289 replies to this topic

[Wellsy4HullFC]

i coach at junior level these days, i have some great lads in my team who are tremendous players to boot, i am sick and tired of contacting the local pro clubs to come and have look at these lads, one is so good he reminds me of a young version of vinty karalius. luckily he has been picked up by widnes

You're complaining even though he's been picked?

there are many lads i see week in week out playing for various teams who may never get the step up to the top flight because of our pro clubs fascination with all things antipodean. it is about time the rfl dropped the quota for all non genuine eu players to 1 per team to improve the stock of young british (and french) players in our pro game.......

Go on then, explain that one!

[creditwhereitsdews]

Hard to see where Wood's optimism comes from. 2013 is on course to be one of the most disastrous in its history.
A pie in the sky World Cup promising to be at least as farcical as 2000 - games in empty stadiums in Bristol, etc, an England team packed with Aussies (lets not start on Ireland and the like). Like many others on here I shall not be purchasing tickets and it will be the first time I've missed a tournament here since 1990.
On top of this is a Championship One with teams which will struggle to fulfil fixtures and see poor old Oldham and Rochdale cast adrift. Another pointless Championship season watched by fans feeling ostracised from the rest of the sport, and SL sucking up what's left of the game's dwindling resources to float along in its own little bubble. Plenty of fuel for the critics. But, hey, what the hell, we're RL fans - let's talk it up!
Er, no.

Edited by creditwhereitsdews, 02 January 2013 - 09:40 AM.

[Terry Mullaney]

Put the salary cap down as far as possible (couple of hundred grand), extend SL to 16 clubs such that most who want to be in are in go back to P & R so the one or two left can be promoted, but rejoice in a Superleague which has the two tiers in one. Top eight fight for the Superleage Trophy, bottom eight fight for survival.

Keighley and I suggested it weeks ago but all people wanted to do was continue moaning and swearing at each other.

So there we are there's how it can be done. Not sure of the downsides though. Up for discussion but don't hold your breath Terry.....

Right, four less teams in SL1 releases £5.2m sky money
20 CC clubs currently receiving £100k releases £2m
Total available = £7.2m
Divide £7.2m between 10 clubs in SL2 = £720k per annum per club

Im assuming the CC clubs which have paired up with SL clubs will be financially assisted in part by the SL club and the extra £120k which is allocated annually on top of their £1.3m per year.

I suggested this about four years ago before John Kear or anyone else did. Would this be a reasonable starting point or have I got my sums wrong? Please feel free to pull it apart and find as many holes in it as you can. At least it might lead to a constructive debate and maybe a feasible solution if one exists.

[Griff]

Disagree, the sport is Rugby League. The contest should be the the game and not how well you can kiss the RFLs but.

It's never just the game on the field, is it ? Even the lowliest of competitions has minimum standards that clubs have to met to compete in them.

Sharlston play in the Challenge Cup but not at t'Back o't'Wall.

I like the World Cup. I like seeing my clubs players play in it. I'll be going to as many games as I can.

I don't see what connection the World Cup has with p+r beyond stamping your foot and saying "Shan't!!".

[West Country Eagle]

Sheffield might refuse any promotion because they didn t have enough money. On the other hand, on the money they do have, how did they win the championship and make a profit, all from a point of extinction some few short years ago. They seem to be a very very well run club and, if they set their mind to it, it wouldn t surpise me if they came up with a strategy to make it work for them.

They've got a strategy and their aim is to make it in to SL at some point. From what I hear things are looking good on a number of fronts.

[Dave T]

If SL clubs dont take some cost cutting measures, That league is going to collapse. How many teams need to be in deep trouble before it becomes apparent the present level of wages and salary cap is not capable of being sustained.

If some players are lost to the game, then so be it, better than losing the whole game.

They have done this with the youth restructuring, yet they got lambasted for this.

[sweaty craiq]

Some Championship clubs get a bit more than others in 'Development support' for example how many 'Development Officers' also play for Sheffield? and how much money does Sheffield receive from the central funds directly or ortherwise?.

The connection the world cup has got with disillusioned fans is patently obvious, wasn't there an old saying that goes something like 'you can't truly hate something unless you have previously loved it'

I will be attending 3/4 games and haven't bought tickets yet, but as of now it doesn't excite me like 95 did and I am going in spite of the sheeeite that comes from the top.

[sweaty craiq]

They have done this with the youth restructuring, yet they got lambasted for this.

This is the problem, we are not letting the laws of nature take place and are setting budgets based upon mediocrity. If you can't operate to a minimum cap and sustain/grow the player pool - what the fcuk are you doing in a SUPER league.

[West Country Eagle]

Right, four less teams in SL1 releases £5.2m sky money
20 CC clubs currently receiving £100k releases £2m
Total available = £7.2m
Divide £7.2m between 10 clubs in SL2 = £720k per annum per club

Im assuming the CC clubs which have paired up with SL clubs will be financially assisted in part by the SL club and the extra £120k which is allocated annually on top of their £1.3m per year.

I suggested this about four years ago before John Kear or anyone else did. Would this be a reasonable starting point or have I got my sums wrong? Please feel free to pull it apart and find as many holes in it as you can. At least it might lead to a constructive debate and maybe a feasible solution if one exists.

The "two SL divisions of 10 with automatic promotion and relegation between them" makes some sense. If the RFL could find a few more CC1 clubs, four divisions of 10 would make a lot of sense - P&R between all of them. Money distributed more fairly between SL1 and SL2.

Lots of club Chairmen in the bottom half of SL and top half of the Championship are keen on this. I suspect the top clubs (Leeds, Wigan, Wire, Saints etc) would also be keen on this. Teams from SL2 may only ever have one season in the top flight, or 'yo-yo' like some football clubs, but it would appease those who want fairness/promotion and relegation, and allow Fev, Fax, Sheffield (or whoever) to get their wish of playing in the top flight. If SL1 teams get into financial problems, they could be automatically relegated and rebuild in SL2.

At present the SL competition isn't as competitive as it should be. Two divisions of 10 may be more competitive, especially if current Championship clubs get a bit more cash.

[Dave T]

Hard to see where Wood's optimism comes from. 2013 is on course to be one of the most disastrous in its history.
A pie in the sky World Cup promising to be at least as farcical as 2000 - games in empty stadiums in Bristol, etc, an England team packed with Aussies (lets not start on Ireland and the like). Like many others on here I shall not be purchasing tickets and it will be the first time I've missed a tournament here since 1990.

But, hey, what the hell, we're RL fans - let's talk it up!

I for one am glad you aren't going, I'd hate to be stuck next to you at the many games that I will be attending.
Your last line is truly laughable!

[West Country Eagle]

Some Championship clubs get a bit more than others in 'Development support' for example how many 'Development Officers' also play for Sheffield? and how much money does Sheffield receive from the central funds directly or ortherwise?.

Not as much as you think. Andrew Henderson and Mitch Stringer are coaches for the Eagles, but I think only the latter is part funded by the RFL. The Eagles have a good development programme, but they pay for it themselves largely, sometimes with grants etc. There are development staff in the Midlands - I think - also part funded by the Eagles.

Many clubs use "development coach" roles to pay for players - look at Keighley with Sam Obst etc. Singling out Sheffield is a bit harsh, and certainly unfair. Besides, any money Sheffield get for development, schools coaches etc is actually spent on that.

Remember, Fev and Sheffield are the only Championship clubs running academy sides. They find money to do that themselves, as they get no support (unlike SL clubs) to do it from the RFL.

[Robin Evans]

It's never just the game on the field, is it ? Even the lowliest of competitions has minimum standards that clubs have to met to compete in them.

Sharlston play in the Challenge Cup but not at t'Back o't'Wall.

I like the World Cup. I like seeing my clubs players play in it. I'll be going to as many games as I can.

I don't see what connection the World Cup has with p+r beyond stamping your foot and saying "Shan't!!".

and thats fair enough Richie. Enjoy the competition.

I indeed am stamping my foot and registrring my disquiet.
I am thst naffed off with the game I want nowt to do with any aspect of it beyond my club and the cc. Thats the connrction.
Im sure the world, rugby league, the world cup and SL will get on fine without me.

[The Parksider]

They've got a strategy and their aim is to make it in to SL at some point. From what I hear things are looking good on a number of fronts.

Things look good on a number of fronts for Featherstone WCE but unfortunately you always end up having to win the war on the financial front. I'll probably post this another hundred times, but the gap is clear. Championship clubs turnover around £1M and top SL clubs like Les catalans turn over £6M. It's a £5M gap £1.2M from SKY and a couple of thousand more fans can't close.

[The Parksider]

The "two SL divisions of 10 with automatic promotion and relegation between them" makes some sense. Money distributed more fairly between SL1 and SL2.

Lots of club Chairmen in the bottom half of SL and top half of the Championship are keen on this. I suspect the top clubs (Leeds, Wigan, Wire, Saints etc) would also be keen on this. Teams from SL2 may only ever have one season in the top flight, or 'yo-yo' like some football clubs, but it would appease those who want fairness/promotion and relegation, and allow Fev, Fax, Sheffield (or whoever) to get their wish of playing in the top flight.

At present the SL competition isn't as competitive as it should be. Two divisions of 10 may be more competitive, especially if current Championship clubs get a bit more cash.

The only way over the massive financial gap has been Mr. Sugar Daddy, thats a clear fact and so the answer lies in a financial restructure. On this two divisions of 10 the elephant in the room is the monetary distribution of SKY funds.

1. SKY have only ever shown interest in funding a top league.

2. Watering down the funding reduces the wages the top clubs can pay to keep the best players.

It may be a gross assumption that in a "two tier SL" (which it's not, the so called SL2 is a second division) the money will be distributed down into a second tier.

How on earth would clubs who don't want to be in Superleague like Batley justify receiving any funding from SKY??

What would SL2 clubs do with their money?? Inflate wages??

This option is fine by me - sounds great fun, but I can't equate Superleague greed to such extensive philanthropy?

[The Parksider]

Right, four less teams in SL1 releases £5.2m sky money

20 CC clubs currently receiving £100k releases £2m

Total available = £7.2m

Divide £7.2m between 10 clubs in SL2 = £720k per annum per club

I suggested this about four years ago before John Kear or anyone else did. Would this be a reasonable starting point or have I got my sums wrong? Please feel free to pull it apart and find as many holes in it as you can. At least it might lead to a constructive debate and maybe a feasible solution if one exists.

It's another version of lets give SKY money to a second division.

They just don't allow that. At least to date.

What are the SL2 clubs going to do with £720,000?? Double the wages of second division players??

If you just want P & R for the sake of it, then just stay as we are and do one up one down.

Or extend to 16 clubs and do one up one down to be more inclusive.

Let the same old smaller clubs (Cas, Leigh, Fax, Salford, Fev, HKR) just yo yo up and down for the rest of the century.

That's fine, I used to enjoy that....

If you want the opportunity to assist clubs to make it in Superleague then give them a license for three ye.....

SORRY Terry.

If we are to have a distribution of SKY money (which is inadeqate anyway) beyond the top division then my question is what will second tier clubs do with it? To what avail??

Edited by The Parksider, 02 January 2013 - 10:50 AM.

[Johnoco]

Hard to see where Wood's optimism comes from. 2013 is on course to be one of the most disastrous in its history.
A pie in the sky World Cup promising to be at least as farcical as 2000 - games in empty stadiums in Bristol, etc, an England team packed with Aussies (lets not start on Ireland and the like). Like many others on here I shall not be purchasing tickets and it

If you knew a little more, you'd know that the WC this year, has been much better promoted and orgsanised than ever before with decent sales a year ahead of the comp, so not sure how that promises to be as farcical as 2000.

Secondly, 'an England tea packed with Aussies?'......er like who? The only cast iron 'non Englishman' I can think of is Chase, who is a) not an Aussie and b ) plenty of people are not happy about either but that's modern sport, check out the cricket or RU team for more examples. England have some genuine talent, whether that

'Ireland and the like'? Well for the first time ever, we have proper, genuine, talk with proper accents and everything, Irish Scottish and Welsh players playing for their countries -and not because they are RU imports. Compare this with the 1990 Ireland team...oh hang on they didn't have one.

Your last line about 'let's talk it up -we're RL fans' goes down in history as an all time classic, absolutely gold. It genuinely made me LOL.

[tim2]

There are development staff in the Midlands - I think - also part funded by the Eagles.

No there aren't. There was one employed by the Eagles, but all the funding came from the RFL, the Chargers and Derby City. That post has now gone with the cuts and we, and the Eagles, are still unclear about what is going to happen, if anything, from April onwards.

[Dave T]

It's another version of lets give SKY money to a second division.

They just don't allow that. At least to date.

This keeps getting quoted - yet nobody has ever shown any proof. The fact is that SLE will naturally want the funds staying in the top division for its member clubs. I'm not sure Sky will be that bothered as long as they get their games that they are paying for.

The FA Premier League do not keep all of their TV funding to themselves, parachute payments etc. and funding to other areas happen, so there is no reason why Sky would be demanding that RL has to direct all of its funding to SL clubs.

[Robin Evans]

There may be a contractural clause (we dont know and why woukd we?) Directing a % of the divvy up from sky goes to the top teir - regatdless of how many clubs constitute thst top teir.
Re-negotiation of that contract might not be as simple as we might think! Hence re-structuring the game may not be so easy! Perhaps?

[sweaty craiq]

RU second tier get £300k plus and is shown on Sky, in winter with an abundance of other sport to screen, 4 divisions of soccer and RU Premiership