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INTRERNATIONAL REPRSESENTATION


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#21 gingerjon

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 04:01 PM

QUOTE (l'angelo mysterioso @ Jul 26 2010, 04:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think you'll find the relay event is
and countrys send athletics teams to championships, olympic games and so on.


As Michael Johnson says: nobody grows up dreaming of winning the relay.

And countries may send them but it's indivdual athletes competing for individual medals.

There might be three Jamaicans in the 100m final but they're not running for team gold but for individual glory.
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#22 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 04:01 PM

QUOTE (marklaspalmas @ Jul 26 2010, 04:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't right care what other sports do, but that Ottey situation is not right (though she must be an incredible athelete).


it doesn't bother me much mark
but it surely means that the old 'no other sport but ours does this and we are a laughing stock' mantra is irrelevant.
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#23 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 04:03 PM

QUOTE (gingerjon @ Jul 26 2010, 05:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
As Michael Johnson says: nobody grows up dreaming of winning the relay.

And countries may send them but it's indivdual athletes competing for individual medals.

There might be three Jamaicans in the 100m final but they're not running for team gold but for individual glory.

maybe maybe not.
let's assume you are right.
why should it be different?

it's a game. It isn't international diplomacy or anything.
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#24 Futtocks

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 04:14 PM

QUOTE (Lee @ Jul 26 2010, 04:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I gathered that but off all the places to go, why Slovenia?


Quote from the lady herself: "There was this big fuss (in Jamaica) because people said 'you're too old' and I thought fine, if I'm too old I'll find another country where I'm appreciated"

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#25 nadera78

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 04:35 PM

Willie Manu was born and raised in Australia, as a teenager he played for the Junior Kiwis, then as an adult played for Tonga and now seems to want to play for England. That in itself tells you all you need to know about his motivation in all of this; he'd play for anyone who offered him a game at the highest level of our sport.

This is also demonstrated in the statement his club released last week. Manu talked about the challenge of playing against the best in the world, etc, etc. At no point did he say anything about this being his home, being settled here, considering himself one of us, wanting to give something back, or anything else approaching a statement of commitment. He simply wants to play test RL and will turn out for whoever will give him a game.

To my mind, he has no right to pull on an England jersey. As a point of principle it would be fundamentally wrong.
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#26 hindle xiii

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 05:26 PM

QUOTE (l'angelo mysterioso @ Jul 26 2010, 12:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't go for the idea of countries in that big a way.

Only because when you were growing up there was Pangea. biggrin.gif wink.gif

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#27 deluded pom?

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 06:14 PM

QUOTE (Dave T @ Jul 26 2010, 04:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Actually, aside from the usual suspects like Jones, Moore etc. who find fault out of nothing then most of the complaints come from RL fans.

I remember when the 2008 WC was approaching, there was all sorts of negativity from many RL fans about the fact that the Scotland and Ireland squads were made up of players with English and Aussie accents, yet their local press didn't care less. They are used to interviewing their sports stars and them having an Aussie accent, yet we have a huge chip on our shoulders about it.

Don't agree with changing nation mind, IMHO Manu should be nowhere near the squad.



It doesn't bother me one iota about the make up of the Scottish and Irish squads Dave as long as they are eligible by the rules and haven't played for anyone else prior. You and I had this discussion when Bridge dumped Ireland and played for England.

Edited by deluded pom?, 26 July 2010 - 06:15 PM.

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#28 Lee

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 06:37 PM

QUOTE (Futtocks @ Jul 26 2010, 05:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Quote from the lady herself: "There was this big fuss (in Jamaica) because people said 'you're too old' and I thought fine, if I'm too old I'll find another country where I'm appreciated"



Getting there but why there?

Why not say England?


A lot of Yorkshiremen believe that when God created the world, he made it with perfect balance.
He balanced the hot areas with the cold areas. the dry areas with the wet areas.
And, in creating Yorkshire, he created the most glorious place on earth - full of majestic beauty and sporting giants.........and for balance he created....... Lancashire.

#29 Dave T

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 06:48 PM

QUOTE (deluded pom? @ Jul 26 2010, 07:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It doesn't bother me one iota about the make up of the Scottish and Irish squads Dave as long as they are eligible by the rules and haven't played for anyone else prior. You and I had this discussion when Bridge dumped Ireland and played for England.

Absolutely agree, but there were plenty of League fans who did kick up a stink and talked the game and theWC down due to it.

Changing nation is a farce.

What next, are we going to put Matt King in the centres for England this year?

#30 Lee

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 06:53 PM



Didnt Pat Richards turn England down cos our Australian friend "felt" more Irish?


A lot of Yorkshiremen believe that when God created the world, he made it with perfect balance.
He balanced the hot areas with the cold areas. the dry areas with the wet areas.
And, in creating Yorkshire, he created the most glorious place on earth - full of majestic beauty and sporting giants.........and for balance he created....... Lancashire.

#31 Lounge Room Lizard

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 06:56 PM

For me the Sporting World is a joke. Should just be Born in the country or has a Parent or Grandparent who came from the Nation. And you can only represent ONE Nation in ANY SPORT! People like Ottey, Manu etc for me have no real tie or pride in the nation they want to represent. The Residency ruling is a joke that is abused. If we must have it then should be something like 10 or 15 years Residency not just a couple of years like now! I would love for the RLIF to be stronger on this area but sadly expect no change.

#32 marklaspalmas

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 07:20 PM

QUOTE (l'angelo mysterioso @ Jul 26 2010, 05:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
it doesn't bother me much mark
but it surely means that the old 'no other sport but ours does this and we are a laughing stock' mantra is irrelevant.


Oh yes, that's tishtosh. Like I said, other sports don't right bother me.

There's loads of people who have parents of different nationalities, are born in one place but live in another, 'feel' they are a certain nationality, etc. All fine in my book.

But..

As far as RL is concerned...

Pick your country. Stick with it. All your career.

 

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#33 petero

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 09:32 PM

QUOTE (l'angelo mysterioso @ Jul 26 2010, 04:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think you'll find the relay event is
and countrys send athletics teams to championships, olympic games and so on.


I thought you stated you didn't do Countries? Funny that, as the World is constituted by them.
Some sort of internationalist are you, pray tell do you go to support England R/L against AustraliaR/L, or contend to be a complete neutral on the matter?

You cannot have it both way's, or can you?


#34 gingerjon

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 08:34 AM

QUOTE (Lee @ Jul 26 2010, 07:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why not say England?


She's not that bothered about the Commonwealth Games.
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#35 Steve May

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 08:43 AM

QUOTE (l'angelo mysterioso @ Jul 26 2010, 09:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It's disguting isn't it?
Perhaps someone shoiuld tell 50 year old Jamaican Merlene Ottey who will now represent Slovenia in the Olympics. She took part in the 1980 Moscow Olympics.
Athletics in terms of geographical spread and numbers is one of the biggest sports on earth. They don't have abeef with it. Good for them


50 years old is knocking on for a sprinter.

Other than that I'm right with you. The story here is "Slovenian athlete represents Slovenia" and is therefore a non story.


That's me.  I'm done.


#36 Steve May

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 08:50 AM

QUOTE (gingerjon @ Jul 26 2010, 04:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The important bit being that they now cannot play for any other country.


Which seems grotesquely unfair given that they can still go on and become citizens of another country with all the rights and responsibilities that implies.


As far as I'm concerned you should be eligible to play for any country you like provided you have a valid passport for that country. I'd have a "cup-tied" rule to prevent you playing for two countries in the same tournament. Other than that, let people play for the country or countries they belong to.


I'm totally comfortable with Willie Manu playing for this country if he's got a UK passport. My only problem with Maurie Fa'asavalu was that when he played for GB he wasn't a UK citizen.

That's me.  I'm done.


#37 gingerjon

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 08:52 AM

QUOTE (Steve May @ Jul 27 2010, 09:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
As far as I'm concerned you should be eligible to play for any country you like provided you have a valid passport for that country.


I disagree with you but at least that would be consistent and fairly easy to check.

It wouldn't however stop the Scotland/Wales/England/Ireland interchange which could all be done on the same passport.
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#38 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 09:22 AM

QUOTE (petero @ Jul 26 2010, 10:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I thought you stated you didn't do Countries? Funny that, as the World is constituted by them.
Some sort of internationalist are you, pray tell do you go to support England R/L against AustraliaR/L, or contend to be a complete neutral on the matter?

You cannot have it both way's, or can you?
not in a big way I don't. I detest nationalism, I think patriotism is a con.
when England/GB play australia, I want england/gb to win because it is good for rugby league. many Australians think this.
my point relates to the mantra that rugby league is a laughing stock because it allows players to play for more than one country, and clearly thiss is not true, because one of the main sports on the planet does this: rightly or wrongly. Personally it doesn't bother me that much.
Edit: By the way, what's this about 'not doing countrys'. Don't put words into peopples' mouths. I said no such thing.

Edited by l'angelo mysterioso, 27 July 2010 - 09:24 AM.

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#39 nadera78

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 10:46 AM

QUOTE (Steve May @ Jul 27 2010, 09:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Which seems grotesquely unfair given that they can still go on and become citizens of another country with all the rights and responsibilities that implies.


As far as I'm concerned you should be eligible to play for any country you like provided you have a valid passport for that country. I'd have a "cup-tied" rule to prevent you playing for two countries in the same tournament. Other than that, let people play for the country or countries they belong to.


I'm totally comfortable with Willie Manu playing for this country if he's got a UK passport. My only problem with Maurie Fa'asavalu was that when he played for GB he wasn't a UK citizen.


Ice Hockey has a similar rule, whereby you need to be a citizen of the country you play for. If a player changes nationality, having never played for his first country, then he needs to prove he has played two consecutive years in the domestic competition of his new country. If he has already played internationally before switching then this needs to be four years.

I could probably live with that.

btw Willie Manu is not a UK citizen.
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#40 Shadow

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 11:07 AM

QUOTE (l'angelo mysterioso @ Jul 27 2010, 10:22 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
my point relates to the mantra that rugby league is a laughing stock because it allows players to play for more than one country, and clearly thiss is not true, because one of the main sports on the planet does this: rightly or wrongly. Personally it doesn't bother me that much.


I think you'll find that in fact both Rugby League and Athletics have laughable international eligibility policies.

Hope this helps.
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