46 replies to this topic

[sam]

So no distinction between rioters that cause death and rioters that do not. Interesting take on it.

i'm not the one trying to justify the violent and illegal actions of a group of pondlife with the 'oh, no-one died' line.

[sam]

So no distinction between rioters that cause death and rioters that do not. Interesting take on it.

plus, the only distinction is the final outcome. if i'm in a football riot and i smack someone with a metal bar but that person lives i'm no better than someone at a student riot who smacks someone with a metal bar who is killed.

[Tiny Tim]

i'm not the one trying to justify the violent and illegal actions of a group of pondlife with the 'oh, no-one died' line.

Me neither, I wasn't trying to justify their actions, don't try and twist my words just because you have issues with students.


Lets be honest and admit this was your attempt to take the thread off topic and deflect the discussion away from the problems with hosting major soccer tournaments. There is already a thread to discuss your 'love' of students please use that one and try and stay on topic here.


Ultimately I would like neither set loose in my country, but forced to make a choice I would take a bunch of cross student over a bunch of football hooligans any day, clearly you wouldn't.

[Tiny Tim]

plus, the only distinction is the final outcome. if i'm in a football riot and i smack someone with a metal bar but that person lives i'm no better than someone at a student riot who smacks someone with a metal bar who is killed.

Were many people smacked with metal bars by students recently?

[sam]

Me neither, I wasn't trying to justify their actions, don't try and twist my words just because you have issues with students.

so you don't have an issue with students rioting and endandgering life?

Lets be honest and admit this was your attempt to take the thread off topic and deflect the discussion away from the problems with hosting major soccer tournaments. There is already a thread to discuss your 'love' of students please use that one and try and stay on topic here.

i'm well aware of the problems of hosting major football tournaments, though the ones i've seen recently seem to have been trouble free, i just find it highly amusing that people get all sanctimonious about the potential trouble while at the same time turn a blind eye, or even justify (no-one died) the exact same actions taken by another group of people.

Ultimately I would like neither set loose in my country, but forced to make a choice I would take a bunch of cross student over a bunch of football hooligans any day, clearly you wouldn't.

clearly? i'd be interested to know how you reached that conclusion.

[sam]

Were many people smacked with metal bars by students recently?

who knows, i wasn't there. perhaps the hooded pondlife were carrying them as they had a fence to mend, were using them as walking sticks or were simply collecting scrap metal for recycling. is it a new craze? i've been out of the country for a bit, are all the kids decked out in face masks and lengths of angle iron these days?

[l'angelo mysterioso]

hmmm..large groups of people involved in violence? are we talking football fans or student marches?

yeah, lets be glad the largest sporting event in the world, won't be coming to these shores.

public protest is legal and a good thing. Violence and destruction is illegal. People on the student protest who behaved illegally should be dealt with.

are you saying the illegal acts of one set of people justify the illegal acts of another? What odd logic.
I'm glad the largest sporting event in tyhe world isn't coming to these shores for purely selfish reasons; Not having a thug fest is only one of them

[Severus]

they are comparable. absolutely. large groups roaming the streets a number of which hell bent on violence and intimidation. lets not put the fire extinguisher aside, nor the hooded plebs carrying iron bars. or does a home counties accent give you carte blanche to wreak havoc on the streets? 153 arrests the other day at a student protest, 152? leeds banning orders...i think banning student protests is entirely justified to stop these hooligans in their quest for violence.

Words fail me.

It would be interesting to find out whether those people who have such anti-student views went to university themselves.

Edited by Severus, 03 December 2010 - 09:17 AM.

[Haloman]

they are comparable. absolutely. large groups roaming the streets a number of which hell bent on violence and intimidation. lets not put the fire extinguisher aside, nor the hooded plebs carrying iron bars. or does a home counties accent give you carte blanche to wreak havoc on the streets? 153 arrests the other day at a student protest, 152? leeds banning orders...i think banning student protests is entirely justified to stop these hooligans in their quest for violence.

No conclusions can be reached from the number of arrests. Over a hundred people were arrested last week (as reported in the Guardian), whilst their only crime was to be kettled for hours on end by the police during a peaceful public protest. They were arrested, photographed and released. The Met Police regularly do this to intimidate, not because there is an arrestable offence committed. It's time they were brought in line with the law, because they seem to think they operate outside it.

[Tiny Tim]

Words fail me.

It would be interesting to find out whether those people who have such anti-student views went to university themselves.

I am glad it is not just me wondering why somebody would take this thread so far off topic to have a go at students while completely ignoring the point in discussion. I also resent the implication that I somehow tried to justify the actions of the students who did behave illegally, I did nothing of the sort.

[JohnM]

Words fail me.

It would be interesting to find out whether those people who have such anti-student views went to university themselves.

given today's standards of educational attainment, I imagine that whilst some went to university themselves, others had their parents take them.

In terms of the World Cup, how England ever thought they would win is beyond me. I don't know why we even bothered. Russia is fine....tf they want to change their tax and labour laws just to make Fifa richer, that is their business. I'd be interested to see how Fifa squares its approach to homophobia ( see here with Qatar's, a place where homosexuality is illegal.

Edited by JohnM, 03 December 2010 - 01:49 PM.

[l'angelo mysterioso]

I am glad it is not just me wondering why somebody would take this thread so far off topic to have a go at students while completely ignoring the point in discussion. I also resent the implication that I somehow tried to justify the actions of the students who did behave illegally, I did nothing of the sort.

me an all

[l'angelo mysterioso]

given today's standards of educational attainment, I imagine that whilst some went to university themselves, others had their parents take them.

In terms of the World Cup, how England ever thought they would win is beyond me. I don't know why we even bothered. Russia is fine....tf they want to change their tax and labour laws just to make Fifa richer, that is their business. I'd be interested to see how Fifa squares its approach to homophobia ( see here with Qatar's, a place where homosexuality is illegal.

having met Sam, who is a nice guy by the way, I think he is a little old to have been educated under 'today's standards'. Being stupid isn't the preserve of the uneducated anyway.

There's no supping in Qatar either

[JohnM]

I didn't mean Sam. He's a great guy: educated, erudite and a much travelled DIY specialist.

[Trojan]

I didn't mean Sam. He's a great guy: educated, erudite and a much travelled DIY specialist.

And they said irony was dead

[Trojan]

I reckon the England bid was scuppered before it started. Blatter and Platini, the men who matter in FIFA apparently, hate the Premiership and its sky-high salaries. They regard it as a blot on the landscape of World Football. Presumably they (unlike most of British sport) are not owned by Murdoch and are determined to show it.

[sam]

public protest is legal and a good thing. Violence and destruction is illegal. People on the student protest who behaved illegally should be dealt with.

i quite agree.
people who attend football matches do so legally, whether it's a good thing is questionable, much like whether people attending any sporting event is a good thing. people who behave illegally at football matches should and are dealt with.

are you saying the illegal acts of one set of people justify the illegal acts of another?

no

I'm glad the largest sporting event in tyhe world isn't coming to these shores for purely selfish reasons; Not having a thug fest is only one of them

one of them? what other reasons are there?

[sam]

Words fail me.

It would be interesting to find out whether those people who have such anti-student views went to university themselves.

i'd be interested to find out whether you can point me in the direction of any anti-student views on this thread. what has whether someone went to uni got to do with anything? there was a thread not so long ago where you were decrying 'career politicians', i can only assume you had these views after being a politician yourself.

[sam]

I am glad it is not just me wondering why somebody would take this thread so far off topic to have a go at students

who's having a go at students?

the thread is about the world cup going to russia, one of the reasons given was this, by yourself

I suspect people have concerns about the violence and trouble that so often accompanies major soccer tournaments and with a certain element of the UK fanbase being that way inclined the potential was defintely there for things to become quite unpleasant.

yet, in the past few weeks we've seen huge groups of people taking to the streets of london committing 'violence and trouble', it seems that acting like plebs isn't just confined to football fans.

I also resent the implication that I somehow tried to justify the actions of the students who did behave illegally, I did nothing of the sort.

then you'll just have to resent away.

How many people killed in student protests in the UK?

[sam]

I didn't mean Sam. He's a great guy: educated, erudite and a much travelled DIY specialist.

am i?