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Gary McKinnon extradition is blocked


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21 replies to this topic

#1 Phil

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 10:53 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19968973

Never thought I'd say it, but well done Theresa May
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#2 Padge

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 11:31 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19968973

Never thought I'd say it, but well done Theresa May

Why?

Two faced Tories at their best.

Claiming it would be an breach of his civil rights whilst trying to opt out of human rights legislation.

Sending someone else to the same courts in the same country with the same diagnosis and charged with the same/similar offence.

A legal decision made by a politician for political reasons rather than legal reasons.

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#3 Johnoco

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 07:15 AM

Not read into this very deeply. Did the US have a case?

Or what?

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#4 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 07:32 AM

Not read into this very deeply. Did the US have a case?

Or what?



there is no doubt he did what he did
the issue is his motivation and his mental state.


A precedent has been set, which could come back to bite the government.
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#5 Johnoco

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 07:46 AM

there is no doubt he did what he did
the issue is his motivation and his mental state.


A precedent has been set, which could come back to bite the government.

As I understand it, the US don't extradite their citizens for trial elsewhere? Or is that wrong?


No I don't care if you're if you're into different bands

No cause for so much hatred, I'm just a different man

Pull off that cover, I will too, and learn to understand

With music deep inside we'll make world unity our plan

 

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#6 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 08:03 AM

As I understand it, the US don't extradite their citizens for trial elsewhere? Or is that wrong?

I don't know; extradition treaties tend to be reciprocal.

but there's trouble stored up here. wasn't a nother person with asperger's extradited to the US recently.
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#7 Wolford6

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 08:03 AM

I have never read or heard Gary McKinnon speaking to the press ... his Mam always speaks for him, despite him being well over forty. No doubt a shrewd prosecutor would make mincemeat of him in a US court.

The US Government ought to be more concerned about the fact that their defence department computers could be hacked by a barely functional foreigner than the fact that they were hacked ten years ago. There again, GM knew he was doing wrong.

5 years.

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#8 Futtocks

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 08:42 AM

I have never read or heard Gary McKinnon speaking to the press ... his Mam always speaks for him, despite him being well over forty. No doubt a shrewd prosecutor would make mincemeat of him in a US court.

The US Government ought to be more concerned about the fact that their defence department computers could be hacked by a barely functional foreigner than the fact that they were hacked ten years ago. There again, GM knew he was doing wrong.

5 years.


Heard him for the first time once yesterday's announcement had been made. As you say, unlikely to be a coincidence.

As for 'barely functional', Asperger's doesn't mean you aren't intelligent. The syndrome can produce very internalised, obsessive types who can mentally perform at a high level in certain particular ways.

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#9 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 08:48 AM

Heard him for the first time once yesterday's announcement had been made. As you say, unlikely to be a coincidence.

As for 'barely functional', Asperger's doesn't mean you aren't intelligent. The syndrome can produce very internalised, obsessive types who can mentally perform at a high level in certain particular ways.


to be fair, people with asperger's have problems functioning in a social context, or where consideration of the wider context of events are involved
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#10 Johnoco

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 09:08 AM

As I say, I haven't delved too deeply into this story so am only taking things at face value.

But what is to stop someone claiming suicidal tendencies to avoid extradition? How can they disprove it? Isn't Aspergers also quite loosely defined?

No I don't care if you're if you're into different bands

No cause for so much hatred, I'm just a different man

Pull off that cover, I will too, and learn to understand

With music deep inside we'll make world unity our plan

 

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#11 Amber Avenger

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 09:22 AM

But what is to stop someone claiming suicidal tendencies to avoid extradition? How can they disprove it?


I believe in this instance the ruling has been delayed for so long so that various groups of doctors could evaluate this claim. They have been looking at him for over a year I think. Around five experts all reached the conclusion - seperately - that the risk of suicide if he was sent to the US was dramatically high.

Edited by Amber Avenger, 17 October 2012 - 09:23 AM.

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#12 Johnoco

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 09:33 AM

I believe in this instance the ruling has been delayed for so long so that various groups of doctors could evaluate this claim. They have been looking at him for over a year I think. Around five experts all reached the conclusion - seperately - that the risk of suicide if he was sent to the US was dramatically high.

Possibly so. My point is that if I tell you I'm feeling suicidal, can you disprove it? Can a doctor? surely it's a totally unpredictable field.

Who would have predicted (insert person) would have commited suicide? It's surely so complex that it's impossible to prove that someone hasn't got these tendencies if they say they have?

No I don't care if you're if you're into different bands

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Pull off that cover, I will too, and learn to understand

With music deep inside we'll make world unity our plan

 

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#13 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 09:35 AM

As I say, I haven't delved too deeply into this story so am only taking things at face value.

But what is to stop someone claiming suicidal tendencies to avoid extradition? How can they disprove it? Isn't Aspergers also quite loosely defined?

exactly
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#14 Northern Sol

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 04:19 PM

Why?

Two faced Tories at their best.

Claiming it would be an breach of his civil rights whilst trying to opt out of human rights legislation.

Sending someone else to the same courts in the same country with the same diagnosis and charged with the same/similar offence.

A legal decision made by a politician for political reasons rather than legal reasons.


I've not read the other case but GMK only hacked into the computers because he wanted to find out if the US had secret UFO files as he was a conspiracy nut. Hardly the same crime as doing the same but having a terrorist motive. What was the other guy's motivation?

#15 longboard

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 05:41 PM

to be fair, people with asperger's have problems functioning in a social context, or where consideration of the wider context of events are involved


This includes difficulties in interactions with people as close as family members, never mind strangers.

#16 Northern Sol

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 06:17 PM

As I say, I haven't delved too deeply into this story so am only taking things at face value.

But what is to stop someone claiming suicidal tendencies to avoid extradition? How can they disprove it? Isn't Aspergers also quite loosely defined?


Suicidal tendencies wouldn't make you commit a crime so aren't a defence. Asperger's can effect your judgement.

#17 John Rhino

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 07:04 PM

At last Mrs May has shown some balls. This was a crime commited in the UK (unlike Hamza who commited his in the Yemen) and therefore should be tried in this country.

The extradition treaty is reciprocal, as it is with all countries with which we have one. The snag is only the USA does not alow it's citizens to be tried abroad once they are back on (or never left) home soil.

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#18 Johnoco

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 07:19 PM

Suicidal tendencies wouldn't make you commit a crime so aren't a defence. Asperger's can effect your judgement.

Couldn't the persons brief argue that extradition and imprisonment in country X would lead to their clients possible suicide?

I aren't talking about this case now but has the precedent been set?

No I don't care if you're if you're into different bands

No cause for so much hatred, I'm just a different man

Pull off that cover, I will too, and learn to understand

With music deep inside we'll make world unity our plan

 

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#19 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 07:43 PM

This includes difficulties in interactions with people as close as family members, never mind strangers.


that's right
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#20 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 07:47 PM

Suicidal tendencies wouldn't make you commit a crime so aren't a defence. Asperger's can effect your judgement.


suicidal tendencies don't exist in isolation, they are part part of a destructive emotional landscape. A person living in such a situation is usually compelled to hurt or damage themselves, but it is more than feasible for this to be manifested in criminal behaviour of some kind, and belive me yourt judgement is affected no end.
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