838 replies to this topic

[The Parksider]

As an Oldham fan, I would like to see kids in Oldham, Swinton and Rochdale watching their home town clubs! My lad has no interest in watching a team with second rate Salford players in it masquerading as an Oldham side! He's told me today that he has no interest now Hamilton has sold out and will concentrate on watching the towns football side! I think that's where my money might well be going to - watching a side that actually does represent the town!

It's not what we would like surely Big Red, let the kids decide. If your lad wants to watch the Latics that's fine.

[thundergaz]

You mean like the great Oldham teams of the eighties with;

Bruce Clarke (Western Suburbs)
Stuart Raper (Cronulla}
Gary Bridge (Balmain)
Steve Wright (Feltham Rugby Union)
Mark Fairbank (Elland BARLA club)
Gary Warnecke (Wests)
Mal Graham (Wests)
Peter Walsh (Newcastle Knights)
Brian McCarthy (Cantebury Bankstown)
Tom Nadiole (Salford On Loan)
Paul Lowdnes (Warrington On Loan)
Alan McCurrie (Halifax On Loan)
Ian Birkby (York On Loan)
Steve Garner (Fulham On Loan)
Michael Parish (Wakefield On Loan)
John Ogburn (Mansfield Marksmen On Loan)

Need I go on!

I hate to say it you guys and the rest that have linked up are feeder clubs and sold your souls to improve your squad for a little bit until the super league clubs get fed up of their new toys and throw you back on one side or get their wish and you become their B team. I know where some Oldham fans are coming from the RFL and super league clubs don't care about anyone but them selves as we already know so why you think this is a good idea is beyond me.

[Padge]

As an Oldham fan, I would like to see kids in Oldham, Swinton and Rochdale watching their home town clubs! My lad has no interest in watching a team with second rate Salford players in it masquerading as an Oldham side! He's told me today that he has no interest now Hamilton has sold out and will concentrate on watching the towns football side! I think that's where my money might well be going to - watching a side that actually does represent the town!

So all 11 players that turn out every week are Oldham born and bred at the Latics are they, that'll be a first for a very long time.

[Padge]

I hate to say it you guys and the rest that have linked up are feeder clubs and sold your souls to improve your squad for a little bit until the super league clubs get fed up of their new toys and throw you back on one side or get their wish and you become their B team. I know where some Oldham fans are coming from the RFL and super league clubs don't care about anyone but them selves as we already know so why you think this is a good idea is beyond me.

All clubs think about themselves, that's why so many clubs get in a mess. Its the nature of pro sport.

[Terry Mullaney]

Yes but the away support in the championship is non existent apart from Halifax and Leigh. I'm sure most of the super league teams would struggle to make a profit in the championship. We have one if not the best supported clubs outside of super league.

Your accounts show losses every year for the last three years, and that's operating in a league with a cap of £300K.

Some SL clubs may include the struggling Cas and HKR, note that they struggle on 7,000 gates.

If Mr, Campbell has said Fev will pay full cap every year, has he also said how??

It was actually Mr Nahaboo who said it. He's got a bob or two I understand but you can't expect him to start shelling out until the RFL decide whether or not P & R is likely to return. I'm so glad that we Rovers aren't entering this ridiculous 'partnership' arrangement. There's nothing to stop us taking players from SL regardless of this system anyway. I don't see the point of it other than SL clubs saving a wad of cash each year. What will happen if the coach of the CC club doesn't comply too regularly with the requirements of his SL counterpart? Not difficult to work out is it?

[thundergaz]

You can't operate an SL club based on the hope that away support is going to pay your bills. Away support should never be considered a main income stream it should be considered a bonus.

The point I'm trying to make is if you want to be successful and want bigger things and you are in the championship you will not make a profit until you reach your goal.

[The Parksider]

No clubs = no game!

Rugby League is now played by clubs and schools all over the country - a great advancement from pre-1996, our game is becoming a national game

Rugby League is now played fully professionally by our top clubs who have grown the crowds by tens of thousands and who attract tens of millions in TV contracts.

So where do you get the idea of no clubs - no game.

We had 3 "clubs" in the RFL in Leeds in 1996, no Hunslet and No Bramley won't make the slightest bit of difference, having a successful SL side has though......

[thundergaz]

It was actually Mr Nahaboo who said it. He's got a bob or two I understand but you can't expect him to start shelling out until the RFL decide whether or not P & R is likely to return. I'm so glad that we Rovers aren't entering this ridiculous 'partnership' arrangement. There's nothing to stop us taking players from SL regardless of this system anyway. I don't see the point of it other than SL clubs saving a wad of cash each year. What will happen if the coach of the CC club doesn't comply too regularly with the requirements of his SL counterpart? Not difficult to work out is it?

I'm with you on this one terry stay well away let them get on with it.

[thundergaz]

Rugby League is now played by clubs and schools all over the country - a great advancement from pre-1996, our game is becoming a national game

Rugby League is now played fully professionally by our top clubs who have grown the crowds by tens of thousands and who attract tens of millions in TV contracts.

So where do you get the idea of no clubs - no game.

We had 3 "clubs" in the RFL in Leeds in 1996, no Hunslet and No Bramley won't make the slightest bit of difference, having a successful SL side has though......

No matter what the RFL do including no P and R which IMO is ridiculous and it's killing our sport we will never achieve what the RFL want us to achieve and that's beat the Aussies it won't happen ever.

[The Parksider]

The point I'm trying to make is if you want to be successful and want bigger things and you are in the championship you will not make a profit until you reach your goal.

I don't understand Gaz with respect.

Rovers make losses each year. They have 2,000 fans and an academy to run so that's no surprise. The club probably turn over a £Million or so. In Superleague they'll get improved crowds but not that improved - Widnes only went to 5,800.

They'll get £1.2M a year from SKY, but most of the SL clubs turn over more than £4M.

Terry says Mr. Nahaboo is the one talking of paying full cap. Come the 2015 decision if he commits to that in the business plan then who is to say Rovers may end up the only club in SL in the Calder area.

I'm not saying you have no hope, all I am saying is you need Nahaboo like Widnes have needed O'Connor.

[Plan of Attack]

Another Championship club gets stuffed up with this ridiculous arrangement. I can see a few clubs disappearing as many fans dont want these links and for them its the end of their club as they see it. People like Gav can live in a dream world and pretend everything is rosy and that the Championship sides will prosper under such things. The reality is many clubs independence has gone. Fans are angry and fed up with many ready to walk away from the game forever. This may benefit SL clubs in saving money but these arrangements could be the death of some clubs, if potentially hundreds of fans walk away from the championship and stop putting their money to clubs. Fans for many years feel their club has been taken over and its now just a feeder club in all but name. The BS presented by the Clubs and RFL saying its not feeder clubs can be seen through by many fans. Its started off as DR and then each season it changed to now this. Another 5-10 years the Championship will be a Feeder Club League. I dont see what Oldham stand to gain really as Salford are in a mess themselves and likely will be for the next few years. Salford dont have money or even a great academy or fringe players. Featherstone have a much better academy and the likes of Halifax, Featherstone and Sheffield are better run.

Reading this thread I'm glad that Barrow have stayed well clear of this link up ######

[bigred]

So all 11 players that turn out every week are Oldham born and bred at the Latics are they, that'll be a first for a very long time.

They have a fair few loan players from bigger clubs, but those clubs aren't insisting that those players are the first names on the team sheet regardless of form and they don't have a say in the running of the club!

[Padge]

They have a fair few loan players from bigger clubs, but those clubs aren't insisting that those players are the first names on the team sheet regardless of form and they don't have a say in the running of the club!

But you are just being presumptuous in you assertion that that's what will happen, show me where it is written down that loan players MUST be given first priority of a place in ANY team.

[Lounge Room Lizard]

Hang on, we are talking about clubs who are teetering on the brink and many of them have been for a good while, how long can Hamilton and others in the game keep on trying to prop up clubs that have been failing for years.

If a bunch backward looking old fogies want to walk away from the club because they don't like it, then all they are doing is possibly bringing forward the day of reckoning, They should be spending their energies on encouraging young support to get behind the club instead of spouting negativity, because when they pop their clogs there will be nobody there to keep the club afloat anyway. The rubbish spouted by the opponents of these arrangements is beyond belief.

Much like many of the SL clubs thenwho are living on borrowed time after running up debts. Is just a question of time before the next club cries for help. Even the likes of St.Helens cant make it pay. The smaller clubs like Oldham have been living on nothing for years and probably still could now. The decision to unite with Salford could kill the club in a year or two. Good to see you dont care though. And whilst the older folk walk away the younger kids show no interest not just in the club but in the game in General. The rubbish and failure to understand the concerns and problems not just fans but well respected coaches have with this is beyond belief. We all know where the game is heading with feeder clubs etc and its not wanted by many people. The game is in a mess both professionally and probably more so at amateur level. Clubs forced to play summer have seen many stop playing. Those that play in Winter get a few from the summer leagues and a couple of current Championship pro players then ###### off later in the season and clubs fail to fulfill fixtures. The games is split in to many different fractions and instead of uniting and helping develop all areas of the game the RFL and others are in fact making things worse.

[intheshed]

How about we try a radical approach and wait and see what happens?

How about publishing & explaining the rules that will apply to these partnerships thus allowing opinions to be formed on more than assumption, deduction or blind faith. Now that would be truly radical.

[Padge]

Much like many of the SL clubs thenwho are living on borrowed time after running up debts. Is just a question of time before the next club cries for help. Even the likes of St.Helens cant make it pay. The smaller clubs like Oldham have been living on nothing for years and probably still could now. The decision to unite with Salford could kill the club in a year or two. Good to see you dont care though. And whilst the older folk walk away the younger kids show no interest not just in the club but in the game in General. The rubbish and failure to understand the concerns and problems not just fans but well respected coaches have with this is beyond belief. We all know where the game is heading with feeder clubs etc and its not wanted by many people. The game is in a mess both professionally and probably more so at amateur level. Clubs forced to play summer have seen many stop playing. Those that play in Winter get a few from the summer leagues and a couple of current Championship pro players then ###### off later in the season and clubs fail to fulfill fixtures. The games is split in to many different fractions and instead of uniting and helping develop all areas of the game the RFL and others are in fact making things worse.

Oh give over with this "you don't care" nonsense, I care more than most, and especially so called Oldham supporters who would sooner see the club die by withdrawing support for an utterly ridiculous reason.

Why not lets all carry on down the same old useless well trodden waste of time path, The youth of Oldham abandoned the club years ago, well before the advent of SL, nearly every RL club in the eighties had a massive problem of an ageing, dying demographic. The RFL had been warned about this time and time again, but the clubs couldn't or wouldn't see it. Oldham's problems, and other clubs, are of the making of generations back not what is happening now.

[Lounge Room Lizard]

Salford are clearly not in a mess as Peel holdings are agreeing a deal and this is a sign it is happening. Have a look at the two SL clubs who have yet to announce any link up for a mess.

Currently Salford are in a mess and have been for a while. No agreement has been signed as yet. Salford cant get near to spending the cap. They cant even keep their best players and are struggling to sign anybody. Maybe Peel will agree to invest but even still thats still not going to change much for the next couple of years. Poor crowds, poor team, poor academy and poor management cant just be turned around overnight.

As for the old Chestnut of Fev, Sheffield and Fax, for the millionth time, they don't have the money for Superleague Peel Holdings do.

Being "well run" doesn't bridge a £2,000,000 a year gap.

I didnt say anything about Halifax, Featherstone or Sheffield being in Sl did I. I said they are better run than Salford and offer both on and off the field more than what Salford currently do even though they are non Sl clubs. Being in SL does not mean you are better than a Championship club. In fact how many SL clubs make a profit or even get close say 20,000 loss? Very few. How many SL clubs in the past 3 years have have announced they have money problems? Its clear SL is living a dream and that in reality most clubs cant afford to be there. I am quite happy my club is independant and not in SL living a lie and running up massive debts like most of SL seem to be doing. SL is not the only thing in Rugby League. Rugby League is about the Semi Pro Clubs, Amateur both heartlands and development , Internationals, Students, Women, kids etc. The game is for me too much obsessed with SL and the disadvantage of other levels of the sport.

Edited by Lounge Room Lizard, 27 November 2012 - 10:47 PM.

[barrowraiderskid]

If a bunch backward looking old fogies want to walk away from the club because they don't like it, then all they are doing is possibly bringing forward the day of reckoning, They should be spending their energies on encouraging young support to get behind the club instead of spouting negativity, because when they pop their clogs there will be nobody there to keep the club afloat anyway. The rubbish spouted by the opponents of these arrangements is beyond belief.

The thing is why should oldham fans support their club? These feeder arrangements are removing aspects of why you support a team. Its a club which the fans are passionate about because of its tradition, the way its run and how it is involved in the local community. If you remove these things due to a feeder arrangement then what is there too get passionate about?

At the end of the day its a club not a business in the eyes of a lot of fans. The majority of fans are more interested than the club on the face of things rather than the financials behind it. If you take a step back and have no passion about something then you can more logically think about things and see how important the finances are, but I think its harsh to criticise someone loving there club so much that they don't want tothink about the financials as in many eyes its a club not a business as sport is something you generally use to take an interest away from the real world of finances.

[Padge]

How about publishing & explaining the rules that will apply to these partnerships thus allowing opinions to be formed on more than assumption, deduction or blind faith. Now that would be truly radical.

They'll be published in the next articles of membership and operational rules in the RFL along with the other documents the RFL publishes regularly.

[Padge]

The thing is why should oldham fans support their club? These feeder arrangements are removing aspects of why you support a team. Its a club which the fans are passionate about because of its tradition, the way its run and how it is involved in the local community. If you remove these things due to a feeder arrangement then what is there too get passionate about?

At the end of the day its a club not a business in the eyes of a lot of fans. The majority of fans are more interested than the club on the face of things rather than the financials behind it. If you take a step back and have no passion about something then you can more logically think about things and see how important the finances are, but I think its harsh to criticise someone loving there club so much that they don't want tothink about the financials as in many eyes its a club not a business as sport is something you generally use to take an interest away from the real world of finances.

Why did they (Outraged From Mumps etc.) support teams packed with Aussies and loan players from other clubs in the past, how is that 'representitive' of Oldham.

Edited by Padge, 27 November 2012 - 10:50 PM.