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Energy bills


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46 replies to this topic

#41 Bostik Bailey

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 08:58 PM

As I pointed out on the other topic, I'll try to explain what is wrong with the energy market.

When the market first was open there were lots of small and medium sized companies supplying energy to the grid. These sold this directly to the consumer. The big Six i.e the companies that were created after the break up of the CEGB and British Gas, started to undercut these smaller companies. It worked like this:

Smallgas co has enough gas to sell to 50,000 houses it pitches price X to me,, I switch. Powergen know I've switched to Smallgas co and approach me and undercut Smallgas co (so that Powergen are basically selling to me at break even) so I switch back. This happens to the other 50,000 houses the bigger player undercuts Smallgas co. So Smallgas co has no option but to sell gas to one of the big players. It has been forced out of the market by the size of the bigger players.

So 12 months on Smallgas co is no longer able to compete in the domestic/ retail market, so Powergen up my price, once this happens all the others follow suit. It is a cartel the energy price is set as high as the market can get away with.

If you don't think it is a cartel then here is an example as to why it operates as one:

Some bright spark thought of a way around the high price domestic of energy. If they got enough households together then they could got onto the retail market and buy large amounts of energy in the way that a commercial high user could, and get energy at a much reduced price than the domestic tariff. But guess what, because it was obvious that the gas was going to domestic use, non of the cartel would offer comparative prices to those for a commercial buyer of the same size.

I'm not as clue'd up on the petrol market but I suspect it is very similar.

#42 stimpo-and-kat

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:20 PM

As I pointed out on the other topic, I'll try to explain what is wrong with the energy market.

When the market first was open there were lots of small and medium sized companies supplying energy to the grid. These sold this directly to the consumer. The big Six i.e the companies that were created after the break up of the CEGB and British Gas, started to undercut these smaller companies. It worked like this:

Smallgas co has enough gas to sell to 50,000 houses it pitches price X to me,, I switch. Powergen know I've switched to Smallgas co and approach me and undercut Smallgas co (so that Powergen are basically selling to me at break even) so I switch back. This happens to the other 50,000 houses the bigger player undercuts Smallgas co. So Smallgas co has no option but to sell gas to one of the big players. It has been forced out of the market by the size of the bigger players.

So 12 months on Smallgas co is no longer able to compete in the domestic/ retail market, so Powergen up my price, once this happens all the others follow suit. It is a cartel the energy price is set as high as the market can get away with.

If you don't think it is a cartel then here is an example as to why it operates as one:

Some bright spark thought of a way around the high price domestic of energy. If they got enough households together then they could got onto the retail market and buy large amounts of energy in the way that a commercial high user could, and get energy at a much reduced price than the domestic tariff. But guess what, because it was obvious that the gas was going to domestic use, non of the cartel would offer comparative prices to those for a commercial buyer of the same size.

I'm not as clue'd up on the petrol market but I suspect it is very similar.


Problem with petrol is the rediculous levels of duty. Easiest way to get better prices is to bunker or keep a bulk tank but not practical for all. Ironically I bought red diesel for a customer a week ago and paid 73ppl.

#43 archibald

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 06:54 AM

. It is a cartel the energy price is set as high as the market can get away with.

Then everything sold is sold by a cartel



#44 archibald

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 07:05 AM

http://www.energy.eu/



#45 Saint Billinge

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 07:28 AM

Ever so slightly off topic, but isn't it an amazing coincidence that British Gas put up their prices by 10% just at the time most people are thinking about putting their heating timer back on?

 

Most energy companies are guilty of this whilst occasionally reducing prices just at the summer approaches!



#46 Ramite

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 10:00 AM

I would think that would be down to supply and demand.
Homer: How is education supposed to make me feel smarter? Besides, every time I learn something new, it pushes some old stuff out of my brain. Remember when I took that home winemaking course, and I forgot how to drive?

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i]Mr. Burns: Woah, slow down there maestro. There's a *New* Mexico?[/i]


#47 JohnM

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 03:20 PM

The UK population has risen by 21% in the last 50 years.

http://www.tradingec...gdom/population

 

Electricity consumption has roughly doubled

 

Gas consumption has roughly quadrupled

 

https://www.gov.uk/g...l_factsheet.pdf

 

Thi si not the game it was , way back when and "no amount of hysterical right left wing ranting from certain quarters can change that"






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