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#1 marklaspalmas

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 05:05 PM

So, looking at the players who've left, NINE of whom (Barker,McLocklan, Hirst, Pryce, Haughey, Fallon, Kirk, Harris, Houston) we could reasonably suggest were first team regulars/squad men at the end of last season.

We've signed FOURTEEN new players, but only three of them were playing regular first team rugby last year. Then there's the two Papuan internationals. The other nine come from SL U21 teams, and as such are a bit of an unknown quantity/risk. I think it's be a bit unrealistic for more than two or three of them to hold down first team places.

SO the squad would look a bit like this:

FIRST TEAM

1. Ian Hardman FB
2. Jon Steel W
3. Sam Smeaton W
4. Larsen Marabe C
5. Tommy Saxton C
6. Jessie-Joe Parker C
7. Kyle Briggs SO
8. Andy Kain SH
9. Liam Finn SH

10. Stuart Dickens P
11. Tony Tonks P
12. Jack Lee H
13. Iain Morrison SR
14. Matty Dale SR
15. Tim Spears SR
16. Ross Divorty SR
17. Jon Grayshon SR
18. Jamie Field SR

U21s

Nate Brown W
Liam Welham C
Michael Coady C
Chris Parker SO
Danny Naughton SH
Aaron Dobek SH
Tommy Lynch P
Gareth Swift H
Dane Manning SR
Jodie Sheriffe SR
Danny Allen LF

The players in bold are the ones I think we'd most need to step up to first team level. I really don't know enough about any of them to tell who's going to make the grade.

So, do the numbers add up?

I think they probably do, though we look a bit light in the front row.

Do you agree?









I know there's another thread on the full squad, but I wanted to make a separate point.

 

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#2 sidnee

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 06:15 PM

We might be a little light in the front row, but look how wide our second row is!!!!!!

Don't know why, but I have a feeling we may acquire another prop sooner rather than later.

Anyone "in the know" help with this feeling?
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#3 Bob Fowler

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 07:38 PM

Just a guess but I see Morrison as moving to the front row and adding more mobility to the pack in that position. Matty Dale could also be used there as well but I fancy Spears to cover that position as well, although I would have relished the sight of Houston and Morrison on at the same time , that's not now going to happen. I do believe that daryl will use Finn more as a hooker, although as Mark says he is a recognised Scrum Half. Our main problems last season stemmed from the fact that our three quarters didn't make the difference in attack that we needed and it took the play offs before we seemed to adjust our style of play to "bully" the other teams into making mistakes. This season we could well have the players to make the breaks, we know Steele can back up what we need to see is a good fast courageous wingman, I don't know anything about Nate Brown so I can't comment Sam Smeaton has the courage, he just needs to learn how to position himself in defence , although he did well last season. I'm not downhearted at teh squad as I feel it has more go forward qualities about it, I just hope it has the stoppem qualities as well.

Edited by Bob Fowler, 10 December 2009 - 07:38 PM.

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#4 HaroldShand

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 08:30 PM

If Nat Brown ever plays in your first team, I'll know that you've sunk to a pretty low ebb. Before anyone slates me as being bitter he's no longer with us - I'm being totally honest with my assessment.
We had him for three seasons and it was obvious that he wasn't anywhere near up to scratch. Even a loan spell at Hunslet was cut short after they sent him back to us. Seriously, he'd even struggle to get a regular spot at ANY Championship 1 club.
I'm surprised that the press release when you signed him didn't mention that he had played for us (even in 2009, he put in at least 5 or 6 diabolical performances for Batley). It read pretty much as though he was a product of the Wakefield Trinity Wildcats Academy set-up and hadn't played for anyone else! He only actually played 5 or 6 games making the numbers up for the Wakey Senior Academy under Gary Thornton after Karl Harrison released him halfway through our season.
It would be interesting to find out who his agent is. I certainly have my suspicions rolleyes.gif

Edited by HaroldShand, 10 December 2009 - 08:32 PM.

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#5 The Baby Faced Assassin.

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 08:30 PM

QUOTE (Bob Fowler @ Dec 10 2009, 08:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Just a guess but I see Morrison as moving to the front row and adding more mobility to the pack in that position. Matty Dale could also be used there as well but I fancy Spears to cover that position as well, although I would have relished the sight of Houston and Morrison on at the same time , that's not now going to happen. I do believe that daryl will use Finn more as a hooker, although as Mark says he is a recognised Scrum Half. Our main problems last season stemmed from the fact that our three quarters didn't make the difference in attack that we needed and it took the play offs before we seemed to adjust our style of play to "bully" the other teams into making mistakes. This season we could well have the players to make the breaks, we know Steele can back up what we need to see is a good fast courageous wingman, I don't know anything about Nate Brown so I can't comment Sam Smeaton has the courage, he just needs to learn how to position himself in defence , although he did well last season. I'm not downhearted at teh squad as I feel it has more go forward qualities about it, I just hope it has the stoppem qualities as well.


Bob I agree with you that Morrison and possibly Matty Dale may cut it at prop but I think Spears would be out of his depth at prop. He is excellent in defence and runs strong out wide but taking the ball in first receiver I reckon he is too light weight and would end up battered and certainly can't see him off loading in the tackle? We need a recognised prop IMO are even better a couple in light of Ouso moving on dry.gif

#6 marklaspalmas

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 10:34 AM

I'd agree with Bob too in that at least one of the second rowers will do a prop's job this year.

Thanks to Harold too for his input.

Re. Finn. I know I have developed a (unjust) reputation for insisting on him being a scrum-half, not a hooker. Ive no doubt he will be tried, and has the ability to be successful at acting halfback (the hooker's role on attack). It's just that defensively we're going to ask him to get through a lot of work in that position.

I'd like another specialist prop and a hooker.

Then again, I'd like a Ferrari too.

We'll just have to wait and see what Santa brings.

 

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#7 gazza77

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 01:18 PM

QUOTE (marklaspalmas @ Dec 10 2009, 05:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So, looking at the players who've left, NINE of whom (Barker,McLocklan, Hirst, Pryce, Haughey, Fallon, Kirk, Harris, Houston) we could reasonably suggest were first team regulars/squad men at the end of last season.

We've signed FOURTEEN new players, but only three of them were playing regular first team rugby last year. Then there's the two Papuan internationals. The other nine come from SL U21 teams, and as such are a bit of an unknown quantity/risk. I think it's be a bit unrealistic for more than two or three of them to hold down first team places.

SO the squad would look a bit like this:

FIRST TEAM

1. Ian Hardman FB
2. Jon Steel W
3. Sam Smeaton W
4. Larsen Marabe C
5. Tommy Saxton C
6. Jessie-Joe Parker C
7. Kyle Briggs SO
8. Andy Kain SH
9. Liam Finn SH

10. Stuart Dickens P
11. Tony Tonks P
12. Jack Lee H
13. Iain Morrison SR
14. Matty Dale SR
15. Tim Spears SR
16. Ross Divorty SR
17. Jon Grayshon SR
18. Jamie Field SR

U21s

Nate Brown W
Liam Welham C
Michael Coady C
Chris Parker SO
Danny Naughton SH
Aaron Dobek SH
Tommy Lynch P
Gareth Swift H
Dane Manning SR
Jodie Sheriffe SR
Danny Allen LF

The players in bold are the ones I think we'd most need to step up to first team level. I really don't know enough about any of them to tell who's going to make the grade.

So, do the numbers add up?

I think they probably do, though we look a bit light in the front row.

Do you agree?









I know there's another thread on the full squad, but I wanted to make a separate point.


If any of our 2nd rows were to move forward to prop, personally I would expect it to be Ross Divorty.

I also think that some of the players that Mark has listed as U21 will be nearer the first team than he thinks. I can't see that for example Leeds would have seen sending their fringe players on loan to us to play reserve grade as a great benefit, when they were already playing in Leeds' own reserve side.

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#8 Tex Evans Thigh

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 01:34 PM

Coady was a first team regular for Donny last season so would expect him to be in with a shout. I definately expect Danny Allen to be in there along the way and Dane Manning fromwhat Ive heard about him.

Morrison is definately a prop these days in fact I think his squad number was 8 at Widnes. Agree with Gazza that Divorty will also be used at prop along with Spears.

Marabe can play wing apparently as will Tommy Saxton at some stage I expect. I think youll see a team something like:

Hardman
Steel Parker Marabe Saxton
Briggs Kain
Dickens Lee Morrison
Grayson Dale
Field/Allen

The bench will the be a mobile forward bench with Finn or Lee. So say Spears, Divorty, Tonks, Finn. People like Manning, Coady etc will fill inas injury/form dictates.
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#9 jamescolin

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 03:30 PM

QUOTE (Tex Evans Thigh @ Dec 11 2009, 01:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Coady was a first team regular for Donny last season so would expect him to be in with a shout. I definately expect Danny Allen to be in there along the way and Dane Manning fromwhat Ive heard about him.

Morrison is definately a prop these days in fact I think his squad number was 8 at Widnes. Agree with Gazza that Divorty will also be used at prop along with Spears.

Marabe can play wing apparently as will Tommy Saxton at some stage I expect. I think youll see a team something like:

Hardman
Steel Parker Marabe Saxton
Briggs Kain
Dickens Lee Morrison
Grayson Dale
Field/Allen

The bench will the be a mobile forward bench with Finn or Lee. So say Spears, Divorty, Tonks, Finn. People like Manning, Coady etc will fill inas injury/form dictates.

Have we enough bulk upfront? Take Dickens and Tonks away and we seem to be lacking there. Also having met the PNG players I can't see
Marabe being big enough for centre. He is a tiny fellow. Standoff maybe. Briggs to centre.

#10 Rarefrith

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 04:50 PM

QUOTE (jamescolin @ Dec 11 2009, 04:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Have we enough bulk upfront? Take Dickens and Tonks away and we seem to be lacking there. Also having met the PNG players I can't see
Marabe being big enough for centre. He is a tiny fellow. Standoff maybe. Briggs to centre.


Marabe doesn't look small on those clips, and those clips don't look like Marabe when you see his world cup picture! Is it the same bloke?


#11 Paul Gibbins

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 07:17 PM

QUOTE (Rarefrith @ Dec 11 2009, 04:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Marabe doesn't look small on those clips, and those clips don't look like Marabe when you see his world cup picture! Is it the same bloke?


The way he charges full tilt towards the defence with no fear for his or their safety i don't think we need to worry about his size, lets just hope he's got the nouse to give the wngers the good ball whenever possible.
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#12 marklaspalmas

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Posted 12 December 2009 - 09:42 AM

QUOTE (gazza77 @ Dec 11 2009, 01:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I also think that some of the players that Mark has listed as U21 will be nearer the first team than he thinks. I can't see that for example Leeds would have seen sending their fringe players on loan to us to play reserve grade as a great benefit, when they were already playing in Leeds' own reserve side.


Did you read what I wrote? rolleyes.gif


 

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#13 gazza77

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Posted 16 December 2009 - 10:14 AM

http://www.pontefrac...ve-a.5914700.jp

I guess this answers the question as to what cover we have in the front row...

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#14 Tex Evans Thigh

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Posted 16 December 2009 - 02:15 PM

QUOTE
I can't see
Marabe being big enough for centre. He is a tiny fellow. Standoff maybe. Briggs to centre.


Come on Colin you can do better than that!

Menzie Yere and Stanley Gene arent tall fellas either, I think youll be surprised. Why you would want to play someone at stand off just because of their size Im not sure and Briggs certainly aint a centre.

Marabe may well play on the wing I think him and Saxton will be battling for the centre/wing position and will be interchangeable.
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#15 GAZ1983

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Posted 16 December 2009 - 04:04 PM

QUOTE (Tex Evans Thigh @ Dec 16 2009, 02:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Come on Colin you can do better than that!

Menzie Yere and Stanley Gene arent tall fellas either, I think youll be surprised. Why you would want to play someone at stand off just because of their size Im not sure and Briggs certainly aint a centre.

Marabe may well play on the wing I think him and Saxton will be battling for the centre/wing position and will be interchangeable.

an influencial bird told me yesterday that marabe is viewed as a winger n jp as loose fwd /centre...and prycy was "unlucky" to be released cos wingers now number marabe,steel,saxton + one other.and the "bird" was VERY influencial!!!




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