838 replies to this topic

[l'angelo mysterioso]

You do talk some non sense. Our clubs failings? The RFL and the introduction of SL killed clubs like ours because we wouldn't do what they wanted I.e join forces with our near neighbours and form a team called Calder or something stupid like that. We wanted to be featherstone rovers not a union. So we get stuffed on for wanting to be featherstone rovers and not do what the RFL want. We are now getting back our club slowly to where it should be and so is Leigh and Halifax and I for one am so glad clubs like ours and these are getting our clubs back into shape after all these years of sitting on the sidelines because we didn't entertain or be on the good side of the RFL. And I for one couldn't care less for the RFL and I'm sure a lot more people feel the same the sooner the RFL gets new people in charge the better our sport will be.

if your club had been 'killed' it would have been 'dead': I don't recall that happening.
as for 'back' into shape your club has been in amess for most of its hitory, and only now is it being run competently with a realitically positive eye to the future. Do you have anything remotely resembling a comprehensive knowledge of your club
As I recall you club voted for the SKY deal.?


as for 'didn't entertain' what are you taling about?

[l'angelo mysterioso]

Who does "we" consist of? And does that make Fev, 'Fax, Leigh, Keighley, Sheffield and the rest "them?" There was a time on this board when we were all "we," "them" was Union and soccer, just shows what a few years without P&R has done. Divide and rule, Mr Murdoch learned his lesson well. Is there any wonder that Championship fans feel like outcasts from their own game and refuse to attend Cup Finals, Grand Finals and Tests in the same numbers that they used to?
Do we have to copy Australia in everything? Just because they don't have more than one division with no P & R. Most other sports in most of the rest of the world do.

as ever yor selective memory is serving you well

[Johnoco]

You were saying *exactly* the same things well before licensing or no p&r Trojan.

[Trojan]

as ever yor selective memory is serving you well

come on Chris you can do better than that be more specific

[Trojan]

You were saying *exactly* the same things well before licensing or no p&r Trojan.

I think you you'll find I wasn't. My first posts regarding this subject were in the spring of 2008 when this system was first mooted.

[Johnoco]

I think you you'll find I wasn't. My first posts regarding this subject were in the spring of 2008 when this system was first mooted.

I can recall you saying you were fed up of RL and were going to walk away from the game about 2003 citing it was a farce etc. You have repeated it a few times since but with differing reasons.

[Les Tonks Sidestep]

if your club ....

Again you use 'your club' when referring to Fev. Are you sure you've not fallen out with the BOD?

[l'angelo mysterioso]

Again you use 'your club' when referring to Fev. Are you sure you've not fallen out with the BOD?

I no longer have an involvement with a rugby league club: my reasons are my business, but don't relate to the BOD. I seem to recall saying that in a previous post. I still enjoy rugby league though HTH. Thanks for your interest.

[l'angelo mysterioso]

come on Chris you can do better than that be more specific

for crying out loud you've been getting chapter and verse for years.

[Dave T]

Personally I'd like clubs to be more open and honest about their stance on the current structure of the top levels of the game.

I suspect the 14 SL clubs are probably in favour of licensing (although lets not forget that if one of the lower clubs got relegated then they have to live with a minimum of three years out of SL just like other clubs). I also suspect that many of the smaller Championship clubs are happy with licensing, as it should help to drive clubs to be stronger in their divisions in a more controlled way rather than throwing loads of money at on-field performance to get promotion.

It'd be interesting to know if there is simply a small number of clubs (3-5) who are not happy with the situation.

If that is the case then there are two options - 1) do what we can to get the 3-5 included in the top level (SL2 for example) or 2) get on with it and keep to what the clubs want and voted for.

On a similar point, fans opinions ultimately count for little unless they are followed up with changes in behaviour. People may state that fewer championship fans go to the RL events, but tbh I suspect there is little evidence for this. GF crowds have grown and are at a very healthy level. Challenge Cup final crowds remain very healthy (it was only a couple of years ago that Wire v Leeds got 85k sell out). If anything has affected these crowds I'd suspect it would be the horrendous financial situation rather than licensing.

If you did a survey and asked if people wanted P&R to return, I suspect that you would get a majority vote for a return - but ultimately if that is a solution the game can't afford then this needs to be over-ruled by strong leadership. Behaviour is more important than opinion - we need to make sure that a few loud opinions don't rule over the correct decisions.

[The Parksider]

Personally I'd like clubs to be more open and honest about their stance on the current structure of the top levels of the game.

I suspect the 14 SL clubs are probably in favour of licensing (although lets not forget that if one of the lower clubs got relegated then they have to live with a minimum of three years out of SL just like other clubs). I also suspect that many of the smaller Championship clubs are happy with licensing, as it should help to drive clubs to be stronger in their divisions in a more controlled way rather than throwing loads of money at on-field performance to get promotion.

It'd be interesting to know if there is simply a small number of clubs (3-5) who are not happy with the situation.

If that is the case then there are two options - 1) do what we can to get the 3-5 included in the top level (SL2 for example) or 2) get on with it and keep to what the clubs want and voted for.

Yes I agree wholeheartedly.

There's something rather stupid about people proposing clubs be forced to become professionals like the SL1 & SL2 nonsense.

Back in the real world the problem is simple.

Are all the clubs who want to turn and stay pro being offered that chance to do so???

There's a massive difference between the B.O.D/Chairman teasing fans with talk of Superleague and those who are deadly serious.

For me.....

1. Featherstone - deadly serious - in they go
2. Sheffield - not got the money, so are just hoping it comes from somewhere?
3. Halifax - not got the money, so are hoping it comes from somewhere?
4. Leigh - not got the money, so are hpoing it comes from somewhere?

The latter three have a hard task to convince anyone they are serious today, as their former efforts in SL are there to haunt them.

Applying for Superleague does not stand as proof of a serious application as Mr Des Johnson showed.

[a.n Other]

Yes I agree wholeheartedly.

There's something rather stupid about people proposing clubs be forced to become professionals like the SL1 & SL2 nonsense.

Back in the real world the problem is simple.

Are all the clubs who want to turn and stay pro being offered that chance to do so???

There's a massive difference between the B.O.D/Chairman teasing fans with talk of Superleague and those who are deadly serious.

For me.....

1. Featherstone - deadly serious - in they go
2. Sheffield - not got the money, so are just hoping it comes from somewhere?
3. Halifax - not got the money, so are hoping it comes from somewhere?
4. Leigh - not got the money, so are hpoing it comes from somewhere?

The latter three have a hard task to convince anyone they are serious today, as their former efforts in SL are there to haunt them.

Applying for Superleague does not stand as proof of a serious application as Mr Des Johnson showed.

Where are Featherstone getting the money from? Probiz? How much money has he invested in the past into clubs he backed?

[The Parksider]

Where are Featherstone getting the money from? Probiz? How much money has he invested in the past into clubs he backed?

We are told Mr. Nahaboo from Probiz is likely to back the bid with money. Apologies to Terry M. if wrong but I think he indicated Mr. N. was committing to ensuring a full salary cap spend.

Mr. Lizard also suggested Mr. Abbott could be the man at your club? What do you think??

Personally I like people with money and a will to back a club to just come out and do it like Mr. O'Connor did.

Today James Rule reflected on how Widnes would not have made Superleagfue without Mr. O'Connor and "may not have survived in the championship either". He confirmed O'Connor money as "propping up the vikings"

You know you just can't blame CC clubs for tying up with SL clubs and vice-versa.......

Mr. Rule also says that the club faced and stilL face "ENORMOUS CHALLENGES MAKING THE TRANSITION FROM SEMI PRO TO PROFESSIONAL".

The P & R brigade should note that, and note that Widnes would not have made it without O'Connors money and will not survive without it unless they can grow the business - and results haven't been that great.

To advocate clubs who have no such riches should go up one year and maybe go down the next because that suits someone personally is to condemn a club to one slim (or no) chance that could ruin them. Still that's fantasy RL for you.

The debate should be about closing that gap IF anyone is really serious - do you think Nahaboo is Mr. Other??

[a.n Other]

We are told Mr. Nahaboo from Probiz is likely to back the bid with money. Apologies to Terry M. if wrong but I think he indicated Mr. N. was committing to ensuring a full salary cap spend.

Mr. Lizard also suggested Mr. Abbott could be the man at your club? What do you think??

Personally I like people with money and a will to back a club to just come out and do it like Mr. O'Connor did.

Today James Rule reflected on how Widnes would not have made Superleagfue without Mr. O'Connor and "may not have survived in the championship either". He confirmed O'Connor money as "propping up the vikings"

You know you just can't blame CC clubs for tying up with SL clubs and vice-versa.......

Mr. Rule also says that the club faced and stilL face "ENORMOUS CHALLENGES MAKING THE TRANSITION FROM SEMI PRO TO PROFESSIONAL".

The P & R brigade should note that, and note that Widnes would not have made it without O'Connors money and will not survive without it unless they can grow the business - and results haven't been that great.

To advocate clubs who have no such riches should go up one year and maybe go down the next because that suits someone personally is to condemn a club to one slim (or no) chance that could ruin them. Still that's fantasy RL for you.

The debate should be about closing that gap IF anyone is really serious - do you think Nahaboo is Mr. Other??

Do I think he will put money in? Going by what he has put into clubs in the past after making grand statements. No I don't.

[The Parksider]

Do I think he will put money in? Going by what he has put into clubs in the past after making grand statements. No I don't.

Well without that O'Connor figure they may struggle.

But I subscribe to the idea that any club serious about being a top division club should at least be given a chance to see what they can do? Don't you??

I believe Featherstone are the only serious club never to have had a fair chance to have a go.

[Keith T]

. Behaviour is more important than opinion - we need to make sure that a few loud opinions don't rule over the correct decisions.

But surely, the "correct decisions" are only reached by some other loud opinion from others!!! Who is to say who is correct for everyone is merely expressing opinions?

[The Parksider]

Who is to say who is correct for everyone is merely expressing opinions?

Well debate can move forward if views are exchanged in good faith and facts presented to assist in that.

Would you allow me the opinion the earth is flat?

Or that Superleague has attracted thousands of new fans to the game?

In good faith with no axe to grind I am currently seeking the answer on balance to whether the game should have accepted SKY money or just stayed part time.

Marauder suggests part time because he feels those remaining in the game would all be happier.

And I'm happy with that. Fair point.

Edited by The Parksider, 10 December 2012 - 01:27 PM.

[Dave T]

But surely, the "correct decisions" are only reached by some other loud opinion from others!!! Who is to say who is correct for everyone is merely expressing opinions?

I disagree 100% with your 1st line.

Correct decisions can be made all of the time without some other loud opinion from others, so I'm not really sure what you mean.

Nothing will be correct for everyone, there will always be unhappy parties I suspect. If it is right for the majority (and this needs to be backed up with behaviours that we see) then that is good enough.

BTW, my post wasn't about condemning people with different opinions, it is right that people should be able to voice any concerns or differing views, but how much they influence key decisions is a different matter.

[Trojan]

for crying out loud you've been getting chapter and verse for years.

Not where "my selective memory" is concerned I haven't. As far as the disussion re P&R I think most of us can plead guilty to "chapter and verse" Face it Chris if you can't win the argument you get personal. I hope I haven't resorted to the same tactics.

[Trojan]

I can recall you saying you were fed up of RL and were going to walk away from the game about 2003 citing it was a farce etc. You have repeated it a few times since but with differing reasons.

I haven't been posting on here since 2003. 2004 more like. But I was quite happy with the way things were in those days. I was happy to attend test matches, CC finals, Grand Finals, I even met the TRL crew in the Moon Under Water at the 2006 GF and had my picture taken with them.
But it is true, I have withdrawn from support for "RFL occasions" I watch my team (although due to circumstances I couldn't control I missed quite a bit of last season) But as far as the wider game goes give it a miss. I watch it on TV, - but not if I have to pay!