28 replies to this topic

[Honor James]

HARRY JEPSON TROPHY 2012

The details have been released for the knockout stages of the Harry Jepson Trophy.

Sides from seven Tier 4 regions will contest the silverware which was previously played for by the Premier Division sides in the Rugby League Conference and is currently held by Parkside Hawks.

Commenting on the draw, 92-year-old Harry Jepson OBE - who as President of Leeds will be watching the Rhinos at Wembley today (Saturday) - commented, "One of the
highlights of my career in rugby league administration at all levels, is to have a trophy named after me that encompasses teams which sees the sport continue to develop geographically. That has always been a passion of mine from the days in 1934 when, as a schoolboy, I was privileged to meet the great Jean Galia and the first French tourists."

"The HJT Grand Final is one of the events I look forward to the most in the calendar and it is wonderful to see teams from as far apart as Edinburgh and Gloucestershire setting out on the road this time."

HARRY JEPSON TROPHY DRAW

Round One - Sunday 2nd September - 2.00pm
Game 1: Edinburgh Eagles (Scotland Premier) v Gateshead Storm (North East Premier)
Game 2: Northampton Demons (Midlands Premier) v Portsmouth Navy Sea Hawks (South East)
Game 3: Gloucestershire Warriors (West of England) v Bye
Game 4: London Skolars A (South Premier) v Bedford Tigers (East of England)

Semi Finals (Neutral Grounds) - Sunday 9th September
Semi 1: Winner Game 1 v Winner Game 2
Semi 2: Gloucestershire Warriors v Winner Game 4

Grand Final (Neutral Ground) - Sunday 16th September
Winner Semi 1 v Winner Semi 2

If both teams are in agreement games can be played on the Saturday

Phil Caplan
Tier 3 & 4 Media
RLEF Media Officer

Edited by Honor James, 26 August 2012 - 09:01 AM.

[PhilCarrington]

Why seven teams ? Surely they didn't design the competition so that there were an uneven number of qualifiers.

[bowes]

Why seven teams ? Surely they didn't design the competition so that there were an uneven number of qualifiers.

Noone from Wales could enter partly as the league collapsed and partly for RU pre season. Also noone from either of the South West divisions entered so they had to invite 4th place in midlands premier. Likewise London Skolars A were runners up in Premier South and Bedford were 3rd in East but the higher teams didn't want to enter. East is no surprise but Hammersmith Hillshoists not entering is concerning. Also very strange that the East and London and South East divisions enter their winners as they are not the top division in their region.

My personal belief is they'd have been better off letting the Midlands, South and North East run their premier divisions a few more weeks.

[PhilCarrington]

Hills Hoists are playing Elmbridge in the Challenge Trophy next weekend. That comp been dragging on for months, but "planning" has somehow led it to clash with the Harry Jepson, where dates have been set from the start of the season. Farcical, but this weekend's announcements from the RFL all seem to be like that.

[keighley]

It seems like the whole summer expansion competition which seemed to have been such a success is now drifitng and rudderless and in danger of collapse ( in Wales it seemingly has already done so ). If so many teams who have qualified for the Harry Jepson trophy don't want to compete in it, the question must be asked, should it continue ?

Why is the format for the competition being only announced now ? Was it not known before the season began ? From my point of view, as a fan looking from the outside and with no clear knowledge of what is going on, the whole set up seems disorganised and chaotic.

What is happening to this expsansionist format.? Is it time for a complete re evaluation before all progress that has been made is lost. ?

[bowes]

Hills Hoists are playing Elmbridge in the Challenge Trophy next weekend. That comp been dragging on for months, but "planning" has somehow led it to clash with the Harry Jepson, where dates have been set from the start of the season. Farcical, but this weekend's announcements from the RFL all seem to be like that.

Not sure how the Community Shield has been run so badly with nowhere to see results. But this clash is a joke and makes you wonder what the HJ Trophy is for if the winner of the strongest non heartland tier 4 division isn't in. If they ever successfully merge the midlands and south premiers into a tier 3 Conference South then the HJ Trophy would be more farcical as would the non heartland parts of the CS.

[bowes]

It seems like the whole summer expansion competition which seemed to have been such a success is now drifitng and rudderless and in danger of collapse ( in Wales it seemingly has already done so ). If so many teams who have qualified for the Harry Jepson trophy don't want to compete in it, the question must be asked, should it continue ?

Why is the format for the competition being only announced now ? Was it not known before the season began ? From my point of view, as a fan looking from the outside and with no clear knowledge of what is going on, the whole set up seems disorganised and chaotic.

What is happening to this expsansionist format.? Is it time for a complete re evaluation before all progress that has been made is lost. ?

The North East are doing a good job but need to be considered a proper northern league not a development one soon IMO. The problem is the RFL set the RLC up as a summer jolly for RU players but playing year round rugby isn't sustainable in the long run and players will always pick the sport that gives them 8 months of games over the one that gives them 3 months.

The midlands and south have the problem of having a handful of strong sides that they can't build a full league for as sides drop down a division after thrashings.

Edited by bowes, 26 August 2012 - 01:02 PM.

[keighley]

The North East are doing a good job but need to be considered a proper northern league not a development one soon IMO. The problem is the RFL set the RLC up as a summer jolly for RU players but playing year round rugby isn't sustainable in the long run and players will always pick the sport that gives them 8 months of games over the one that gives them 3 months.

That's good news about the North East. That area should have been made part and parcel of the major league areas from 1895 but was never properly supported due to insular thinking at HQ. I have read several encouraging articles about the progress made of such teams as Peterlee and Cramlington. Is any thought being given to making the season up there, and indeed nationwide, longer to further strengthen the teams.

It seems also that there are a number of fairly well established teams in the midlands, Northampton, Nottingham, Coventry, Telford and Leicester. Are they now running their own mini league after central control from the RL was seemingly abandoned.?

The London and greater London area seems to have retrenched. South London were looking to be a super team a couple of years ago but seem to have faded away. Kent Ravens came and went but apparently Medway are quite strong. Hemel, of course, are moving to CC1 and London Skolars have been there for some time and might be favourites for promotion higher, but the overall onwards and upwards progress in the area in recent years seems to have slowed

The Welsh collapse is tragic. Despite the various debacles at professional level, Wales looked to be a roaring success at amateur and student levels. Has this all been lost?

The Scottish league, which I would have guessed, if asked, to have been one of our weakest areas, seems to be relatively successful, but information is scanty.

The South West and Gloucester/Bristol area also seems to have some well established teams. They are even playing inter county fixtures between Devon and Cornwall but didn't want to enter the Jepson trophy. Are they too weak, too insular or , as you say, just a part time jolly for RU players.

The whole thing in the heartlands is confusing to me also. Now that much of BARLA has gone to summer, how do these previous summer conference teams from these areas mesh into the whole.?

The whole alphabet soup of competitions, Premier/ Conference, regional just mystifies me. I can't see the hierachal picture of it all.

Mr Bowes, you seem to have a handle on where all this is and maybe where it is going. If you care to enlighten me or comment generally of where things stand in all this, I would surely appreciate your sharing the knowledge.

To me, it seems like a great opportunity for meaningful expansion of the game is being squandered.

[bowes]

Wales and the deep South West is just RU players. The RFL are pulling out staff from the South West and may end up the midlands have to run it (or at least West of England which will include Valley Cougars, possibly may have to stretch to Devon unless they can save the division there). Wales has good juniors but mostly they are totally separate from open age even Valley Cougars run no juniors. Bridgend and Bonymaen were the only open age clubs with any juniors this year.

Midlands is better off self governed but yeah a mini premier and 2 regional division 1s plus a merit league that is barely viable due to the serious clubs moving up and juniors. A premier is only possible by stretching to the West of England but the top clubs leave as it is weak and they're nearer to the north. The South Premier is a higher standard but very hard for clubs to step up. What happened to South London and the now defunct West London is that if you play in a stagnant league forever with no ambition whatsoever to play somewhere better players eventually get bored and pack in or move elsewhere. Hammersmith and Skolars A are taking a turn as top dogs.

North East had an 18 game season in the lower division but absurdly 12 in the higher division. There will only be a full season when they scrap this HJ Trophy farce. Would only be possible in midlands and south if they have one combined strong division which they can't persuade London clubs to join (South London and West London were viciously against the idea of having to travel as far as Coventry even when they were good).

Scotland is a false picture as they have lots of clubs but a short season and lots of called off games so one season could see it collapse, most clubs are very short lived.

Medway are strong at juniors but not yet at open age, I see potential. The Eastern division is RU and half the teams collapse every couple of years, none run juniors. London and South East is a mixture but Portsmouth at the top are military based and when they were in premier never bothered with away games unless they were close. Elmbridge and Medway are the furthest south of London juniors go. Likewise they stretch to Essex and Hertfordshire but no further in the east. London has lots of standalone junior clubs with no link to open age but hopefully that will gradually change.

[bowes]

As for RLC clubs in the heartland areas well in Lancashire they mostly folded bar the ones that had a winter team and Wigan Riversiders. A couple of merit league sides survived but not many. Yorkshire most sides are in a short season still so many RLC sides survived.

[Bedford Roughyed]

The Eastern division is RU and half the teams collapse every couple of years, none run juniors.

Most players play Union yes, but we have run juniors last 2 seasons (U16's playing friendlies). Next season MK, North Herts and ourselves should be running some juniors teams (I'm not part of the planning).

[keighley]

Bowes, thanks for taking the time to compile that. I have a much clearer picture of things as a result. It does seem that the summer conference expansion concept is at something of a crisis point. It succeeded beyond anyone's wildest dreams from the initial 12 teams or whatever it was but now needs to morph, as you say, into genuine amateur leagues similar to BARLA leagues, and put down some roots.

There seem to be some solid, reliable clubs with a future but many more who are fly by night, here today, gone tomorrow, organisations. In my opinion, some direction, organisation and, if possible, funding from the RFL would be vital to consolidate the gains made so far.

Don't they have to have a certain number of people playing RL to justify Govt. funding.? You would think they would be driven to help this sector of the game suceed.

[Bedford Roughyed]

You will always have fly by night teams, even in BARLA leagues. Except they will be in division 7 of something, so no one really pays attention. With the number of teams we have you will have a much wider range of teams in 1 division, which makes it harder for everyone.

[HappyDave]

Game 3: Gloucestershire Warriors (West of England) v Bye

Huh? Phil C does realise Glos Warriors won the WoE in 2011 not 2012?...

Semi Finals (Neutral Grounds) - Sunday 9th September

Semi 2: Gloucestershire Warriors v Winner Game 4

Huh??? Whaaaa...

The RFL are pulling out staff from the South West and may end up the midlands have to run it (or at least West of England which will include Valley Cougars...

Huh again???...

Edited by HappyDave, 26 August 2012 - 02:56 PM.

[bowes]

Bowes, thanks for taking the time to compile that. I have a much clearer picture of things as a result. It does seem that the summer conference expansion concept is at something of a crisis point. It succeeded beyond anyone's wildest dreams from the initial 12 teams or whatever it was but now needs to morph, as you say, into genuine amateur leagues similar to BARLA leagues, and put down some roots.

There seem to be some solid, reliable clubs with a future but many more who are fly by night, here today, gone tomorrow, organisations. In my opinion, some direction, organisation and, if possible, funding from the RFL would be vital to consolidate the gains made so far.

Don't they have to have a certain number of people playing RL to justify Govt. funding.? You would think they would be driven to help this sector of the game suceed.

The RLC froze lots of genuine clubs with history out for years or forever and in many cases let in artificial clubs with razzamatazz to look good on press releases. They even made clubs change their name to get in, named non existant clubs on press releases and pretended heartland clubs were from expansion towns.

[HappyDave]

I still don't understand why neither Oxford of Somerset are in the Harry Jepson trophy and why Glos get automatically into the semi-final because the Welsh teams pulled out. I'm guessing it will be their first from the Midlands Premier who finished their season in 4th. Bizzare.

[bowes]

I still don't understand why neither Oxford of Somerset are in the Harry Jepson trophy and why Glos get automatically into the semi-final because the Welsh teams pulled out. I'm guessing it will be their first from the Midlands Premier who finished their season in 4th. Bizzare.

Did Oxford turn down the chance? It was always odd in the national playoffs if the regionals but the HJ Trophy for premier division teams normally worked better than this.

[HappyDave]

Did Oxford turn down the chance? It was always odd in the national playoffs if the regionals but the HJ Trophy for premier division teams normally worked better than this.

I haven't the foggiest what's gone on. Oxford won the West of England. Glos came 5th in the 'WoE' and 4th in the 'Midlands Premier' but have been give an automatic place in the semi-final.

From the OP:

"Game 3: Gloucestershire Warriors (West of England) [bye]"

Bizzare.

Edited by HappyDave, 26 August 2012 - 05:37 PM.

[tim2]

Gloucester are the highest placed club in the West region, based on them playing in the Premier level.

I think, Probably.

[bowes]

Gloucester are the highest placed club in the West region, based on them playing in the Premier level.

I think, Probably.

Though then again they could have Eastern Rhinos and Elmbridge in on that logic. Not sure there is much logic to it, it's a razzamatazz invitation tournament to show off rather than winning a league I guess now.