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Maurice Lindsay article


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#61 Allan Marsden

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 08:56 PM

QUOTE (Matt J @ Sep 23 2010, 05:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
He was head of the organisation (RFL) and representative of the string pullers (Sky) that denied them, his legacy lives on then... he's a ##### of the highest order.


Classy rolleyes.gif

#62 Allan Marsden

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 09:08 PM

QUOTE (Keith T @ Sep 23 2010, 07:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Maurice Lindsay thinks he revolutionised the game which is different to reality. He was merely a pawn or a puppet of Murdoch in his quest to gain power of Australian Rugby League in the pay to view war with Kerry Packer.

Murdoch needed to get the British game on board to strengthen his case and Lindsay happened to be in the right position at the time this came about. It could have been anyone but it happened to be Lindsay.

It was Lindsay who wanted a team in Paris and he did everything in his power to ensure that he got that team. It was this that caused so many problems for Workington Town because come hell or high water he was determined that Paris would finish above Town at the end of the season and so not be relegated.

Paris that season had over 70 players and most of them were not British. Two players were supposed to be coming to play for Town but were somehow "waylaid" and ended up at PSG. John Kear at the time was employed as the Director of Coaching Development at the RFL and he was sent across to PSG to, in his own words on Sky, to ensure that PSG finish above Workington. Next Lindsay himself and Harry Jepson went over to Paris and became directors of PSG and of course we won't mention the dubious win that Paris had in the last match of the season which saw Town relegated.

The following season it was Oldham's turn to compete with PSG but in the end the debts at Paris got so high that the project was brought to a halt with debts of over 2 million.

Later was it not Lindsay who left his position as CEO of the RFL to take on a similar position with SLE because he needed to get away from "the dross and the drivel" as he referred to clubs lower than SL clubs.


I think it is fair to say as you do that RL in Britain was a pawn and benefitted Murdoch in his war over the NSWRL / NRL. Whomever was in control of British RL was a pawn with the biggest prize being Australia. However, it is fair to say that Lindsay, like him or loathe negotiated a damn decent deal for British RL.

The irony to me is you are blaming Lindsay for everything bad that happened to your clubs yet we still have Expansion / French Clubs placed above the heartlands, we now have franchising and no relegation / pronmotion. So whether you are Workington or Keighley, the so called RL Family are even more brutal than Lindsay ever was. Maybe Lindsay was too soft? Maybe Lindsay is to blame for everything post Lindsay? I honestly have no idea why fans think like they do. Maybe the blame culture is a comforting thought to hold onto whilst your clubs still get a raw deal.

I know this much having got a fantastic deal from SKY, the RL Family became every man for himself as clubs looked after themselves (I guess Lindsay was to blame rolleyes.gif ) and little money was set aside for the whole game. The whole game being everything, amateur and professional). Whatsmore respected and knowledgeable figures like Harry Edgar talk of awful mismanagement with Cumbrian professional clubs and the seeming reluctance of Cumbria to come together to form a collective Cumbrian Franchise whilst retaining the feeder club. Perhaps Harry Edgar knows nothing too rolleyes.gif

Edited by Allan Marsden, 23 September 2010 - 09:08 PM.


#63 Matt J

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 09:09 PM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 23 2010, 09:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Classy rolleyes.gif


Thats all you have then?

He's a disgrace to the sport.

Cummins Out.


#64 Allan Marsden

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 09:13 PM

QUOTE (Matt J @ Sep 23 2010, 10:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Thats all you have then?

He's a disgrace to the sport.


It wasn't deserving of anything else Matt.

Like anybody Lindsay has done things well and things badly BUT his good makes him a credit to the sport and somebody who did far more than you or I ever did.

I often think many fans need to just go and watch amateur RL. The concept of professional sport is too difficult for them to comprehend and perhaps not alevel of sport that they can enjoy.

#65 Matt J

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 09:36 PM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 23 2010, 10:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It wasn't deserving of anything else Matt.

Like anybody Lindsay has done things well and things badly BUT his good makes him a credit to the sport and somebody who did far more than you or I ever did.

I often think many fans need to just go and watch amateur RL. The concept of professional sport is too difficult for them to comprehend and perhaps not alevel of sport that they can enjoy.


laugh.gif Hail Lindsay or you cannot understand professional sport, beautiful.

The Lindsay era was dire, only a small handful benefited, but still, congratulate him on getting a sky deal anybody half competent could have done also.


Cummins Out.


#66 Keith T

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 10:07 PM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 23 2010, 10:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Whatsmore respected and knowledgeable figures like Harry Edgar talk of awful mismanagement with Cumbrian professional clubs and the seeming reluctance of Cumbria to come together to form a collective Cumbrian Franchise whilst retaining the feeder club. Perhaps Harry Edgar knows nothing too rolleyes.gif


As a matter of fact Harry Edgar and I exchanged letters in the Whitehaven News back in 1995 about the proposed merger of Haven and Town and Harry was the main man at that time that was against the idea. He led the call for Haven to remain a community club and for a time later he actually became a member of the board at that club, so I wonder how he would describe that period of management.

Town came out of SL with no parachute payment and several players on SL size contracts. The crowds dropped and they couldn't afford the salaries and from there it was all downhill. The bottom came when we went in to administration with the double jeopardy of losing out on the Sky payments that lower league clubs were paid at that time. We went nearly two seasons without any Sky money at the very time when the club needed it most to help pay the debts. All in all I think our board of directors have done quite well to the point where we show a small profit in the last published accounts. Maybe Harry is a bit out of date, eh!!!

I remember when .............................

"It is impossible not to feel a twinge of sympathy for Workington Town, the fall guys this season for the Super League's determination to retain it's European dimension, in the shape of Paris. While the French have had every assistance to survive, the importance of having a flagship in a heartland area like West Cumbria has been conveniently forgotten." - Dave Hadfield - Independent 25th August 1996.


#67 JohnM

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 10:21 PM

QUOTE (Matt J @ Sep 23 2010, 10:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Thats all you have then?

He's a disgrace to the sport.



"Don't tell him, Pike!" laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif

#68 1976PMJwires

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 06:31 AM

QUOTE (1976PMJwires @ Sep 23 2010, 07:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
A lot of the club's fans were aggrieved with the way Maurice ran the club in his second stint, believing that he was still 'living in the 80's' and that he should leave.

Due to the increasing pressure on Lindsay from the fans for him to step down


And that is Wigan fans wanting him out!!




I knew Allan Marsden wouldn't comment on this one, after all it was his own fans wanting him out biggrin.gif biggrin.gif biggrin.gif

Wigan fans had simply had enough, that's how good the man was laugh.gif laugh.gif wink.gif

So plain and simple, we want lindsay out!

Edited by 1976PMJwires, 24 September 2010 - 06:32 AM.


#69 JohnM

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:27 AM

So what? Churchill was kicked out by the post war electorate, just as the forum's fave party, Labour, has been. Does not mean to say they were never any good in the first place.

#70 dkw

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 11:53 AM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 23 2010, 09:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And you do?

Your whole premise / you whole stance is based on what ifs / maybe / could have beens. You have zero proof.

No it isnt, it is based on fact and truth as this did actually happen, see Keiths comments for further proof of how he was more than happy to see Town take a fall to save his beloved PSG. Where do I say what if/maybe/could have been. You simply cant see anything wrong with him can you, did he used to tip you well on your paper round or something.

#71 Padge

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 07:59 PM

QUOTE (Bostik Bailey @ Sep 22 2010, 11:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well the RFL Accounts were not signed of for a few years after Uncle Mo left, His finacal leacay to the RFL 'appeared' not to be too rosey. (ditto Wigan).

You are confusing Mo with Jack Robinson, Robinson was the problem at Wigan, Mo had been long gone. I am sick of posting the realities of why the Nat West Bank wouldn't deal with Jack the lad.


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#72 Allan Marsden

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:09 PM

QUOTE (Matt J @ Sep 23 2010, 10:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
laugh.gif Hail Lindsay or you cannot understand professional sport, beautiful.

The Lindsay era was dire, only a small handful benefited, but still, congratulate him on getting a sky deal anybody half competent could have done also.


Lindsay and the rest of the gang of 4 raised the profile of RL in this country so EVERYBODY benefitted. That period saw British RL come closest to closing the gap on Australia and but for Lee Jackson taking a dummy and a last gasp dummy we could have won an Ashes. Individually, Lindsay was the man that revitalised the WCC to give several clubs some of the greatest moments in their history.

I understand that does not suit your bitterness hence why I think you are far better suited to watching Amateur RL.

Edited by Allan Marsden, 24 September 2010 - 09:23 PM.


#73 dkw

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:13 PM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 24 2010, 10:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Lindsay and the rest of the gang of 4 raised the profile of RL in this country so EVERYBODY benefitted.

They didnt, they really didnt.

#74 Allan Marsden

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:20 PM

QUOTE (dkw @ Sep 24 2010, 12:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
No it isnt, it is based on fact and truth as this did actually happen, see Keiths comments for further proof of how he was more than happy to see Town take a fall to save his beloved PSG. Where do I say what if/maybe/could have been. You simply cant see anything wrong with him can you, did he used to tip you well on your paper round or something.


You clearly either do not read or cannot comprehend DKW

Firstly. I have PRAISED and CRITICISED Maurice Lindsay. His first stint at Wigan was a fanrastic success. They say never go back and that may be right. He did very well initially but it turned sour and he became a puppet for Dave Whelan and the handling of Mike Gregory will always be criticised by Wigan fans including myself.

RE Workington. READ and UNDERSTOOD proof is objective evidence that you can support. What you and Keith are putting forward is pure subjective conjecture. Cumbrian Clubs have for a long time been mismanaged. Maurice Lindsay did not panic and boot Peter Walsh or is that another Lindsay conspiracy theory? As I said previously NO Lindsay and yet the RFL / the member clubs continued and still do to look after themselves and shaft anybody else including Cumbrian clubs. The RL family has never really existed.

RE Wigan / Maurice Lindsay. What fans of other clubs need to understand is that Wigan's success was BUILT by 4 MEN all were vital. Lindsay as the front man bore the brunt of the spite and jealousy from other RL fans Yet he was 1 of 4. The jealous / bitter have no idea how important Jack Hilton was, why because he was in the background. Yet Hilton, Rathbon, Robinson and Lindsay TOGETHER was the key. Lindsay and Robinson on their own both had limitations and never achieved the same heights.

Wigan was built by 4 MEN

#75 Allan Marsden

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:22 PM

QUOTE (dkw @ Sep 24 2010, 10:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
They didnt, they really didnt.


If you belong to anything that has a bigger national / media profile then when you knock on doors and ask for investment / sponsorship it is far far easier. Are you telling me it is not DKW?

If you think it is (IT IS BTW) then Wigan made that happen from 1985-1995.


#76 Segovia Carpet

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:27 PM

QUOTE (JohnM @ Sep 24 2010, 10:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So what? Churchill was kicked out by the post war electorate, just as the forum's fave party, Labour, has been. Does not mean to say they were never any good in the first place.

Well Churchill was good - no GREAT - whereas I dont concur with some `Forumites favourite` political Party that they were ever good - except on spending other peoples money.

#77 Segovia Carpet

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:30 PM

QUOTE (Padge @ Sep 24 2010, 08:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You are confusing Mo with Jack Robinson, Robinson was the problem at Wigan, Mo had been long gone. I am sick of posting the realities of why the Nat West Bank wouldn't deal with Jack the lad.

Was it something to his Antique business padge?

#78 Keith T

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 10:20 PM

How come everything you put forward Alan Marsden is fact and yet whatever I have said is subjective conjecture? Stick to subjects that you may know something about and don't try to be the knowall that you come across as.

Walsh was never chased from Town he left of is own accord and went to Hull. He is still a very good friend of Town and came over this year for a re-union with old mates at the club. He also keeps an eye out for any budding players down under for us, so stick to what you think you know about and you may be respected otherwise your talking a load of b******s..


I remember when .............................

"It is impossible not to feel a twinge of sympathy for Workington Town, the fall guys this season for the Super League's determination to retain it's European dimension, in the shape of Paris. While the French have had every assistance to survive, the importance of having a flagship in a heartland area like West Cumbria has been conveniently forgotten." - Dave Hadfield - Independent 25th August 1996.


#79 dallymessenger

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 02:14 AM

it seems fans of clubs hurt by SL are blaming lindsay for everything

Rupert Murdoch offered 80 million ish pounds for a game that was bankrupt.

not just small clubs like keighley but big clubs too had shot finances

what was lindsay supposed to do, say no, we wont accept the 80 million unless you allow keighley into SL.

on balance what he did was do lots of very good things for RL.

frankly without the whole SL thing your game really would be dead.

#80 dkw

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 08:42 AM

QUOTE (Allan Marsden @ Sep 24 2010, 10:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
RE Workington. READ and UNDERSTOOD proof is objective evidence that you can support. What you and Keith are putting forward is pure subjective conjecture. Cumbrian Clubs have for a long time been mismanaged. Maurice Lindsay did not panic and boot Peter Walsh or is that another Lindsay conspiracy theory? As I said previously NO Lindsay and yet the RFL / the member clubs continued and still do to look after themselves and shaft anybody else including Cumbrian clubs. The RL family has never really existed.

Booted Walsh? When did that happen, I must have slept through that as I thought he had went to Hull with our blessing. Oh well, i`m sure you know much more about the club I have followed since I was about 6 what with you being super clever and everything.




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