221 replies to this topic

[waistline expansionist]

toynbee beat him to it!

So now let's hear Labour remind itself and all other opinion formers how little most people have shared in the boom. Labour doesn't need the votes of the top 2% so long as the other 98% see fairness done - but Labour does need to get the facts across, as most people are woefully ignorant of where they stand on the earnings scale. The richest 2% will protest because they think their earnings are ordinary, refusing to believe most people earn so little. Sadly, even the poor think they are nearer the middle than they are.

In the same way that the Tories don't need the Labour client votes of the public sector.

However they do to some extent require sympathetic treatment from the Labour client voters at the BBC.

[tim2]

In the same way that the Tories don't need the Labour client votes of the public sector.

However they do to some extent require sympathetic treatment from the Labour client voters at the BBC.

nah, not when you've got Sky, The Times, Telegraph, Sun, Express and Mail who can blame it all on Gordon Brown and immigrants.

[chuffer]

I guess it could be argued if anyone stood by anything they said these days that for those who have kept a job and do have a mortgage they probably have more disposable income now than they did 2/3 years ago.

I have kept my job and have a mortgage.

I work in the private sector and have been subjected to a climate of fear for the last 2 yrs effectively waiting for the axe to fall whilst watching a multitide of colleagues pack up their desk and head for the dole queue.

As the sole breadwinner with a young family I have stayed on the same wage for over 2 years whilst the cost of living has continued to rise.... believe me I've looked for other jobs but the current economic climate has given employers the excuse to offer someone of my level lower wages than before and certainly lower than I'm on at the moment (competition for contracts means costs and wages have to come down etc etc)

So, no - am not better off now.....fixed rate is coming to an end soon so may well be better off in a couple of months but how long before interest rates begin to rise again?

[sam]

le mash

[BringbackGB]

I suppose it could be true, assuming you’re a career criminal eagerly anticipating the impending cuts to spending on police and prisons.

[JohnM]

Another 111 joblosses anounced in my area lastnight, I bet they don't agree with lord young.

and that gets right to the heart of the matter.

There are those in both the public and private sector (civil servants, teachers, NHS, firemen etc and large company employees in pharmaceuticals, IT companies such as IBM etc) who have never had it so good. Annual salary increases, increments, bonuses (no, not bankers profit-sharing bonuses but modest bonuses for meeting personal objectives), low interest mortgages, record house price increases (even allowing for recent falls, still double what they were 13 years ago). For all those, Young is right.

However, for those in the private sector affected by the recession who have lost their jobs, or gone on short time, or taken pay cuts, for the millions of lower paid public sector workers in the NHS, civil service etc who may line in rented private or social housing, or those on benefits trying to find jobs, Young is most definitely wrong and I'm glad he has gone.

Then there are the pensioners who have been victims of record rises in things like fuel costs and council taxes whilst the pensions , annuities and savings have crashed in value.

To the eternal shame of the Labour govt so many of you have idolised over the last 13 years, the gap between the have and have nots has got ever wider.

I reckon that on balance, about 70 % have never had it so good, and that about 30% have never had it so bad.

Blair and Browns decade long preoccupation with percentages, house price rises, taxes increased and the public sector had blinded them to what they have done to the less fortunate who they so proudly claim to stand for. Thank god they've taken their millions and run.

[bowes]

nah, not when you've got Sky, The Times, Telegraph, Sun, Express and Mail who can blame it all on Gordon Brown and immigrants.

Those factors are both more significant than the Conservatives. Youth unemployment went through the roof when we were still in boom time as soon as the EU expanded into Eastern Europe. Still certainly not the immigrants fault, but the fault of Labour setting the policy (not required by the EU) and the fault of companies prioritising immigrants for the majority of jobs

[shrek]

I have kept my job and have a mortgage.

I work in the private sector and have been subjected to a climate of fear for the last 2 yrs effectively waiting for the axe to fall whilst watching a multitide of colleagues pack up their desk and head for the dole queue.

As the sole breadwinner with a young family I have stayed on the same wage for over 2 years whilst the cost of living has continued to rise.... believe me I've looked for other jobs but the current economic climate has given employers the excuse to offer someone of my level lower wages than before and certainly lower than I'm on at the moment (competition for contracts means costs and wages have to come down etc etc)

So, no - am not better off now.....fixed rate is coming to an end soon so may well be better off in a couple of months but how long before interest rates begin to rise again?

We're in similar positions, I have two children, 2nd of which only arrived this week and for the foreseeable the wife won't be bringing much in, that said I know through choice that as of 21st January next year I have nothing lined up yet work wise.

You comment on the "climate of fear" is interesting, should that not always have been there? I have met so many people in the last couple of years who thought they were indispensable (and I don't mean big earners) lived to there means or just beyond, having a good time, only for it to come to a shuddering stop as in reality, the only safety net you have in permanent employment is your notice period and there various rules around consultation periods. I just don't think many have considered that as being a risk until recently though.

One thing I am seeing, whilst I work in the private sector, which I really don't like, is a whole raft of policy and culture change being driven through in the name of "the credit crunch" when in reality its nothing of the sort, its just being used as an excuse to drive personal agendas of individuals who don't have the balls to do it in there own name and stand there and justify it. Still what goes around comes around.

[chuffer]

You comment on the "climate of fear" is interesting, should that not always have been there? I

No, I firmly believe the "climate of fear" should not always have been there.

We give our time, skill and experience in exchange for a wage - that's a fair exchange in my opinion (naiive as that may be!!) ..... we should not have to feel like we're "lucky" to effectively be slaves in this whole ###### system.....

but you're right, there's many a decision being made at the moment which is done by excuse of "the credit crunch"

Congrats on the new arrival btw

[chuffer]

I suppose it could be true, assuming you’re a career criminal eagerly anticipating the impending cuts to spending on police and prisons.

[exxile]

No, I firmly believe the "climate of fear" should not always have been there.

We give our time, skill and experience in exchange for a wage - that's a fair exchange in my opinion (naiive as that may be!!) ..... we should not have to feel like we're "lucky" to effectively be slaves in this whole ###### system.....

but you're right, there's many a decision being made at the moment which is done by excuse of "the credit crunch"

Congrats on the new arrival btw

I'm going to be using this myself. Rather than go through the tedious procedures one now has to endure in order to sack the indolent and generally useless, I though I might invoke some downsizing in a few departments, even though we are making record sales and profits. I shall be keeping all those who actually put in the work and want to contribute to the general wellbeing.

[chuffer]

I shall be keeping all those who actually put in the work and want to contribute to the general wellbeing.

What about those who put in the work but don't care to be seen polishing your anus with their tongue?

[John Drake]

To the eternal shame of the Labour govt so many of you have idolised over the last 13 years, the gap between the have and have nots has got ever wider.

Is that because the poor got poorer, or because the already rich were able to get even richer faster, giving the lie to the notion that Labour governments always clobber them? Some might say 'if only they did!'

You're right though, Labour never does enough to help those at the bottom of society when in government. New Labour even less so. That's not to say they don't help them at all. The Tories are usually not quite so reticent to help 'their own' when in power. Labour could learn a valuable lesson from that.

[bowes]

Is that because the poor got poorer, or because the already rich were able to get even richer faster, giving the lie to the notion that Labour governments always clobber them? Some might say 'if only they did!'

You're right though, Labour never does enough to help those at the bottom of society when in government. New Labour even less so. That's not to say they don't help them at all. The Tories are usually not quite so reticent to help 'their own' when in power. Labour could learn a valuable lesson from that.

Labour were actually very bad for low earning British workers as they set punitive income tax rates while bringing in competition for jobs from huge immigration to allow businesses to drive wages and conditions down fast. Of course it's better if you're lucky to land a council job but they're not generally given on merit, they already know who they want most of the time

Edited by bowes, 20 November 2010 - 12:33 PM.

[l'angelo mysterioso]

I have kept my job and have a mortgage.

I sincerely hope for the sake of you andf yourt young family that it stays that way.

[l'angelo mysterioso]

I'm going to be using this myself. Rather than go through the tedious procedures one now has to endure in order to sack the indolent and generally useless, I though I might invoke some downsizing in a few departments, even though we are making record sales and profits. I shall be keeping all those who actually put in the work and want to contribute to the general wellbeing.

Billy Fisher rides again.
will you be using the ambrosia gun?

[Bitofaboogie]

Stuff like this really annoys me.

Lord Young apology over 'never had it so good'remarks

A politician says something that they clearly mean, then when they realise it has gone down like a bag of cold sick, issue some pathetic, insincere retraction. If they didn't mean it, they wouldn't have said it in the first place. The original comment just shows how divorced from reality some of them truly are, and the apology isn't worth the breath that was used to utter it.

Grrr.

Rich, Tory, out of touch, doesn't give a toss.

Nothing changes, seen it all before - we had this shower in the 1980's and some of us are still paying for it.

I said beore the election that the people of this country should think very carefully before electing Cameron and his chums, unfortunately they didn't think carefully enough and now, with the connivance of Nick Clegg (the most unprincipled man in British politics) we are stuck with them for the next five years.

The depradation that they are about to perpetrate will go down in infamy.

[Bitofaboogie]

I'm going to be using this myself. Rather than go through the tedious procedures one now has to endure in order to sack the indolent and generally useless, I though I might invoke some downsizing in a few departments, even though we are making record sales and profits. I shall be keeping all those who actually put in the work and want to contribute to the general wellbeing.

There's no need to keep proving that you are a c*nt, we all know it already.

Sorry, I forgot, you are a right-winger so you actually enjoy it don't you.

[l'angelo mysterioso]

There's no need to keep proving that you are a c*nt, we all know it already.

Sorry, I forgot, you are a right-winger so you actually enjoy it don't you.

he's nervous at the moment because ASDA have bought Netto out.

[Trojan]

Rich, Tory, out of touch, doesn't give a toss.

Nothing changes, seen it all before - we had this shower in the 1980's and some of us are still paying for it.

I said beore the election that the people of this country should think very carefully before electing Lord Snooty and his chums, unfortunately they didn't think carefully enough and now, with the connivance of Nick Clegg (the most unprincipled man in British politics) we are stuck with them for the next five years.

The depradation that they are about to perpetrate will go down in infamy.

Typo corrected