. I was also taking into account that many people could not afford to pay subscriptions. Colin you are right there are Pubs and Clubs to watch big games in if you wish, the clubhouse opened for this purpose and no-one was interested. There is bound to be many different programme choices available on SKY , that though is not the point, the whole point is that I pay my television licence to the BBC for them to entertain me, without that licence I am not able to watch ANY television.
Like you Colin I live on a pension, one which I contributed to all my working life and because I am not yet 65, never increases year after year so my income is static my outgoings are different. I do, however, have savings whch I could if required use, but the question is and will always be, should premium sporting events be available to the MAJORITY on free to view, I say yes. The argument about someone on benefits buying 40 fags cannot come into the equation the same as how can unemployed drug addicts afford a "fix"? 40 a month could be the difference between someone eating for a month and starving or freezing. I would much rather be frugal in that case, however, my main beef is that SKY nearly killed my rugby club by insisting on a merger and kicking us uncerimonally into the twighlight zone. That I still find difficult to forgive. Some will say it wasn't SKY's fault if that's the case, why not defer the start of Super League for one more season to allow clubs to fight for a legitimate place in the league, to form a credible business plan for Paris St Germain and London and forget about destrying the heritage of our game ? That would have made a more exciting scenarion, Paris may not have gone down the metro and Workington and Oldham would not have found themsleves struggling year in year out as they do now.The idea of Super League was a good one it was just badly thought out and implemented.

To be a ROVER is a privilege not to be taken lightly, with fans like ours, we will always be honoured.




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