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World's ten best full backs


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#41 shrek

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 09:15 PM

QUOTE (ParisSurtout @ Sep 15 2010, 10:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't know which games of the NRL you have been watching, but any games that involve Sydney Roosters, the West Tigers and Canberra Raiders in recent weeks have been anything but boring. Last Saturday's West Tigers vs Sydney Roosters was an epic for the ages.

Try watching Canberra vs West Tigers on Friday morning (Josh Dugan vs Wade McKinnon) and Sydney Roosters vs Penrith Panthers Saturday morning (Lachlan Coote vs Anthony Minichiello) and then you will be better informed (and hardly likely to be bored).


I've watched plenty, they really just don't do it for me, probably more a lack of interest in who wins rather than a reflection on the quality of the product, give me a Super League, Championship of NCL game any day of the week.

#42 Derwent

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 09:52 PM

QUOTE (ParisSurtout @ Sep 15 2010, 09:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I cannot recall any time since the 1950s when Great Britain had a full back who was in the same class as the best from Australia.


Paul Charlton
Joe Lydon
Jonathan Davies

As good as, if not better, than any of their Australian counterparts.

Workington Town. Then. Now. Always.


#43 Gixxer

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 10:19 PM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 15 2010, 11:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
There seems to be a clique here that think they own the forums. wink.gif

You're absolutley right, the culprits can't stand anyone passing anything that might even mildly resemble a critque of the ESL. Unfortunately though, they thought it didn't show.
Its all because some people recognise that the Aussie NRL is a far superior competition and has more skilful, celebrated and renowned players than the ESL.
Me I couldn't possibly comment !!

#44 boxhead

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 02:28 AM

QUOTE (Derwent @ Sep 15 2010, 10:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Paul Charlton
Joe Lydon
Jonathan Davies

As good as, if not better, than any of their Australian counterparts.


Lydon was not that special at Fullback, the fact he was on the Wing or the bench for half is representative career tells you that.


#45 1976PMJwires

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 06:35 AM

QUOTE (Gixxer @ Sep 15 2010, 11:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You're absolutley right, the culprits can't stand anyone passing anything that might even mildly resemble a critque of the ESL. Unfortunately though, they thought it didn't show.
Its all because some people recognise that the Aussie NRL is a far superior competition and has more skilful, celebrated and renowned players than the ESL.
Me I couldn't possibly comment !!



Out of the closet again.

Another Kleenex fan of the Super Human NRL.

You suggested i was a "cyber" bully laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif and now you jump on the back of someones comments getting involved.

NRL v's ESL in the main is about opinions........this forum is UK & European, if i wanted to discuss "SUPERMEN" i would go onto the NRL forum.

I just wish the MODS would tidy this up. tongue.gif

#46 Tonka

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 08:31 AM

I'm sure I have read before that there are not hugely greater player pools in Aus to over here, however, it always strikes me that they have far more players to choose from.

Assuming we accept that all the full backs PST listed are (classy!) world class full backs (which I think most of them are), there are more of them than there are British full backs to choose from at all in SL.

I started watching RL in about 1993-94 and I first noticed this when I looked at the two test team lines ups for Wembly in 1994 (GB v Aus). I remember thinking that, man for man, we were as good as them, but that for most positions we often didn't have a second or third equally good player, whereas the Aussies just did. This hasn't changed. The irony is not lost on me that we did win that one with JD's dart to the corner - I nearly wet my pants when he scored and I think I'm going to look it up on You Tube after this.

As for coaching styles, natural ability etc, I don't have a clue what we coach them here but the better Aussie full backs seem to me to run with a greater [vision/pace/freedom/fluidity?]. The closest in modern times to me is Sam Tomkins, who can beat one or three defenders at will and plays with his head up. Defence questionable yet though for an international. The first player to wow me like that was Brett Mullins, who just seemed to be able to rip holes everywhere. Steve Menzies used to do a similar thing and the two of them in the same team was very dangerous. Real strike players.

I agree with the first post that we don't have the abundance of class from full back, but I don't know why. I suspect coaching is a factor.

I'll also hop off the fence and say that the NRL is the superior competition, although I think that if you plonked 4 or 5 SL teams in the NRL they would learn to swim pretty quickly. Or perhaps drown a horrible gargling death.

The inequality between us and Aus makes victories all the sweeter, but they are too few and far between. My number one (sporting) wish is to see the Four Nations tournament very evenly contested each time and GB v Aus reinstated, with GB taking the spoils at least a third of the time. Scoring some great long range tries from full back.













#47 CGD

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 11:19 AM

Love your work, Paris.

#48 Kenilworth Tiger

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 11:27 AM

QUOTE (terrywebbisgod @ Sep 15 2010, 11:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Care to enlighten us with names?


Alan Marsden, Parksider, Parissurtout and Millman
Now then, it's a race between Sandie....and Fairburn....and the little man is in........yeees he's in.

I, just like those Castleford supporters felt that the ball should have gone to David Plange but he put the bit betwen his teeth...and it was a try

Kevin Ward - best player I have ever seen

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#49 indomitable

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 11:31 AM

QUOTE (Millman @ Sep 14 2010, 09:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You're such a bore!

It is a long time since the age when we could pop over the border into Wales, and pick up a world star for full back. Too many to name and boring, but who can forget Lewis Jones? Also a major star in Australia although getting on in age at that time. Incidentally they were all reared on the mud in Wales, which makes a nonsense of dry grounds being good for stardom.

#50 Red Willow

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 11:58 AM

So reading this.....

Next season Salford will have the best fullback in Super league laugh.gif laugh.gif

#51 topchef

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 01:27 PM

QUOTE (Red Willow @ Sep 16 2010, 12:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So reading this.....

Next season Salford will have the best fullback in Super league laugh.gif laugh.gif




The best and bravest fullback in defence on the planet is, by a country mile, Gary Broadbent!

Moff
Go Cumbria!

   


#52 ParisSurtout

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 10:59 PM

QUOTE (topchef @ Sep 16 2010, 09:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The best and bravest fullback in defence on the planet is, by a country mile, Gary Broadbent!



Regardless of whether or not that statement is true, or even meant seriously....Full backs don't only need to defend.

Paul Wellens can defend, and take the high ball, and back up his team's attackers when they break the defensive line. But Wellens cannot beat a man with footwork and speed, and he cannot outpace most other opposing backline players.

Edited by ParisSurtout, 16 September 2010 - 11:02 PM.

Le rugby a treize, c'est moi!

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#53 Hannibal

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 05:57 AM

Wrong forum.



#54 The Parksider

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 06:15 AM

QUOTE (Kenilworth Tiger @ Sep 16 2010, 12:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Alan Marsden, Parksider, Parissurtout and Millman


ohmy.gif I know for a fact that I don't own the forum.

I ordered my staff to boot you off and it turned out they weren't my staff.


#55 The Boy Saint

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:30 AM

QUOTE (ParisSurtout @ Sep 15 2010, 09:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Australia was not really renowned for brilliant full backs until Clive Churchill, "The Little Master," appeared in the 1950s. But he was out on his own with no competitor within Australia. Of his contemporaries only the Frenchman Puig Aubert could challenge Churchill's status.

Then came the 1960s, when the old boring standby, Keith Barnes (Balmain's brilliant goal kicker and solid defender, but hopeless attacker) got shunted aside by Les Johns, Graeme Langlands and Ken Thornett. The talent at full back in Australia was so rich that they moved the now Immortal Langlands to centre, so as to accommodate Thornett and Johns in the Kangaroo squads.

Australia has always had several top class attacking and defending fullbacks in their system. Russell Fairfax and Graham Eadie in the 1970s, Garry Jack and Gary Belcher in the 1980s, Gary Belcher, Dale Shearer, Andrew Ettingshausen, Tim Brasher, Robbie O'Davis, and Darren Lockyer in the 1990s, Darren Lockyer, Brett Hodgson, Anthony Minichiello and Matt Bowen in the first half of the 2000s.

I cannot recall any time since the 1950s when Great Britain had a full back who was in the same class as the best from Australia. But since 2005 it has been a glut of full back talent in Australia.

Today I think we can agree that Clint Greenshields and Brett Hodgson are the best attacking full backs in Super League. So I could have named at least twelve, perhaps fifteen Aussie full backs who were better than the best in England. There must be something wrong with the junior recruitment, the way the game is played, or the physical environment (weather and grounds), that keeps England from producing abundant great talent in this playing position.


Jonathan Davies - easily


QUOTE (Derwent @ Sep 15 2010, 10:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Paul Charlton
Joe Lydon
Jonathan Davies

As good as, if not better, than any of their Australian counterparts.



Beat me to it


#56 boxhead

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:58 AM

QUOTE (The Boy Saint @ Sep 17 2010, 12:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Jonathan Davies - easily





Beat me to it



I think comparing players from different eras is not easy to do or make an Apples for Apples comparison.
If you look at the three English/Welsh players mentioned what was their try scoring record like at Test level compared to Caps?
Compare any of them to say Billy Slater.
Then it is Apples and Oranges.

Even back then Garry Jack was over 50% tries per game
Anthony Minichiello was over 50% tries per game.
Pretty sure when Lockyer was a Fullback it would be better than most as he holds nearly every record in the NRL and has been the games Premier player for a decade with 33 tries from 51 Tests in all positions

Edited by AndyCapp, 17 September 2010 - 12:02 PM.


#57 roughyedspud

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 10:53 PM

QUOTE (AndyCapp @ Sep 15 2010, 11:36 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
A Test standard Fullback should have rock solid defence and positional sense, the ability to return the ball in broken play and chime into the attack is the other half of his resume.
Show me a top full back that has bad defence? (don't say Slater, he has had some clangers but in general his try saving is better than nearly anyones.)


i will say slater actually......

his ridiculous attempt to keep the ball in play cost australia the world cup final..he's done that a few times too...

sam burgess turnstiled him in the 4nations final...christ he did'nt even get a finger on him..

and if his positioning is that good why is he always so late that he has to slide into tackles with his feet??


trust me billy slater is'nt in the australia team for is defensive abilities....as long as he knows where to stand when the attacking team have kicked on the last tackle so he can run it back at em'....thats all the selectors are bothered about...

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#58 boxhead

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:49 PM

QUOTE (roughyedspud @ Sep 17 2010, 11:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
i will say slater actually......

his ridiculous attempt to keep the ball in play cost australia the world cup final..he's done that a few times too...

sam burgess turnstiled him in the 4nations final...christ he did'nt even get a finger on him..

and if his positioning is that good why is he always so late that he has to slide into tackles with his feet??


trust me billy slater is'nt in the australia team for is defensive abilities....as long as he knows where to stand when the attacking team have kicked on the last tackle so he can run it back at em'....thats all the selectors are bothered about...



What has his attempt to keep the ball in play got to do with his defence?
You know when you have the ball in your hands you are in attack?

Burgess beat him, isn't he allowed to be stepped or make a mistake?

Australia have attacking players throughout their back line any one from Half back to Fullback is capable of scoring from nearly anywhere on the field, I doubt Slater is picked just for his attack, its his complete game.
Slaters defence is equal to Haynes or Stewarts or Hunts and all are better than any Fullback England has fielded in recent years.

Trust you? I don't trust your opinion Spud you think Second rowers and Centres are the same and are inter changeable at the drop of a hat.
biggrin.gif


#59 Hannibal

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:56 PM

QUOTE (AndyCapp @ Sep 18 2010, 12:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
What has his attempt to keep the ball in play got to do with his defence?
You know when you have the ball in your hands you are in attack?

Burgess beat him, isn't he allowed to be stepped or make a mistake?

Australia have attacking players throughout their back line any one from Half back to Fullback is capable of scoring from nearly anywhere on the field, I doubt Slater is picked just for his attack, its his complete game.
Slaters defence is equal to Haynes or Stewarts or Hunts and all are better than any Fullback England has fielded in recent years.

Trust you? I don't trust your opinion Spud you think Second rowers and Centres are the same and are inter changeable at the drop of a hat.
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Kleenex?

#60 roughyedspud

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Posted 18 September 2010 - 12:40 AM

QUOTE (AndyCapp @ Sep 18 2010, 12:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
What has his attempt to keep the ball in play got to do with his defence?
You know when you have the ball in your hands you are in attack?


when to attack when to defend?....he could have run the ball into touch,that would have been the clever thing to do....instead he threw it back into play with no australian near him and 2 kiwis chasing him....unsurprisingly a kiwi picked it up to score.....shocking DEFENCE by the worlds best fullback


QUOTE (AndyCapp @ Sep 18 2010, 12:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Burgess beat him, isn't he allowed to be stepped or make a mistake?


one on one with a lumbering 110kg forward and he could'nt lay a finger on him.....shocking defence by the worlds best fullback

noticed you did'nt bring up his ninja sliding tackles..maybe thats cos he's always a yard behind play when it comes to defending??

QUOTE (AndyCapp @ Sep 18 2010, 12:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Australia have attacking players throughout their back line any one from Half back to Fullback is capable of scoring from nearly anywhere on the field, I doubt Slater is picked just for his attack, its his complete game.
Slaters defence is equal to Haynes or Stewarts or Hunts and all are better than any Fullback England has fielded in recent years.


yes they are,you won't find argument with me about that...my point is the likes of hayne,slater,stewarts and Khunt* are'nt picked for their defensive abilities..that is'nt the first thing that crosses the minds of the selectors or the fans...its all attack,attack,attack..

where as here in england the first thing people thinks is "yeah but what about his defence".....

*the Khunt was actually a very good defender..probably the best allround attack and defending FB of the 4 mentioned

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