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Hillsborough (merged threads)


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115 replies to this topic

#81 getdownmonkeyman

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 07:33 PM

Lets not let facts get in the way shall we. I'm assuming the 45% pay rise you are on about was the Edmund Davis report? The one started and agreed upon by the Labour party, and only implemented by the Tories because they had come into power after the 'old' labour party Home Secretary Meryn Rees had agreed to implement it but was then ouit of power.



It seems the fact that police involved in major incidents amending/altering their statements was common practice and common knowledge at the time. Lord Justice Taylor certainly knew about it. Jack Straw ordered an Inquiry into this practice when it was first mentioned and that didn't find anything wrong in this process of statement gathering at major incidents. The way it was described is this. Immediately after the incident a policeman writes down his notes in freehand on a statement form. Days later the statement is typed up, but he could then be asked to add anything else he may have remembered or seen on that day. He could also be asked or even prompted, quite lawfully, if he had seen a particular thing. If he did he could add that info to the typed statement as well. I believe this was pounced upon by some lawyers and press as being an altered statement, ie the hand written one is different from the typed one. Nowadays the officer would be asked to submit an extra statement, but in them days that was the practice.


Being instructed to alter a statement, is not the same as being prompted for review.

http://www.bbc.co.uk...kshire-17126678

#82 Jasper

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 07:42 PM

Not saying it is. I was trying, obviously not well enough, to answer L'angs comments that that have been bandied about all through this thread that it was a Tory government that gave the police a huge pay rise as a 'well done' for backing them up, when it wasn't, and that altering major incident statements was not seen in those days was anything out of the usual, in fact was the norm. Didn't make any comment about altering statements under duress.

#83 Trojan

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 08:33 PM

Not saying it is. I was trying, obviously not well enough, to answer L'angs comments that that have been bandied about all through this thread that it was a Tory government that gave the police a huge pay rise as a 'well done' for backing them up, when it wasn't, and that altering major incident statements was not seen in those days was anything out of the usual, in fact was the norm. Didn't make any comment about altering statements under duress.

They didn't give the police a pay rise as a "well done" they gave them it as a carrot to keep them in line.
As for evidence being changed, all you say may be true about police notebooks, that still doesn't alter the fact that the coroner gave 3-15pm as the cut off time for all the deaths, when it has emerged that many of those who died were still alive at this time and, had timely first aid been administered by trained personel (the police say) many of these deaths could have been prevented. It can only be assumed that someone leaned on the coroner.
"Your a one trick pony Trojan" - Parksider 10th March 2013

#84 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 09:14 PM

Not saying it is. I was trying, obviously not well enough, to answer L'angs comments that that have been bandied about all through this thread that it was a Tory government that gave the police a huge pay rise as a 'well done' for backing them up, when it wasn't, and that altering major incident statements was not seen in those days was anything out of the usual, in fact was the norm. Didn't make any comment about altering statements under duress.


how can it have been a 'well done for backing them up' when they had only just been elected? The point was to keep them sweet in preparation for the sociaal unrest that lay ahead.
it doesn't matter whether it was 'the norm' or not, and doctoring statements was only one aspect of the cover up and disinformation campaign.

the telegraph is hardly the morning star. Here is a take on the situation from one of their senior writers

http://blogs.telegra..._police_onside/
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#85 JohnM

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 09:14 AM

This will be an interesting insight into how things are these days: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19620627

"After the verdict in July, Deborah Glass, deputy chairwoman of the IPCC said "significant questions" remained over PC Harwood's actions."

#86 Griff9of13

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 09:54 AM

Some interesting thoughts and serious questions from my local MP, Bill Esterson http://www.billester...ptember-18-2012
"it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it."

#87 JohnM

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 05:33 PM

All sorts of stuff coming out as people tral through the documents

see for example, http://hillsborough....00001200001.pdf

#88 Futtocks

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 03:50 PM

Sir Alex Ferguson's letter to Manchester United fans.

Dear Supporter,
The great support you gave the team here last season has seen our allocation back up to near-full levels. I want you to continue that progress today.

But today is about much more than not blocking gangways. Today is about thinking hard about what makes United the best club in the world.
Our rivalry with Liverpool is based on a determination to come out on top – a wish to see us crowned the best against a team that held that honour for so long.

It cannot and should never be based on personal hatred. Just ten days ago, we heard the terrible, damning truth about the deaths of 96 fans who went to watch their team try and reach the FA Cup final and never came back.

What happened to them should wake the conscience of everyone connected with the game.

Our great club stands with our great neighbours Liverpool today to remember that loss and pay tribute to their campaign for justice. I know I can count on you to stand with us in the best traditions of the best fans in the game.


A mind is like a parachute. It doesn’t work if it isn’t open. Frank Zappa (1940 - 1993)


#89 Griff9of13

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 04:27 PM

Sir Alex Ferguson's letter to Manchester United fans.

Well done Sir Alex, but common decency shouldn't need spelling out.
"it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it."

#90 Griff9of13

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 04:28 PM

double post. Stupid phone.

Edited by Griff9of13, 21 September 2012 - 04:30 PM.

"it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it."

#91 Griff9of13

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 12:40 PM

Unbe-smegging-leavable, Kelvin McKenzie demands apology
"it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it."

#92 Futtocks

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 02:07 PM

Unbe-smegging-leavable, Kelvin McKenzie demands apology


A tapeworm in human form.

A mind is like a parachute. It doesn’t work if it isn’t open. Frank Zappa (1940 - 1993)


#93 getdownmonkeyman

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 08:52 PM

A tapeworm in human form.


Far too pleasant a reference.

#94 Trojan

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Posted 04 October 2012 - 06:58 PM

Bettinson is to retire next March.
http://www.bbc.co.uk...ngland-19836760
"Your a one trick pony Trojan" - Parksider 10th March 2013

#95 Griff9of13

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Posted 12 October 2012 - 12:20 PM

Is the net finally closing in on the police?
"it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it."

#96 Jerry the Berry

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Posted 12 October 2012 - 03:34 PM

Is the net finally closing in on the police?


Hopefully.

#97 Griff9of13

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 11:36 AM

Attorney General calls for new inquests Let's hope this finally gives the families the answers and the closure they have been seeking.
"it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it."

#98 Griff9of13

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 12:51 PM

Hillsborough inquest verdicts quashed by High Court. Another momentous day for the families. I just hope my friend Anne lives long enough to see the final results of this.
"it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it."

#99 JohnM

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 02:55 PM

Amen to that. At least it seems to be moving forward. fingers crossed

#100 Futtocks

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 09:08 AM

It just keeps going on and on: Hillsborough police tried to raid £12m victims’ fund


A mind is like a parachute. It doesn’t work if it isn’t open. Frank Zappa (1940 - 1993)





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