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Oldham /Salford


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#281 Padge

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:34 PM

Gav I agree their Is no facts or stats to the statement but why did they get the nod? They haven't got anything we haven't.

Did you comply with all the criteria a the time Widnes got the nod, had you won the relevant on pitch accreditation, did you have the stadium that met the standards laid down etc. etc.

If the answer to all of those is yes then the next question is this, did you better Widnes in more of those than they bettered you, if the answer is yes then you may have a point. If the answer is we were beaten by them on the majority of them then you have no argument. If you are are about even then you have no argument because O'Conner was a safer bet financially than Featherstone and it would boil down to who was the lower risk financially (note the wording).

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#282 Padge

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:37 PM

The ground is being updated as we speak.

Widnes' ground had already been updated before you even started. :rolleyes:

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#283 thundergaz

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:38 PM

Widnes' ground had already been updated before you even started. :rolleyes:


I wasn't referring to us in SL at the time when Widnes went up. I was meaning fax, Leigh or barrow should of gone up at the time as we didn't even apply at the time.

#284 Padge

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:39 PM

Ok got your point so if you have money you get on if you don't you get chucked on one side unless the RFL bail you out. Got your point i will leave it at that. Just a side note though if Oldham go bust would the RFL bail them out? I doubt it big time.


Do you refer to the RFL protecting Bradford's ground like they did with Keighley?

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Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king"

 

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#285 The Parksider

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:40 PM

If Oldham go bust would the RFL bail them out? I doubt it big time.


NO.

They only bail out the clubs they feel can do well in Superleague.

Quite right too.

#286 intheshed

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:41 PM

Did you comply with all the criteria a the time Widnes got the nod, had you won the relevant on pitch accreditation, did you have the stadium that met the standards laid down etc. etc.

If the answer to all of those is yes then the next question is this, did you better Widnes in more of those than they bettered you, if the answer is yes then you may have a point. If the answer is we were beaten by them on the majority of them then you have no argument. If you are are about even then you have no argument because O'Conner was a safer bet financially than Featherstone and it would boil down to who was the lower risk financially (note the wording).


With the exception of onfield, no but even more importantly we errr.... didnt actually submit an application!

#287 The Parksider

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:46 PM

With the exception of onfield,


Onfield achievement in the semi pro Championship is irrelevant to going on to play in Superleague. You need a professional team in Superleague.

As for "fair play" is it fair to sack all the lads who "won promotion" and bring in full time pro's?

Of course not.

If we want P & R & Fairness it's easy. Share the sky money across the 28 teams.

Then watch SKY pull the lot.

#288 Padge

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:46 PM

I wasn't referring to us in SL at the time when Widnes went up. I was meaning fax, Leigh or barrow should of gone up at the time as we didn't even apply at the time.

Did any one of them beat Widnes on the majority of other criteria, Just as Leeds for the last two years have sussed how to win the GF, Widnes sussed how to win promotion and ensured they ticked every single box putting them way out in front. They had the Stadium and support, they then ensured they pocketed the on-field necessities, after they had that box ticked they set about working on juniors and making sure they had a good financial base, they did this by not spending money they don't have on players they don't need and breaking in some kids to see who could hack it and who couldn't.

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#289 intheshed

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:47 PM

I wasn't referring to us in SL at the time when Widnes went up. I was meaning fax, Leigh or barrow should of gone up at the time as we didn't even apply at the time.


Leigh didnt apply, unless im mistaken they didnt meet the onfield criteria.

Fax wete approved but Widnes were judged , on the relevant critetia, to be better.

Barrow!!!! Dessies all stars?? The less said the better.

#290 thundergaz

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:48 PM

NO.

They only bail out the clubs they feel can do well in Superleague.

Quite right too.


With a statement like that you should have a job at the RFL headquarters with all the other dim wits.

#291 Padge

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:48 PM

With the exception of onfield, no but even more importantly we errr.... didnt actually submit an application!

By saying "they didn't have anything we have" you are implying that your club was in a better position to go up, regardless of whether an application was entered or not. You are saying in effect that we ticked more boxes, we should have gone up.

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Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king"

 

This country's wealth was created by men in overalls, it was destroyed by men in suits.


#292 intheshed

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:52 PM

Onfield achievement in the semi pro Championship is irrelevant to going on to play in Superleague. You need a professional team in Superleague.

As for "fair play" is it fair to sack all the lads who "won promotion" and bring in full time pro's?

Of course not.

If we want P & R & Fairness it's easy. Share the sky money across the 28 teams.

Then watch SKY pull the lot.


Eh? I was merely answering a question, guv :)

#293 intheshed

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:55 PM

By saying "they didn't have anything we have" you are implying that your club was in a better position to go up, regardless of whether an application was entered or not. You are saying in effect that we ticked more boxes, we should have gone up.


Well someone said all of that, just not me. I was just giving you an answer, one which backed up your point rather than disputed it too ;)

#294 Padge

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:59 PM

Well someone said all of that, just not me. I was just giving you an answer, one which backed up your point rather than disputed it too ;)

Oops should have quote TheunderPants

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Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king"

 

This country's wealth was created by men in overalls, it was destroyed by men in suits.


#295 Lounge Room Lizard

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:02 PM

NO.

They only bail out the clubs they feel can do well in Superleague.

Quite right too.


Worked out well at Paris and Crusaders for example in trying to expand the game based on management that are clueless and such clubs was bound to failure anyway. And is there any guarentees Bradford are not going to be in trouble in a couple of years time? And how much money has been pumped in to London Broncos over the years from the RFL? That money and others should have been pumped in to the grassroots of the game for me. If Pro clubs cant support themselves or go bust thats there fault not the RFLs. The clubs can start again by dropping down to the championship or in worse case scenario start a new club up like what happened at Oldham, Sheffield, Gateshead and Whitehaven. For me the Pro game gets enough money pumped in via Sky and various sponsors and backers. The grassroots level with development officers and the youth and amateur game is treated badly. Thats where the RFL should pump money in to and help develop the game there. Its very sad to see the number of development officers recently gone. A strong grassroots level will in turn support the Pro game. Sadly the other way doesnt as Pro clubs think only of themselves and dont really care about the youth and amateur scene or the development of the game outside of their area.

#296 thundergaz

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:02 PM

Oops should have quote TheunderPants


Back at that time we were not in a position to apply.But what i was trying to get at is i think fax should of been their not widnes.As fax had ticked just as many boxes as widnes did.

#297 RSN

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:05 PM

It DOES happen. Superleague get their players from top amateur clubs running junior teams.

For years on here people have perpetrated the myth that the Championship clubs supply players to the game.

They neither supply them nor develop them into professionals.

We need the facts not myths.


But surely Championship clubs have a factor in these players being produced. Let's take cumbria for example. If you removed Barrow Workington and Whitehaven as clubs would the likes of Mossop, Harrison, Lunt and Amor ect of been produced? I highly doubt it. So the CC clubs surely had a factor in the production of 2 England internationals, several super league players and academy players or am I wrong? Didn't Cumbria have 7 respresentatives in the Barla under 18s team?

#298 The Parksider

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:14 PM

But surely Championship clubs have a factor in these players being produced. Let's take cumbria for example. If you removed Barrow Workington and Whitehaven as clubs would the likes of Mossop, Harrison, Lunt and Amor ect of been produced? I highly doubt it. So the CC clubs surely had a factor in the production of 2 England internationals, several super league players and academy players or am I wrong? Didn't Cumbria have 7 respresentatives in the Barla under 18s team?


That's a key point.

If you remove Oldham will Waterhead, St.Annes and Saddleworth carry on playing??

If you remove Featherstone Rovers will Featherstone Lions give up???

If you remove Rochdale will Rochdale Mayfield give up??

I would say that today, when RL is a well respected professional game, played at a high level, and shown on Television the loss of the local championship club won't lead to the death of RL at amateur level.

In Leeds nobody really misses Bramley and would not have missed Hunslet and the junior clubs have gone from strength to strength - but there's an SL club to stimulate that.

In Barrow I feel your club IS important to the Furness area and I do feel your club underpins a strong game in Furness.

If only your population was bigger they would be a great addition to SL. It would be great if Barrow were Cumbrias SL club. Alternatively If only the west cumbria clubs could have merged into an SL club.

I don't think it's a matter of saying Cumbria needs failing championship clubs to keep up interest in RL

Cumbria actually need a superleague club to accelerate interest in RL.

Also the reality for me is in this modern age there is more substance to some top amateur clubs than there is in their local championship partners.

As Bramley were dying Stanningley were moving into their super new ground......

As Oldham struggle more fans watch the amateurs.....

Edited by The Parksider, 29 November 2012 - 11:21 PM.


#299 thundergaz

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:22 PM

Ok parksider one question to your point.Would young Zak be as good as he is without the years he had at our place before he got pinched as usual? Also he is arguably the best full back in britain.Just before you respond we have one of the best academy's in RL barring your big four.

Edited by thundergaz, 29 November 2012 - 11:25 PM.


#300 Ramite

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:24 PM

Gaz where did you get zak from?
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