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Salford Trouble/Salford Takeover


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#361 Padge

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:27 PM

We have got money probably more than c@s. But for you to say it was an even contest that's not a comment we shouldn't have got anywhere near them Never mind beat them. There is a bigger gulf between champ one and champ two than their Is between the bottom of SL and top of the champ.Also the champ is more competitive and more entertaining to watch.

There is always a an opposite to probably and that is probably not, when you say probably what you are saying really is I hope.

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#362 thundergaz

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:33 PM

There is always a an opposite to probably and that is probably not, when you say probably what you are saying really is I hope.


I dont know how much they have got.But if i was a betting man i would say we have more than them.But i dont care whos got the millionaires,whos got the best ground and whos got the biggest fan base etc if you win the GF you should get promoted end of.

Edited by thundergaz, 19 December 2012 - 11:35 PM.


#363 Padge

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:36 PM

I dont know how much they have got.But if i was a betting man i would say we have more than them.But i dont care whos got the millionaires,whos got the best ground and whos got the biggest fan base etc if you win the GF you should bve promoted end of.

So give me some figures, how much more have you got?

Where is it coming from?

Breakdown of each clubs finances, perchance?

Do you have relatively more because of the division you play in?

Edited by Padge, 19 December 2012 - 11:38 PM.


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#364 The Parksider

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:36 PM

That sounds more like a plan to kill all the donkeys to me rather than one to fix the games problems.


What plan is that you speak of good sir??

Is it my suggestion to lower the salary cap, thus more can afford it and compete in SL. Simplistic stuff but correct in principle and isolation.

I'll suggest it again and again until people engage in it rather than default to "Superleague is rubbish, Licensing is rubbish, bring back P & R" :D

#365 thundergaz

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:42 PM

So give me some figures, how much more have you got?

Where is it coming from?

Breakdown of each clubs finances, perchance?

Do you have relatively more because of the division you play in?


All i will say is if we went into SL tomorrow we would stay there even if P&R came back.Im very confident of our finances that once we get in SL we will stay there.But like ive said before were not ready yet.But we will be when the next licensing comes into play.We are losing 100k a season but still can afford to pay out the full salary cap {we are the only team in our league to be paying the full cap this season}

Edited by thundergaz, 19 December 2012 - 11:45 PM.


#366 Padge

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:43 PM

What plan is that you speak of good sir??

Is it my suggestion to lower the salary cap, thus more can afford it and compete in SL. Simplistic stuff but correct in principle and isolation.

I'll suggest it again and again until people engage in it rather than default to "Superleague is rubbish, Licensing is rubbish, bring back P & R" :D

The problem is that you a driving finances down rather than working on bringing finances up.

We don't need ideas to use less money, we need ideas to generate more money.

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#367 The Parksider

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:43 PM

1. I dont know how much they have got.But if i was a betting man i would say we have more than them.

2. If you win the GF you should get promoted end of.


1. As I understand it Mr. Fulton has put in lump sums of £500K at Cas. I also note Cas have 7,000 paying fans.

Mr Campbell has managed to pop in a couple of hundred grand at Fev AFAIK. Mr. Nahaboo AFAIK has money but is yet to give significant amounts to Fev. Fev have 2,000 fans so I think Cas may have had more money.

2. Think beyond that. Is it fair to kick out the semi pro lads who won it?

Would you have less of a chance staying up if you had one year to get it right then three under licensing??

#368 Padge

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:44 PM

All i will say is if we went into SL tomorrow we would stay there even if P&R came back.Im very confident of our finances that once we get in SL we will stay there.But like ive said before were not ready yet.But we will be when the next licensing comes into play.

Pie in the Sky

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#369 thundergaz

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:49 PM

Pie in the Sky


You will see.Also its not my place to give figures etc. If our club wanted people to know our finances im sure they would publish them.The RFL will know how much we have when we apply for the next license.

#370 thundergaz

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:52 PM

1. As I understand it Mr. Fulton has put in lump sums of £500K at Cas. I also note Cas have 7,000 paying fans.

Mr Campbell has managed to pop in a couple of hundred grand at Fev AFAIK. Mr. Nahaboo AFAIK has money but is yet to give significant amounts to Fev. Fev have 2,000 fans so I think Cas may have had more money.

2. Think beyond that. Is it fair to kick out the semi pro lads who won it?

Would you have less of a chance staying up if you had one year to get it right then three under licensing??


I think we would stay up with just the one season.But yeah 3 would be good but i dont agree with that idea as i think it should be one up and one down every season so if we didnt stay up with that one season we wouldnt deserve to be in SL.

Edited by thundergaz, 19 December 2012 - 11:53 PM.


#371 The Parksider

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 11:54 PM

The problem is that you a driving finances down rather than working on bringing finances up.


Don't losing clubs who cannot compete and give up drive finances down?? Crowds drop and finances drop, rich men drop out?

Increase SL to 16 clubs that brings in more fans from Fev, Fax etc finances up.

Introduces more rich men, Mr, Nahaboo and Mr. Abbot - finances up.

Lower salary cap encourages Hudgell. O'Connor, Hughes, maybe even Wilko to keep putting in rather than giving up.

Finances up

Lower salary cap reduces wage spend Finances up

Forces top clubs to unload players to lower clubs more even game more interest finances up

It's a winner isn't it??

#372 Padge

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 12:00 AM

You will see.Also its not my place to give figures etc. If our club wanted people to know our finances im sure they would publish them.The RFL will know how much we have when we apply for the next license.

Here's a figure you can give, overall who has managed the better crowds in top flight RL, Fev or Cas.

Here's a question you can answer, given that we are told that nobody from Wakefield or Cas will ever in their entire life support Fev, how are Fev going to increase their average attendance to SL levels, given that most clubs over the years have doubled their average by mopping up surrounding latent RL support. How are Fev going to double their support from their last full top flight season to match today's modern clubs doubling of attendances at the lower end, and how will they quadruple it to compete with Wigan, Leeds, Saints etc. Don't forget, nobody from the surrounding districts, so we are continually told, will ever go to 'the enemy'.

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#373 Padge

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 12:04 AM

Don't losing clubs who cannot compete and give up drive finances down?? Crowds drop and finances drop, rich men drop out?

Increase SL to 16 clubs that brings in more fans from Fev, Fax etc finances up.

Introduces more rich men, Mr, Nahaboo and Mr. Abbot - finances up.

Lower salary cap encourages Hudgell. O'Connor, Hughes, maybe even Wilko to keep putting in rather than giving up.

Finances up

Lower salary cap reduces wage spend Finances up

Forces top clubs to unload players to lower clubs more even game more interest finances up

It's a winner isn't it??


Top clubs will unload players to other sports or similar foreign sports.

The idea that if Wigan have to offload either Tomkins or Charnley but can't keep both means that suddenly Salford could afford them against other competing sports clubs outside of European SL is naive on your part to say the least.

Edited by Padge, 20 December 2012 - 12:05 AM.


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#374 thundergaz

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 01:02 AM

Here's a figure you can give, overall who has managed the better crowds in top flight RL, Fev or Cas.

Here's a question you can answer, given that we are told that nobody from Wakefield or Cas will ever in their entire life support Fev, how are Fev going to increase their average attendance to SL levels, given that most clubs over the years have doubled their average by mopping up surrounding latent RL support. How are Fev going to double their support from their last full top flight season to match today's modern clubs doubling of attendances at the lower end, and how will they quadruple it to compete with Wigan, Leeds, Saints etc. Don't forget, nobody from the surrounding districts, so we are continually told, will ever go to 'the enemy'.


What as crowds got to do with it? Can you imagine the FA saying to the champ clubs you can't get promoted because you only have 10k fans but you need 30k to get in or your ground isn't good enough or you only have 5 mil to spend on players you need 20 mil etc etc etc its people like you that kill our sport and its romance. If you win promotion no matter who you are you should go up.

#375 Philius T Wilderbeest

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 01:08 AM

I like Featherstone and their fans, but to suggest that they're a bigger club than Castleford is utterly proposterous. I also admire the clubs ambition to get into Super League, but I'm afraid that no matter how many times they win the Championship, or how many new stands they erect, they're never going to get there. If Salford (hopefully not) go belly up, then it'll be full speed ahead for another French outfit - probably Toulouse. Featherstone just doesn't fit with the RFL's adherence to the laws of 'expansionism' - like it or not (for the record, I don't like it). In a European Super League age, where clubs have been mooted in Dublin, Barcelona and Glasgow, does anyone really believe that RL authorities are going to see a club from a tiny former pit village as the way forward for them?
Also, the top Championship clubs CAN compete with a number of SL clubs in one-off matches as we've witnessed in some recent CC ties, but there's still a massive gulf in playing quality that means the likes of Halifax, Sheffield, Leigh, Batley and Featherstone (as they are now) would get stuffed most weeks in SL.

#376 Johnoco

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 02:16 AM

What as crowds got to do with it? Can you imagine the FA saying to the champ clubs you can't get promoted because you only have 10k fans but you need 30k to get in or your ground isn't good enough or you only have 5 mil to spend on players you need 20 mil etc etc etc its people like you that kill our sport and its romance. If you win promotion no matter who you are you should go up.


A soccer club cannot go from the bottom division to the PL without spending millions and millions of pounds - that is a fact. How is that deciding things on the pitch? Its just who has the richest owner.
Yeah, on the face of it, things are decided by on field affairs but the reality is they are decided by the owners wallet.

And that's ok but RL is not sport???

#377 The Parksider

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 07:01 AM

Top clubs will unload players to other sports or similar foreign sports.The idea that if Wigan have to offload either Tomkins or Charnley but can't keep both means that suddenly Salford could afford them against other competing sports clubs outside of European SL is naive on your part to say the least.


Naive? Moi? :D

Just testing the obvious solution to financing Superleague so it can be a competetive elite league that pays it's way.

We see how HKR have settled on a £1.1M salary cap, no doubt Cas, Wakefield, Salford (if they survive), Bradford will be settling for something like the same. An uncompetitive rump on the bottom of Superleague weighing it down.

If Australian and Union clubs take Charnley, Tomkins and say another dozen top British talents off our clubs it takes the wages bill down. We still have a great game?

Problem solved to an extent. I'm not naive enough to not know that in solving one problem you create another one (or maybe two) but what do you think it/they would be?

#378 The Parksider

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 07:15 AM

I like Featherstone and their fans, but to suggest that they're a bigger club than Castleford is utterly proposterous. I also admire the clubs ambition to get into Super League, but I'm afraid that no matter how many times they win the Championship, or how many new stands they erect, they're never going to get there. If Salford (hopefully not) go belly up, then it'll be full speed ahead for another French outfit - probably Toulouse. Featherstone just doesn't fit with the RFL's adherence to the laws of 'expansionism' - like it or not (for the record, I don't like it). In a European Super League age, where clubs have been mooted in Dublin, Barcelona and Glasgow, does anyone really believe that RL authorities are going to see a club from a tiny former pit village as the way forward for them? Also, the top Championship clubs CAN compete with a number of SL clubs in one-off matches as we've witnessed in some recent CC ties, but there's still a massive gulf in playing quality that means the likes of Halifax, Sheffield, Leigh, Batley and Featherstone (as they are now) would get stuffed most weeks in SL.


A storming post, very good.

I think this question is easily answered because we have driven down on the matter of Featherstones resources many times and yes they come up short. However I am told Mr. Nahaboo and a close friend already in place as CEO? will be financing and running a Superleague bid and will be the difference. To stay on track this is very much akin to how Salford have run as a top division club most seasons since the old days of Brian Snape.

This is how London Broncos and Huddersfield work.

The Featherstone plan will I am told see the club pay full cap which can put them above the skint rump of Superleague clubs who will be simply "surviving". And everything works two ways in life. Padge can't have it both ways. If it is true (and I think it is) old local tribal loyalties are dying out and fans will gravitate to the nearest Superleague club then if Cas cannot survive in SL and if Newmarket didn't happen who is to say it won't be Featherstone coming up smelling of roses, signing the best Calder players (who will go where the wages are) and attracting the Calder area fans (who will go where the top players and entertainment is)?

The size of the place where the ground is isn't relevant as we see with Salford.......

Edited by The Parksider, 20 December 2012 - 07:19 AM.


#379 sweaty craiq

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 08:13 AM

Most top Championship clubs could move into SL and spend full cap for 1 maybe 2 years. The problem is sustaining that spend and increasing the player pool. quickly. Sheffield do not increase the player pool, Fev/Fax/Leigh would due to local RL culture. Fev will struggle in catchment area, Fax/Leigh have far more available support in the 1-5 mile radius. Fax/Leigh have a ground with the capacity to accomodate the gates needed to generate income, Fev don't even with the new patchwork stands.
If it came to a Fax/Leigh battle I believe Leigh are currently better placed due to the relationship with a fantastic revenue generating LSV. Both clubs have the box ticked to apply.'s
What is patently obvious is the heartland clubs of HKR/Cas/Wakey/Salford/Widnes have similar challenges and potentials to the Leigh/Fax/Fev/Oldham's barred from the elite. Either go to 2 tens or bring back P&R to allow clubs to have the dream and find their position through natures way, because in reality it is only these 9/10 clubs effected either way.

#380 Les Tonks Sidestep

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 09:16 AM

........ I believe Leigh are currently better placed due to the relationship with a fantastic revenue generating LSV.......


Really???????

How come an ex Leigh director over on RLFans is forever banging on about how, apart from ticket sales, Leigh generate very little/no income from the LSV?




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