Jump to content





Photo
- - - - -

Rams and Bulls announce link-up (merged threads)


  • Please log in to reply
281 replies to this topic

#81 Townie

Townie
  • Coach
  • 2,404 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 01:13 PM

I think if you go on the club website and read the questions and answers you may see the benefits. Non of our contracted players can leave for the Bulls at the drop of a hat during the season, just because the bulls have a injury crisis. If they did wed need a transfer fee and the player would have to agree to a fulltime contract with bradford, hence leaving his day job. If the bulls do sign any of our hot prospects, which lets face it wev had only 1 lad go to Superleague in about 6 years so isnt something that happens everyseason, then it would probably be the end of the season.

Our last player to leave for superleague was Dom Maloney
Before that i can only remember Mike Wainwright joining Wakefield so we dont exactly lose loads of lads to superleague fulltime rugby, so i dont see it been a problem?

Hope you renew your season ticket mate as the club need you and i alot more than we need bradford.


Ian Kirk is an ex Ram at Leeds Rhino's.
Dewsbury Rams win machine.

#82 Ackroman

Ackroman
  • Coach
  • 2,010 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 01:16 PM

Ian Kirk is an ex Ram at Leeds Rhino's.

Wasn't he at York first?

#83 Ackroman

Ackroman
  • Coach
  • 2,010 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 01:17 PM

If they do, I can honestly say I certainly won't be watching Batley any more. I really cannot see any point in watching a 2nd team competition. Especially a 2nd team consisting of another teams 2nd rate players.

If it's as Tom describes then Batley have had a similar arrangement with Huddersfield before. In fact did it ever stop? Didn't David Rourke come to Batley through that arrangement?

#84 Dog Faced Gremlin

Dog Faced Gremlin
  • Coach
  • 498 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 02:47 PM

My god Super League must be in the poop if they are descending from their ivory towers to converse with the plebs from the Championship.

You've got to ask the question why is a seemingly sensible Chairman like M.S. wanting anything to do with the financial / moral train wreck that is the Bradford Bulls? Hunslet have done the sensible thing with Leeds because lets face it the Hawks wouldn't exist this time next year without it and Leeds "seem" to have a better handle on how to run a club. Why do Dews need this? Batley seem to have no probs getting decent and dual reg players without being attached to a specific S.L. club.

If S.L. club's passed history is anything to go by then the real benefits are solely going to be pointing Bradford's way as they're not doing it for the benefit and development of a rival club. I can't see Bradford's new BOD's development plan being, "get more fans for Dewsbury" can you?

I genuinely wish Dewsbury all the luck in the world. I would want nothing more than to see them being the second best R.L. club in Britain behind Batley. However, we all know that's not going to happen unless S.L. disappears up it's own bank balance.

I hate to say it but I'm already predicting an end of season thread title for this message board and it reads, "Whatever happened with that Bulls Hook up?"
For when the one great scorer comes to mark against your name he writes not if you won or lost but how you played the game.

#85 Nick07

Nick07
  • Coach
  • 1,357 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 02:53 PM

If it's as Tom describes then Batley have had a similar arrangement with Huddersfield before. In fact did it ever stop? Didn't David Rourke come to Batley through that arrangement?


We've had a few players over the years from Huddersfield AM.....Rourke, Fagborun (from memory), then McGilviray, Griffin and Alex Brown on Loan/DR in later years, but the arrangement was never a formalised one. More just a friendly relationship. Seems to have come to an end in the last 12 months though.

We've already stated that we aren't likely to formally link up with an SL club in the near future, although I can still see us using the DR system when situations, i.e. injuries, etc, occur for it to become beneficial. It just won't be with one specific SL club that's all.

#86 BatleyFanAndy

BatleyFanAndy
  • Coach
  • 1,734 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 03:31 PM

Care to elaborate?


There is just the fact that it may happen mid season and leave you short of say a prop or a hooker. If the player wants it, the club can't really turn them down, and yes I know they'd be compensated for it, but compensation can't play rugby.
SIGNATURE

#87 grumpyoldram

grumpyoldram
  • Coach
  • 2,771 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 03:36 PM

We've had a few players over the years from Huddersfield AM.....Rourke, Fagborun (from memory), then McGilviray, Griffin and Alex Brown on Loan/DR in later years, but the arrangement was never a formalised one. More just a friendly relationship. Seems to have come to an end in the last 12 months though.

We've already stated that we aren't likely to formally link up with an SL club in the near future, although I can still see us using the DR system when situations, i.e. injuries, etc, occur for it to become beneficial. It just won't be with one specific SL club that's all.

On that point, would GM be allowed to take players from other SL clubs on DR/loan or will we be more or less obliged to take the Bulls ones - one for tom I think ?

#88 Tom Coates

Tom Coates
  • Moderator
  • 1,158 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 03:36 PM

There is just the fact that it may happen mid season and leave you short of say a prop or a hooker. If the player wants it, the club can't really turn them down, and yes I know they'd be compensated for it, but compensation can't play rugby.


But then what's stopping that same thing happening to Batley?

Under the new partnership, we remain as guarded against the loss of our star players to Super League clubs as any other club in the Championships (which, incidentally, is not very!).

#89 creditwhereitsdews

creditwhereitsdews
  • Coach
  • 336 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 05:42 PM

This isn't just about players, it's about rugby league being further devalued at semi-professional level.
Since 1994 supporters of clubs such as our own have seen their hopes and ambitions removed one by one - not by players, teams and coaches - but by greedy and corrupt individuals who have removed promotion and cup competitions and feel they can use our clubs as laboratory mice to test half-arsed, contrived ideas.
We are sick of seeing the rules changed every season. There has been no consistency in the structure of our game since the 1990s. When you finish top you want to go up, when you finish bottom you want to go down. We don't want to play in a cup competition with nonsensical group stages or league seasons with only 18 games. What is the point of us having our tidy little stadium when there are no more than ten meaningful home matches a season?
The motivation to attend games is dwindling and to rub salt into the wounds we have to read these preposterous puff pieces in the RL press and insulting PR emails from the RFL telling us how exciting the Northern Rail Cup is. It isn't!
It's insulting and any partnership with a Super League team is going to be taken as one more kick in the guts.
We want to be taken seriously.

#90 BatleyFanAndy

BatleyFanAndy
  • Coach
  • 1,734 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 06:56 PM

But then what's stopping that same thing happening to Batley?

Under the new partnership, we remain as guarded against the loss of our star players to Super League clubs as any other club in the Championships (which, incidentally, is not very!).


Batley aren't putting them directly in the shop window.

Rams have put their players in the shop window, but that's only one down side (IMO), the other is becoming a part of another club.  Maybe not by name, but a little bit of Dewsbury's identity as gone now.  It's like the NRL feeder clubs. 

Edited by BatleyFanAndy, 05 October 2012 - 07:04 PM.

SIGNATURE

#91 DEWSBURY TIL I DIE

DEWSBURY TIL I DIE
  • Coach
  • 2,403 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 07:27 PM

Batley aren't putting them directly in the shop window.

Rams have put their players in the shop window, but that's only one down side (IMO), the other is becoming a part of another club. Maybe not by name, but a little bit of Dewsbury's identity as gone now. It's like the NRL feeder clubs.


Andy, if a players good enough and want to play at the highest level they are going to be scouted by superleague clubs wether we at dewsbury or anyother championship club likes it or not so to say were putting them directly in the shop window isnt the case as players in the championship are in the shop window regardles, like alex walmsley as in joining st helens. Dewsbury and Batley are at this minute along way from superleague and been able to give players fulltime superleague rugby....

Edited by DEWSBURY TIL I DIE, 05 October 2012 - 07:35 PM.


#92 DEWSBURY TIL I DIE

DEWSBURY TIL I DIE
  • Coach
  • 2,403 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 07:31 PM

and no WE ARE DEWSBURY RAMS, OUR CLUB, OUR BUSINESS.... We aint owned or dictated by bradford. We didnt get forced into this. Mark and Glenn and the club have formed a relationship between the 2 clubs because both clubs can see a benefit for their own clubs

Edited by DEWSBURY TIL I DIE, 05 October 2012 - 07:32 PM.


#93 bulldogtrev

bulldogtrev
  • Coach
  • 416 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 07:53 PM

This annoucement could improve Dewsbury's displays on the field.

If I am a Dewsbury player training week in and week out and giving 100% every week I am going to be annoyed if I lose my place to a Bradford player returning from injury who is playing for Dewsbury to get some match fitness or because he is not good enough to get in the Bradford first team squad.

What could happen is that the Dewsbury players roll there sleeves up in pre-season training and say no Bradford squad player is taking my place. Although it may cause the agreement to collapse/fail it might end up in a good season for Dewsbury.

"Anyone who does not watch rugby league is not a real person."

-John Singleton,

 

#94 Batley Bob

Batley Bob
  • Coach
  • 1,280 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 08:24 PM

We're no more a feeder club for the Super League than any other team in the Championships.

We get first refusal on Bradford's fringe stars, and they get first refusal on our players ready to make the step up to the Super League



Glenn picks the Rams team, not Francis Cummins.



You're more or less there.

Bradford benefit from this deal as they get first refusal on Dewsbury players who are ready and capable of making the step up to Super League.

We benefit from this deal as we get first refusal on Bradford players not selected for the Bulls first team squad.


"We get first refusal on Bradford's fringe stars, and they get first refusal on our players ready to make the step up to the Super League"

What exactly does this mean Tom , they get first refusal , I really , really hope Batley dont go down this route , there is far too many grey areas , im trying to understand all the implications.

but you then contradict it by saying in a later post

Like I said, Bradford will have to go through the same process as any other Super League club if they want to sign our players. They can't cherry pick and snatch at the drop of a hat.

how do they go thro same process , when they have trained with them , and get first refusal ?

Edited by Batley Bob, 05 October 2012 - 08:27 PM.


#95 Blind side johnny

Blind side johnny
  • Coach
  • 9,759 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 08:59 PM

This isn't just about players, it's about rugby league being further devalued at semi-professional level.
Since 1994 supporters of clubs such as our own have seen their hopes and ambitions removed one by one - not by players, teams and coaches - but by greedy and corrupt individuals who have removed promotion and cup competitions and feel they can use our clubs as laboratory mice to test half-arsed, contrived ideas.
We are sick of seeing the rules changed every season. There has been no consistency in the structure of our game since the 1990s. When you finish top you want to go up, when you finish bottom you want to go down. We don't want to play in a cup competition with nonsensical group stages or league seasons with only 18 games. What is the point of us having our tidy little stadium when there are no more than ten meaningful home matches a season?
The motivation to attend games is dwindling and to rub salt into the wounds we have to read these preposterous puff pieces in the RL press and insulting PR emails from the RFL telling us how exciting the Northern Rail Cup is. It isn't!
It's insulting and any partnership with a Super League team is going to be taken as one more kick in the guts.
We want to be taken seriously.


I feel your pain CWID but it's all about money. Last year our average gate was 1100+; the last year we played in the top flight (some on here remember that) our average gate was 1500+. The numbers just don't add up for a club such as ours.

Our board have entered into this arrangement as they believe it is in our best interests and I respect that. On a more fundamental level I personally believe that these changes are the thin edge of the wedge for CC clubs but more on that anon.
Believe what you see, don't see what you believe.


John Ray (1627 - 1705)

#96 BatleyFanAndy

BatleyFanAndy
  • Coach
  • 1,734 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 09:08 PM

Andy, if a players good enough and want to play at the highest level they are going to be scouted by superleague clubs wether we at dewsbury or anyother championship club likes it or not so to say were putting them directly in the shop window isnt the case as players in the championship are in the shop window regardles, like alex walmsley as in joining st helens. Dewsbury and Batley are at this minute along way from superleague and been able to give players fulltime superleague rugby....


But Alex finished the season as a Bulldog. The way this sounds, your players would more than likely go mid season if they're going to go.
SIGNATURE

#97 DEWSBURY TIL I DIE

DEWSBURY TIL I DIE
  • Coach
  • 2,403 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 09:08 PM

"We get first refusal on Bradford's fringe stars, and they get first refusal on our players ready to make the step up to the Super League"

What exactly does this mean Tom , they get first refusal , I really , really hope Batley dont go down this route , there is far too many grey areas , im trying to understand all the implications.

but you then contradict it by saying in a later post

Like I said, Bradford will have to go through the same process as any other Super League club if they want to sign our players. They can't cherry pick and snatch at the drop of a hat.

how do they go thro same process , when they have trained with them , and get first refusal ?


For a start its a partnership like glenn and the club have said. We are not a feeder club. It happens in football, it doesnt mean a club lacks ambition. Its just 2 clubs working together to get the best for their clubs.

#98 DEWSBURY TIL I DIE

DEWSBURY TIL I DIE
  • Coach
  • 2,403 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 09:15 PM

But Alex finished the season as a Bulldog. The way this sounds, your players would more than likely go mid season if they're going to go.


wev lost about 2 players to superleague clubs in 10 seasons. I doubt were going to lose many players in the next 5 years. If thats the case wed receleve a transfer fee but thats up to the club and the player if they leave in the season. Like i said i doubt glen and the clubs going to ruin his own teams chances by letting a player go in midseason. Maybe the agreement means no player can leave to bradford during the season but only at the end and whoever said wed have to let the player go to bradford during the season?

Edited by DEWSBURY TIL I DIE, 05 October 2012 - 09:16 PM.


#99 Kelsey The Ram

Kelsey The Ram
  • Coach
  • 385 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 09:16 PM

I think Warrington did the same with Swinton and Hull did with York, I don't think it's like the Queensland cup or the New South Wales cup (these are the competitions in Australia where a club is a feeder club for a certain NRL team, I've heard a few people mention this on this thread) it's nothing to worry about.

I can assure you all that the championship/championship1 will never become like the Queensland/NSW cups,as Morrison and Sawyer have said themselves that we will never become a feeder club - to anyone. I think the RFL will be some way off the ARL and will not structure rugby league over here like the the ARL structure the game in down under, I can't see it going that way anyway.
"Are you tryin' to mug me off in front of my pals?"

#100 Rambo

Rambo
  • Coach
  • 508 posts

Posted 05 October 2012 - 10:08 PM

I think it may have been better PR for the club had they not announced it in the way they have. Several dual reg signings would be more palatable for dewsbury supporters than talk about link ups and "synergys" whatever the feck they are.

To many RL fans, after the latest shenanigans at Bradford they are regard Bradford as all that is wrong about the game. So what do we do? A once proud little club, with a rich history and one that has only recently got its own finances in order do, we go and join them!!!

The sooner we get Nigel wood and Ralph rimmer out of the rfl and we see someone emerge to take the game forward from this chaos the better.

Posted Image




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users