Jump to content


Rugby League World - Grand Finals Issue

RUGBY LEAGUE WORLD - THE GRAND FINALS ISSUE - OUT 17 OCT OR DOWNLOAD IT NOW!
Try our Fantastic 4-Issue Bundle Offer:
For just £14, a saving of 10% on the regular cover price, you’ll get:

The Grand Finals Issue (out 17 Oct) – Grand Final drama from both hemispheres plus Four Nations preview
The Four Nations Issue (out 21 Nov) – Fantastic coverage of the Four Nations tournament down under
The Golden Boot Issue (out 19 Dec) – A look back at the 2014 season plus the big reveal of the winner of the Golden Boot
The 2015 Season Preview Issue (out 23 Jan) – How will your team perform in 2015? We preview every club.


League Express

Podcast

Photo
- - - - -

POTB Markers in No Mans land


  • Please log in to reply
21 replies to this topic

#1 Allan Marsden

Allan Marsden
  • Banned
  • 433 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 11:25 AM

This applies to every team but IMO this is a huge blight on RL and negates lots of attacking opportunities and is far more importabt than being pedantic about touching the ball with your boot.

Player marking © One opponent may take up the position immediately opposite the tackled player.
Acting halfback (f) A player of each team, to be known as the acting halfback, may stand immediately and directly behind his own player taking part in the play-theball and must remain in this position, until the play-the-ball movement is complete.

Currently we have a large gap between tackled player and marker and then the acting halfback can be 5 yards behind preventing scooting or team targetting the spce between the POTB and the A markers.

#2 West Country Eagle

West Country Eagle
  • Coach
  • 5,825 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 01:08 PM

I'm a pedant, but what annoys me is the tackled player moving off the mark. You're supposed to play the ball where you're tackled, not two or three yards left or right, or forwards. It screws up the markers (they take up a position in front and when he moves they're not square) and often leads to the attacking team getting a pen. That's irritating.


Bristol Sonics Rugby League
2007 & 2008 West Midlands RLC Champions
2008 RLC Regional Grand Finalists
2008 RLC Team Of The Year
2011 RLC Midlands Premier Champions
www.bristolsonics.com

� Stupid Questions League Winner 2004 �

#3 tonyXIII

tonyXIII
  • Coach
  • 5,012 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 01:29 PM

Sometimes it is hard to play the ball exactly where you were tackled because one of the tacklers is in the way. If a player then steps to the right or left (or even takes a step forward), I think the refs need to use their discretion and allow some leeway to the markers. If they are standing in the right place and are only 'not square' because the player playing the ball has moved, then don't penalise them. Obviously, any tackler still lying on the floor can't take part in the next play. If we start penalising every infringement at the ptb, we'll slow the game down too much.

Rethymno Rugby League Appreciation Society
Founder (and, so far, only) member.


#4 RS

RS
  • Coach
  • 612 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:16 PM

Funny you should mention this now as I saw Tomkins in that position yesterday. He was the only marker and was back about 7 yards which should be an offside call for not being 10 metres as he was too far from the PTB to be a marker.

#5 Allan Marsden

Allan Marsden
  • Banned
  • 433 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:24 PM

I is not one player, one team but happening in every match. IMO the marker should be able to touch the shoulder of the person playing the ball and the dummy half should be ablwe to touch the back of his marker teammate.

#6 Exiled Rhino

Exiled Rhino
  • Coach
  • 107 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:24 PM

QUOTE (RS @ Sep 13 2010, 04:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Funny you should mention this now as I saw Tomkins in that position yesterday. He was the only marker and was back about 7 yards which should be an offside call for not being 10 metres as he was too far from the PTB to be a marker.


Is there a requirement for how close you have to be to the ptb? I thought, as long as you were in line, i.e. standing square, you could be any distance back from the tackled player.

What's the rule?

#7 Dave T

Dave T
  • Coach
  • 15,240 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:28 PM

TBH I don't have an issue with this. I don't see why the markers should have to be so close to the ptb. If you make them stand right in the face of the bloke playing the ball then it will just make the ptb more untidy IMHO, and isn't helpful to the marker as he will have the attacker right up into him.

Also, anything that negates the scoot from acting half is good for me. Scooting should be on the back of a good quick ptb, and not as standard by compressing the markers to leave a gap.

#8 my missus

my missus
  • Coach
  • 4,844 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:29 PM

QUOTE (RS @ Sep 13 2010, 04:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Funny you should mention this now as I saw Tomkins in that position yesterday. He was the only marker and was back about 7 yards which should be an offside call for not being 10 metres as he was too far from the PTB to be a marker.

i also spotted this yesterday, only it was burrows standing about 5yds back a couple of times.
also to stop all the penalties why not allow just one marker.

What does it mean
This tearjerking scene
Beamed into my home
That it moves me so much
Why all the fuss
It's only two humans being.


#9 RP London

RP London
  • Coach
  • 12,678 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:30 PM

if you had it where the marker could touch the shoulder of the tackled player and then there is any movment by the tackled player in any direction or even his bending down to play the ball will obstruct the marker getting around him to try to get to the dummy half. pens galore there..

as long as they are in line i dont see a major issue with it.. again a quick play the ball catches them out of position, a dominant tackle allows the players to get to the positions they want to be in.. its all about dominating the tackle.

#10 Dave T

Dave T
  • Coach
  • 15,240 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:30 PM

QUOTE (Exiled Rhino @ Sep 13 2010, 04:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Is there a requirement for how close you have to be to the ptb? I thought, as long as you were in line, i.e. standing square, you could be any distance back from the tackled player.

What's the rule?

Not sure on the rule exactly (too late in the day to be searching the RFL site) but it is an offence to be too far from the player playing the ball. I know it is something that Warrington have been warned about in the past, although refs will generally have a word rather than penalising this.

#11 Allan Marsden

Allan Marsden
  • Banned
  • 433 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:33 PM

One of the best attacking areas is the gap between the POTB and the A defenders. By standing in no mans land contrary to the rules you negate that option.

#12 RP London

RP London
  • Coach
  • 12,678 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:34 PM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 13 2010, 03:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
One of the best attacking areas is the gap between the POTB and the A defenders. By standing in no mans land contrary to the rules you negate that option.


but what is the rule about distance away and where is it and how many are contraveening this..

#13 Dave T

Dave T
  • Coach
  • 15,240 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:36 PM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 13 2010, 04:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
One of the best attacking areas is the gap between the POTB and the A defenders. By standing in no mans land contrary to the rules you negate that option.

If there has been an effective tackle and a controlled ptb, there really shouldn't just be a gap as standard. The defence (IMHO) should be able to fill that gap. It is up to the attack to win the collision and then make the gap by beating the markers, or creating their own gaps elsewhere in the defensive line.

RL often gets criticism for being too attacking-focused so not sure I agree with this criticism about favouring the defence.

#14 Allan Marsden

Allan Marsden
  • Banned
  • 433 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:39 PM

QUOTE (RP London @ Sep 13 2010, 04:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
but what is the rule about distance away and where is it and how many are contraveening this..


Player marking

One opponent may take up the position immediately opposite the tackled player. A player of each team, to be known as the acting halfback, may stand immediately and directly behind his own player taking part in the play-theball and must remain in this position, until the play-the-ball movement is complete.




#15 Exiled Rhino

Exiled Rhino
  • Coach
  • 107 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:42 PM

QUOTE (Dave T @ Sep 13 2010, 04:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Not sure on the rule exactly (too late in the day to be searching the RFL site) but it is an offence to be too far from the player playing the ball. I know it is something that Warrington have been warned about in the past, although refs will generally have a word rather than penalising this.


Interesting. This year? It's not something I've ever come across before.



#16 Dave T

Dave T
  • Coach
  • 15,240 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:44 PM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 13 2010, 04:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Player marking

One opponent may take up the position immediately opposite the tackled player. A player of each team, to be known as the acting halfback, may stand immediately and directly behind his own player taking part in the play-theball and must remain in this position, until the play-the-ball movement is complete.

And that is where the problem lies, there is no standard distance quoted. If it was stated that these two players must be within 5m of the ptb then that would make sense, as it is, the word 'immediately' is used and this could be 1m or 5m.

#17 Dave T

Dave T
  • Coach
  • 15,240 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:45 PM

QUOTE (Exiled Rhino @ Sep 13 2010, 04:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Interesting. This year? It's not something I've ever come across before.

Not sure actually. Was a TV game so you could hear what the ref was saying, he warned Westwood (I think) that he is risking being offside and as 2nd marker he needs to be closer.

I don't think we got penalised for it though.

#18 RP London

RP London
  • Coach
  • 12,678 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 04:08 PM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 13 2010, 03:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Player marking

One opponent may take up the position immediately opposite the tackled player. A player of each team, to be known as the acting halfback, may stand immediately and directly behind his own player taking part in the play-theball and must remain in this position, until the play-the-ball movement is complete.


so the answer is there isnt a rule.. there is no where there saying a distance just that it is immediatley and directly behind and immediatly opposite.. neither is a figure neither is definitive.. immediatly opposite is just directly infront etc.. immediatly opposite could be 3 miles away but in a direct line..

#19 Exiled Rhino

Exiled Rhino
  • Coach
  • 107 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 04:51 PM

QUOTE (Dave T @ Sep 13 2010, 04:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Not sure actually. Was a TV game so you could hear what the ref was saying, he warned Westwood (I think) that he is risking being offside and as 2nd marker he needs to be closer.

I don't think we got penalised for it though.


Thanks. Looks like it has been reffed pragmatically for ages, then.

"Immediately" gives the ref the back-up to get players back into what everyone is used to and would consider normal practice if they start taking the p, as with Westwood above.

I suspect if it continues and is identified as a trend by commentators and fans there may be a focus from the refs, commonly called a "clampdown". Not really a problem if a few penalties for a few weeks sorts it out.

#20 MattSantos

MattSantos
  • Coach
  • 1,383 posts

Posted 13 September 2010 - 05:05 PM

QUOTE (West Country Eagle @ Sep 13 2010, 02:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm a pedant, but what annoys me is the tackled player moving off the mark. You're supposed to play the ball where you're tackled, not two or three yards left or right, or forwards. It screws up the markers (they take up a position in front and when he moves they're not square) and often leads to the attacking team getting a pen. That's irritating.


You're right, there needs to be a balance. The best players always play the ball right as they're diligent about the small things. Morley, Peacock, Ellis etc all do this.

The attackers get every decision. For example, you can tackle someone around the legs, textbook and be penalised for not letting go straight away.






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users