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Please can/may I borrow your book!


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#1 Saint Billinge

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 06:53 AM

A new book launched today focuses on grammar for grown-ups. Would you say Charlie and I or Charlie and me? As for the heading, please may I borrow your book is correct. Are you a stickler when it comes to grammar or more relaxed - and does it really matter as the message gets over one way or the other?

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#2 Leeds Wire

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 07:02 AM

The one that has crept in almost unnoticed is "Can I get?" when asking for things in shops. It's just not right!

#3 JohnM

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 07:34 AM

pre-order. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO!


you can ORDER something or you can't

PIN number. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO!

Oh, there are so many many more I could mention....

#4 heartofGold

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 07:56 AM

pre-order. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO!


you can ORDER something or you can't

PIN number. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO!

Oh, there are so many many more I could mention....


Oh Bill would have LOVED this thread :) . PIN number made him cringe every time

oy shked helwa el horiya

#5 gingerjon

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:03 AM

pre-order. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO!


you can ORDER something or you can't

PIN number. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO!

Oh, there are so many many more I could mention....


HIV virus?

And

Would you say Charlie and I or Charlie and me?

depends on context. A lot of people use 'and I' thinking it's right when most times it isn't.

Edited by gingerjon, 27 September 2012 - 08:03 AM.

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#6 marklaspalmas

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:24 AM

. Would you say Charlie and I or Charlie and me?


Depends on whether it's the subject or object.

Charlie and I went out. Ok. Subject.

Please give them to Charlie and me. Ok. Object.

As for the heading, please may I borrow your book is correct.


No, both are correct. It's perfectly acceptable to use the modal verb 'can' when asking for permission.

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#7 Johnoco

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:32 AM

I'm one of those people who uses proper grammar and spelling on text messages, or at least try to. I blame my old teachers

But there's no point being too clever about it as you can always get pulled up about something by someone. But basic things like "he should of passed the ball" are so commonplace today, I think some people believe or assume it is correct.

Anyway, what book was it you wanted to borrow?

#8 hindle xiii

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:40 AM

It's a perfect situation where those who are a bit thick or have poor English skills can demonstrate this. It's also the perfect situation where those who are a bit up themselves and like to feel superior by correcting others can demonstrate this too.

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#9 longboard

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:41 AM

A new book launched today focuses on grammar for grown-ups. Would you say Charlie and I or Charlie and me? As for the heading, please may I borrow your book is correct. Are you a stickler when it comes to grammar or more relaxed - and does it really matter as the message gets over one way or the other?


I aren't lending you no book.

#10 Amber Avenger

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:41 AM

But there's no point being too clever about it as you can always get pulled up about something by someone. But basic things like "he should of passed the ball" are so commonplace today, I think some people believe or assume it is correct.


This is a part of language I'm fascinated with - errors that become so commonplace they are often thought of as correct. If the majority of people think it's correct, should it be deemed correct as language is all about understanding? I don't know, but it's an interesting debate.

In the example you use "should of" really winds me up as it's just sloppy, but the "pre-order" one I find a useful short hand for "placing an order for something that isn't yet available or paid for", even though I know technically it shouldn't exist. Perhaps there should be a better word for that specific action, that doesn't contradict itself.

Never really thought of the PIN number one before, I know it'll annoy the heck out of from now on though
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#11 Johnoco

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:48 AM

It's a perfect situation where those who are a bit thick or have poor English skills can demonstrate this. It's also the perfect situation where those who are a bit up themselves and like to feel superior by correcting others can demonstrate this too.


Not nessessarily up yersen 2 b fussy abart spelin.the idear beehind grammer and speling is so dat we orl no wot the uvver is torking about. uvverwise nowun wud no wot u r sayin.

A bit like when you are in Lancashire. :)

#12 gingerjon

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:51 AM

In the example you use "should of" really winds me up as it's just sloppy,


It isn't though. If you say one says "should've" it sounds an awful lot like "should of". Identical in many accents. It's hardly a crime against humanity whatever Lynne Truss and her tedious friends think.
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#13 Johnoco

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:53 AM

It isn't though. If you say one says "should've" it sounds an awful lot like "should of". Identical in many accents. It's hardly a crime against humanity whatever Lynne Truss and her tedious friends think.


Many things sound like other things in various accents. Y I Man, Nah then, 'ey up etc

It's not a reason to abandon the correct spelling of the phrase.

#14 hindle xiii

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:55 AM

Not nessessarily up yersen 2 b fussy abart spelin.the idear beehind grammer and speling is so dat we orl no wot the uvver is torking about. uvverwise nowun wud no wot u r sayin.

A bit like when you are in Lancashire. :)

I am :(

I'm also in the third category; to at least try and use decent English so I don't seem thick, but I also don't get the wrath of the Punctuation Police.

- Me and Charlie should of proper hit him, but we never did nothing. Honest.
- I think you'll find it's...

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#15 Griff9of13

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 08:56 AM

The one that has crept in almost unnoticed is "Can I get?" when asking for things in shops. It's just not right!


Glad it's not just me then! If I was the recipient of such a phrase the answer would most definitely be "NO, you may not get..., but I am more than happy to get... for you."
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#16 Amber Avenger

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 09:00 AM

It isn't though. If you say one says "should've" it sounds an awful lot like "should of". Identical in many accents. It's hardly a crime against humanity whatever Lynne Truss and her tedious friends think.


Sorry, I meant in text. Speaking is different matter, which I agree with your point.

Edited by Amber Avenger, 27 September 2012 - 09:02 AM.

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#17 hindle xiii

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 09:06 AM

Glad it's not just me then! If I was the recipient of such a phrase the answer would most definitely be "NO, you may not get..., but I am more than happy to get... for you."

Which would probably be followed up by "Can you get your manager?"

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#18 Griff9of13

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 09:26 AM

Which would probably be followed up by "Can you get your manager?"

Not "Can I get your manager?"
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#19 hindle xiii

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 09:36 AM

Not "Can I get your manager?"

You'd probably follow up that question with;

I don't know, can you? Do you know who the manager is? No, you probably don't, because YOU'RE AN IDIOT FOR USING 'GET' INSTEAD OF 'HAVE'!

:P

(and this person didn't say 'please' in the first place)

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#20 Wolford6

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 09:55 AM

You'd probably follow up that question with;

I don't know, can you? Do you know who the manager is? No, you probably don't, because YOU'RE AN IDIOT FOR USING 'GET' INSTEAD OF 'HAVE'!

:P

(and this person didn't say 'please' in the first place)


'Please can I have your manager' ???

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