103 replies to this topic

[PhillH]

The fact this rumour and debate now occurs on an annual basis just re-emphasises the need for this issue to be sustainably addressed in order for the club to have any meaningful chance to grow. Personally I don't see any alternative to development of a new facility if the club sees its future as a meaningful part of life for residents of M27. Yes some of the remaining captive audience will stay loyal wherever matches take place (even if it happened to be in Darwen no doubt), but the numbers continually decrease every year and are approaching an unsustainable level - what is the strategy to attract in new followers and new sponsors? How can such a strategy be properly enacted without some stability of location?

Amidst this continual strife, the club has lost the ability to sell itself. Whilst some on here seem to think otherwise, the fact is that nobody is obligated to follow the club. If they are part of the Swinton community the crucial question is - why should they care about the club?

It is a bit sad if the management of the club is only looking at this again because Sedgeley Park wants to put the rent up. Rather than focussing on year-by-year hand-to-mouth survival will the club ever have sufficient confidence to see development of a ground as part of a new vision for its future? If not, what does the future of the club look like?

Some of the speculation this time around is not fully informed:

The Ted Ward / Kevin Henry era has well and truly ended at Darwen FC, which is now under entirely new management. East Lancashire Lions is not a name you will find amongst the Conference this season. Thus the Anchor Ground is surely very unlikely to be in the running at all, as it appears the Kidds no longer even have strong links, particularly after the uproar the idea caused first time around.

The Willows is not owned by Salford City Reds anymore. This brings another dimension.

I am sure the Council would prefer to have Moor Lane or ultimately Barton as candidates, but both have significant shortcomings. I cannot see Barton being viable in any event for the Lions, Moor Lane might be feasible medium term if it can be sufficiently developed but the key relationships would have to be totally rebuilt and Salford City FC were never happy co-tenants.

Jonty is probably unaware that Swinton Lions reserves played at Radcliffe Borough during the era of the first team playing at Gigg Lane.

Broughton Park RUFC is getting there, but not yet well enough developed.

Silver Street in Irlam has escaped mention; another ground the Lions have used in the past for reserve matches. The football club has gone through major financial strife in the meantime so I don't know what that site looks like nowadays. Poorly located for Swinton Lions' purposes though.

Over on the eastern side of Manchester there's quite a few options, but none would really give a basis for sustainable future growth.

[mark richardson]

And all this based on a text from someones mate?
Can Sedgely truly want around £6k per game?!

[duffymoon]

And all this based on a text from someones mate?
Can Sedgely truly want around £6k per game?!

One of my work colleagues is a member at Sedgley and he told me they are struggling financially like everybody else so it seems ludicrous that they would demand such an outrageous amount.As I remember the last time we negotiated a new lease Oldham and Salford were making use of Park Lane as well as ourselves .Perhaps theyve received an offer from Manchester United.

[mark richardson]

I agree. They charge us an amount which we obviously cant afford and so we leave and they get nowt.
This whole thread makes little sense and everyones falling out!

[STU WILLY]

I agree. They charge us an amount which we obviously cant afford and so we leave and they get nowt.
This whole thread makes little sense and everyones falling out!

The agreement for the willows is 95% done. This information is not rumour and has come from inside the salford club.

[juliancaine]

The agreement for the willows is 95% done. This information is not rumour and has come from inside the salford club.

another nail in the swinton lions coffin if we go and play games at the willows the crowds will drop even more, be better going to radcliffe borough or better still get agecroft up and running, i would hate to put money into the pinks/godliman watson homes coffers

Edited by juliancaine, 12 August 2010 - 02:41 PM.

[juliancaine]

another nail in the swinton lions coffin if we go and play games at the willows the crowds will drop even more, be better going to radcliffe borough or better still get agecroft up and running, i would hate to put money into the pinks/godliman watson homes coffers

ps i forgot to add what about the old school site at wardley wasnt that muted a a possibility for a site for swinton a while back and hasnt been mention for a bit

[PaulT]

ps i forgot to add what about the old school site at wardley wasnt that muted a a possibility for a site for swinton a while back and hasnt been mention for a bit

The Wardley site is green belt and the council made pretty clear that was a no no.

For the Willows, forgetting the Swinton/Salford rivalry, for the short term, I think it's a good idea. It's closer to home and people know where it is. (We also have a 100% record there playing as the 'home' side)

I don't think attendances will drop further due soley to the reason of us moving to the Willows. As previously mentioned in this thread, beggars can't be choosers and the fans understand that.

We would probably get a few Salford fans at the game as well so if anything, we may see a slight increase in attandances.

[dinosore]

The Wardley site is green belt and the council made pretty clear that was a no no.

For the Willows, forgetting the Swinton/Salford rivalry, for the short term, I think it's a good idea. It's closer to home and people know where it is. (We also have a 100% record there playing as the 'home' side)

I don't think attendances will drop further due soley to the reason of us moving to the Willows. As previously mentioned in this thread, beggars can't be choosers and the fans understand that.

We would probably get a few Salford fans at the game as well so if anything, we may see a slight increase in attandances.

If the move to the willows does become a reality it may be worthwhile offering Salford season ticket holders a reduced price you may just convert a few who are cheesed off with the super league dross.

[duffymoon]

If the move to the willows does become a reality it may be worthwhile offering Salford season ticket holders a reduced price you may just convert a few who are cheesed off with the super league dross.

Any move to the willows could only be temporary so that beggars the question where do we go after that???? IF and its a big IF the move to the willows was short term pending a move to Agecroft then I think most fans would accept that.What worries me is that its the start of another nomadic existence drifting from ground to ground.

[Blue Monkey]

If the move to the willows does become a reality it may be worthwhile offering Salford season ticket holders a reduced price you may just convert a few who are cheesed off with the super league dross.

"Super League dross". Yes, that's exactly what it is. A few seasons ago when I went to watch the Lions play at Keighley there was a man with his young son who were clearly Leeds fans due to the replica Leeds jersey he was wearing. I said to him at half time, "What's a Leeds fan doing at this game then? His reply which I will never forget was, "I've come to watch rugby league as it should be played". And I know what he meant. SL players are nearly all ATHLETES playing the game whilst the "lower" leagues have players who are more like FOOTBALLERS (rugby footballers). Ask yourself, when did you see a super league match where players used side steps, swerves, changes of pace and sheer brilliant footballing genius to score? Hardly ever I bet. It's all about physical strength and robotic rugby. There don't have the flare like the good’uns had 40 years ago and certainly not the brains either.

[GLENNGARY]

If the willows rumour is true then I believe this is a precursery move before a permanent move to Barton. Due to the current financial situation in the country there is now a shortage of monies to invest in schemes like Agecroft.the banks are no longer lending, the government is making councils cut back on expenditure at an alarming rate, which when all added up makes Agecroft a no no. Another problem which could have serious consequencies for the club is the Rugby league council are tightening up the rules for pro teams.to remain a super league team , there ground must have a minimum capacity of 10,000 and average minimum crowd of 2,800. they will more than likely clamp down on championship and championship 1 as well.So grounds like Sedgely and Radcliffe and moor lane would not be deemed good enough. So moving to Barton on a permanent basis would allow Swinton to continue into the future and if and when we won prpmption the ground would meet the criteria needed.

[GLENNGARY]

If the willows rumour is true then I believe this is a precursery move before a permanent move to Barton. Due to the current financial situation in the country there is now a shortage of monies to invest in schemes like Agecroft.the banks are no longer lending, the government is making councils cut back on expenditure at an alarming rate, which when all added up makes Agecroft a no no. Another problem which could have serious consequencies for the club is the Rugby league council are tightening up the rules for pro teams.to remain a super league team , there ground must have a minimum capacity of 10,000 and average minimum crowd of 2,800. they will more than likely clamp down on championship and championship 1 as well.So grounds like Sedgely and Radcliffe and moor lane would not be deemed good enough. So moving to Barton on a permanent basis would allow Swinton to continue into the future and if and when we won prpmption the ground would meet the criteria needed.

[GLENNGARY]

Iwould also like to point out that we would not be using Salfords ground we would be using our own. the ground would be owned by Salford council and peel holdings and would be leased by Salford and ourselves and being a true Swinton fan I will follow them to the Willows ,Barton and Timbuctoo if needs be, I want the Lions to survive and if we can't come back to m27 then I look at Bolton Wanderers and the Reebock and realise that Barton isn't that far away.

[eclecticsheep]

Very Perceptive post Blue Monkey...Superleague is aspiring to the AFL type, pumped up athletes smashing into each other not always good to watch actually!

[Blue Monkey]

Iwould also like to point out that we would not be using Salfords ground we would be using our own. the ground would be owned by Salford council and peel holdings and would be leased by Salford and ourselves and being a true Swinton fan I will follow them to the Willows ,Barton and Timbuctoo if needs be, I want the Lions to survive and if we can't come back to m27 then I look at Bolton Wanderers and the Reebock and realise that Barton isn't that far away.

Share with the Pinks at Barton? God forbid! If other close neighbouring clubs can each have their very own ground within their town's boundaries then I firmly believe we should too. Hull and Hull KR, Batley and Dewsbury, Leeds and Hunslet, Oldham and Rochdale, Castleford, Wakefield and Featherstone, Whitehaven and Workington, Warrington and Widnes - all these close neighbours and local rival clubs don't put up with the indignity of having to share with one another. Roll on the Lions coming home to the beloved borough of Swinton and Pendlebury, good old M27!!!

[duffymoon]

If the willows rumour is true then I believe this is a precursery move before a permanent move to Barton. Due to the current financial situation in the country there is now a shortage of monies to invest in schemes like Agecroft.the banks are no longer lending, the government is making councils cut back on expenditure at an alarming rate, which when all added up makes Agecroft a no no. Another problem which could have serious consequencies for the club is the Rugby league council are tightening up the rules for pro teams.to remain a super league team , there ground must have a minimum capacity of 10,000 and average minimum crowd of 2,800. they will more than likely clamp down on championship and championship 1 as well.So grounds like Sedgely and Radcliffe and moor lane would not be deemed good enough. So moving to Barton on a permanent basis would allow Swinton to continue into the future and if and when we won prpmption the ground would meet the criteria needed.

I cannot see any future for Swinton Lions playing out of Barton!.As you rightly state the Barton project is funded by Salford City Council and Peel Holdings and I would imagine they will want a decent return in terms of rent for using the facility.We would be no better off than we are at Sedgley Park.From what ive heard Agecroft is still a possibility,lets hope theres something forthcoming from the club very soon otherwise the conjecture and speculation will only esculate.

[Blue Monkey]

Roll on, the Lions IN Agecroft!!!

[Shizonamy]

Does anyone know when this meeting about the new ground is to take place, I've heard a decision regarding Agecroft hinges on it?

[mark richardson]

The agreement for the willows is 95% done. This information is not rumour and has come from inside the salford club.

Well I for one hope this information which remains rumour at this point is true. A move to the Willows will be okay I think. And as for it affecting crowds,well they cant get worse because theres only the diehards who go whatever left.