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Rugby League World - April 2014
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And the Winner of the Golden Boot is...

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#141 Wiltshire Rhino

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 10:46 AM

I'll bring this point up again, do you really believe Kevin Sinfield is the best player in the world because I would love to hear valid reasons as to why he is.

It depends on what you want from the World's Best Player. If you want amazing individual feats of skill etc then Ben Barba, Sam Tomkins etc would win it every year.

If you want a player who leads and raises the player level of his entire team then Sir Kev or Cameron Smith is your man.

If someone offered Cameron Smith to lead the Leeds Rhinos I'd say "No thanks, we have Sir Kev!"

#142 Dave T

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 10:50 AM

It depends on what you want from the World's Best Player. If you want amazing individual feats of skill etc then Ben Barba, Sam Tomkins etc would win it every year.

If you want a player who leads and raises the player level of his entire team then Sir Kev or Cameron Smith is your man.

If someone offered Cameron Smith to lead the Leeds Rhinos I'd say "No thanks, we have Sir Kev!"

and thats great, but why ignore the 5th place finish and the Challenge Cup Final?
Large parts of the season are being ignored with this award.
Best captain - maybe.
Most inspirational - aye.
Best player in the world in 2012 - hmm.

#143 T-Dub

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 11:24 AM

well done sir kev .

as i understand it then its for the outstanding acheivmments of 2012 that the golden boot is awarded so that would be

captain of a challenge cup final team
captain of the 2012 champions
captain of the unbeaten england team in 2012
captain of the world club champions 2012
leading goalkicker in world top tier rugby league 2012
leading points scorer in world top tier rugby league 2012
most drop goals in super league 2012
longest unbroken playing run in british rugby league

on top of that he been the most important player for the super league champions in 2012


add to that...

played more games last season than anyone (every game in the SL, CC and WCC, along with Zak Hardacre and Ryan Hall)
played every minute of every game (except 10 mins v Bradford in the bin!)
did it all through the whole season with an injured wrist

That palmares is a match for anyones

#144 T-Dub

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 11:27 AM

I still don't think you can compare Sinfield's achievements with Cam Smith - captained Storm to the Premiership, led Queensland to another SOO win, led Australia in their wins ( although I'm not sure how many games they played!) - but I haven't seen SL this year so hard to judge


I suspect youre not alone in that...

#145 T-Dub

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 11:30 AM

He won an award a British Magazine Panel gave out, yep congratulations.


Well instigate an Aussie version then, like your mob do with the rules...

... and include The Ricky Stuart Award For Graceless Losers and we can chooses from an unending list of Aussie candidates

#146 flyingking

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 11:42 AM

Conversely you could turn the question round and ask why has the fifth most consistent team appeared in every final for the last three years and emerged as champions each season? Form suggests that should not happen but clearly the Rhinos are finding inspiration to lift themselves higher. I think that the award in part recognises Sinfield's role in bridging that gap between Leeds and the top four finishers.
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#147 boxhead

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 11:46 AM

i've asked RLW on twitter but never got a answer.......i've figured its pretty much anyone that writes for the magazine...plus selected former ex players.

Thanks Spud.
Why are the Judges some secret panel that can not be named, someone suggested Wally Lewis was a Judge, I would be surprised if that was the case in 2012.
Why can the judges not be named and their experience and knowledge in choosing the right player be celebrated? surely it would give a lot more credence to an award.

Without having any idea who the mysterious men who decide who the Winner is it just looks like an English Rugby League Magazine deciding on who wins the award and that is linked to how many copies of their product they will sell and having some controversy may not be a bad thing.

#148 1jordy

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 11:47 AM

Well instigate an Aussie version then, like your mob do with the rules...

... and include The Ricky Stuart Award For Graceless Losers and we can chooses from an unending list of Aussie candidates


Like I've mentioned in a previous post, I rate Sam Tomkins highly and would not have complained had he won it especially last year where he consistently dominated domestically as well as a fantastic Four Nations, but Kevin Sinfield, your having a laugh aren't ya, he isn't a better captain than Smith, he didn't accomplish more on the field than Smith considering Smith won everything there is to win including Origin and victories over New Zealand but Sinfield didn't win the cup with Leeds, he doesn't have the quality of Smith, he didn't make the Super league team of the year, he had a fantastic grand final matched with a poor Cup Final, so is it accurate to judge who the best in the world is on one single game granted it was a good performance, I look at the entire year and Smith was by far more consistent, Leeds finished 5th, it's not like he had the greatest of regular seasons this year but apparently is still the best in the world, if he did he might have even been named the best player at Leeds this year an award given to Ryan Hall, so if his own club doesn't think he is the best at their own team why would he be the best in the world?

Who knows he might actually have a good World Cup, destroy Australia and prove me wrong but considering his performances pretty much every time he as ever faced Australia and considering the fact that he has gone missing in almost every game he has ever played against them, I highly doubt it, don't remember him ever playing well against us to be honest.

Edited by 1jordy, 05 January 2013 - 11:57 AM.

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#149 Phil

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 12:02 PM

I give up!!! It's official, the vast majority of RL fans don't deserve this great game. In the main we are a set of graceless, whingeing, sullen bastards who would rather moan and pour scorn on the game than celebrate it and its players.

Well done to those of you who recognise Sinfields contributions over the years.

Aussies? Well what do you expect from them?

The rest of you? Give up, go watch something else, you obviously don't like RL.

Edited by Phil, 05 January 2013 - 12:02 PM.

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#150 Dave T

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 12:06 PM

I give up!!! It's official, the vast majority of RL fans don't deserve this great game. In the main we are a set of graceless, whingeing, sullen bastards who would rather moan and pour scorn on the game than celebrate it and its players.

Well done to those of you who recognise Sinfields contributions over the years.

Aussies? Well what do you expect from them?

The rest of you? Give up, go watch something else, you obviously don't like RL.

I get it. So if you agree that Sinfield is the best player in the world then we can stay and watch, whereas if we have the sheer audacity to suggest that there may have been a better player in 2012 then we should watch something else?

Isn't this kind of discussion exactly what these kind of awards are for? Don;t be so precious ffs!

#151 1jordy

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 12:07 PM

I give up!!! It's official, the vast majority of RL fans don't deserve this great game. In the main we are a set of graceless, whingeing, sullen bastards who would rather moan and pour scorn on the game than celebrate it and its players.

Well done to those of you who recognise Sinfields contributions over the years.

Aussies? Well what do you expect from them?

The rest of you? Give up, go watch something else, you obviously don't like RL.


I was under the impression that people are allowed to have their opinions, this place would be very boring if everyone agreed with each other, suck it up princess, if you think Kevin Sinfield is the best in the world then that's your opinion, this isn't a lifetime achievement award and this isn't the whoes contributed the most over the past few years award, this is the award for the best footballer in the world for 2012.

Edited by 1jordy, 05 January 2013 - 12:13 PM.

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#152 boxhead

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 12:10 PM

I give up!!! It's official, the vast majority of RL fans don't deserve this great game. In the main we are a set of graceless, whingeing, sullen bastards who would rather moan and pour scorn on the game than celebrate it and its players.

Well done to those of you who recognise Sinfields contributions over the years.

Aussies? Well what do you expect from them?

The rest of you? Give up, go watch something else, you obviously don't like RL.


You don't care who decides a "Prestigious " award?
I have already posted my congratulations to Kevin Sinfield.
I would just like to know the famous ex players and media pundits that decide the criteria on winning an award, without knowing the system it makes the award somewhat meaninglessness doesn't it?
Regardless if is Cam Smith, Sir Kevin or Andy Capp, surely knowledge of the decision making and by who makes it is a reasonable question?
No?

#153 1jordy

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 12:17 PM

You don't care who decides a "Prestigious " award?
I have already posted my congratulations to Kevin Sinfield.
I would just like to know the famous ex players and media pundits that decide the criteria on winning an award, without knowing the system it makes the award somewhat meaninglessness doesn't it?
Regardless if is Cam Smith, Sir Kevin or Andy Capp, surely knowledge of the decision making and by who makes it is a reasonable question?
No?


This might answer your question


Martyn Sadler, chairman of League Publications Ltd, said: "Kevin can't move as quickly as Ben Barba, or with the elusiveness of Sam Tomkins, while Cameron Smith's ability close to the ruck is surely second to none.
"But Sinfield is a supreme captain, and only Cameron Smith can rival his leadership, while Sinfield's goal-kicking success rate in 2012 was 82.84%, compared to 69.64% for Smith.
"In the Super League Grand Final Sinfield kicked five out of five, from all over the pitch, and that after he had been knocked out earlier by a challenge to the head. What he did in that game goes beyond what could reasonably be expected, even of a Golden Boot winner."

For what I got from that, they seamed to have given the award based on one game not the entire season which makes no sense to me

Edited by 1jordy, 05 January 2013 - 12:17 PM.

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#154 keighley

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 12:45 PM

He didn't even win Leeds Rhino player of the year or make the super league team of the year but is apparently the best in the world, he bombed in the Challenge Cup Final, has gone missing everytime England have played Australia unlike guys like Ryan Hall who actually did damage against them, Cameron Smith however captained his sides to everything there is to win, Origin, Wins over NZ, his club to a premiership, and above all that, he has alot more quality than Mr Sinfield, I read the reasoning the Panel came up with from the Rugby league World Magazine which is kind of ironic considering it's a British Magazine, they basically said he deserved it because he played awesome in the Grand Final despite getting knocked out, so basically getting beat up in the grand final is what swayed it for him and being a better goal kicker, last time I checked this isn't the best Goal Kicker in the world award, but is apparently the difference between him and Smith, I don't remember Pacquiao receiving any awards after he was knocked out by Marquez, just saying, 1 good game should not cancel out the rest of the years ones, I did watch Super League this season on Euro Sport here in Australia as well as the NRL and Smith was by far the more consistent over the entire season not to mention what he accomplished on a rep level as well as club.



Martyn Sadler, chairman of League Publications Ltd, said: "Kevin can't move as quickly as Ben Barba, or with the elusiveness of Sam Tomkins, while Cameron Smith's ability close to the ruck is surely second to none.
"But Sinfield is a supreme captain, and only Cameron Smith can rival his leadership, while Sinfield's goal-kicking success rate in 2012 was 82.84%, compared to 69.64% for Smith.
"In the Super League Grand Final Sinfield kicked five out of five, from all over the pitch, and that after he had been knocked out earlier by a challenge to the head. What he did in that game goes beyond what could reasonably be expected, even of a Golden Boot winner."




If this was the toughest and bravest in the world award, maybe he might get it but that would probably go to Paul Wood considering he lost part of his manhood and still finished a game, but this is supposed to be the award for the best footballer in the world and that is not Kevin Sinfield.


Sinfield is not big, not fast and not particularly elusive. So why would he ever come into consideration for this award. What does he do that is so good.?

Well he does many things well and the sum of the parts is a great player.

He is versatile, he can play halfback, loose forward or hooker ( in fact when he played hooker for England he was better than when he played halfback)

He can launch long passes to put his wings or other outside backs into space or he can gave sublime little short passes to put forwards through the gaps.

He also has the ability to back up other players and finish off moves with a try ( who else thought to support Ablett for his try in the grand final, he came from nowhere to finish off that move.)

He can and does tackle effectivley.

His kicking game is a major weapon in his arsenal. He launches cross field kicks to he corner that allow Hall to be as good as he is, he launches high bombs that paralyse the opposition defenders as again was typified by the kick that Ablett claimed when he put Sinfield in to score in the grand final. His goalkicking is extraordinary and it is still an integral part of the game. His accuracy won the semi final against Wigan as well as a drop goal at a critical point in the game and cemented the win against Warrington by putting the score out of reach.

He gets up off the floor and refuses to be intimidated as in the final. In the semi final he also received some heavy tackles. In that game Leeds were away at the league leaders and appeared to have a game plan of pinning Wigan in their own half with kicks and pushing the score along on scraps, goals, drop goals and he was the captain, the on field general for the coach and also the kicker and he executed the game plan perfectly to pull off the shock victory.

His leadership skills have been mentioned and he is the glue that molds that very good Leeds team together. He has taken a team of mostly British players and beaten the best the game has to offer in the UK for 5 out of the last 6 years.

He has done all this with a physique and speed of Mr Everyman. To me, a players player and a leader of men. He deserves the honour
for his all around accomplishments. The complete player.

#155 JohnM

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:16 PM

To have any weight, opinions should, I think be based on fact, observation, experience, evidence, debate etc. I've see Sinfield only a few times this season and his competitors even less. Thus I am inclined to accept the views of a panel of experts who have collectively more facts, more evidence and clearly more credibility than l have. ..So well done KS. In addition, though not being entirely innocent myself, am I alone in geeting increasingly fed up at the constant stream of criticism that seems to be a feature of the forum?

#156 1jordy

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:16 PM

Sinfield is not big, not fast and not particularly elusive. So why would he ever come into consideration for this award. What does he do that is so good.?

Well he does many things well and the sum of the parts is a great player.

He is versatile, he can play halfback, loose forward or hooker ( in fact when he played hooker for England he was better than when he played halfback)

He can launch long passes to put his wings or other outside backs into space or he can gave sublime little short passes to put forwards through the gaps.

He also has the ability to back up other players and finish off moves with a try ( who else thought to support Ablett for his try in the grand final, he came from nowhere to finish off that move.)

He can and does tackle effectivley.

His kicking game is a major weapon in his arsenal. He launches cross field kicks to he corner that allow Hall to be as good as he is, he launches high bombs that paralyse the opposition defenders as again was typified by the kick that Ablett claimed when he put Sinfield in to score in the grand final. His goalkicking is extraordinary and it is still an integral part of the game. His accuracy won the semi final against Wigan as well as a drop goal at a critical point in the game and cemented the win against Warrington by putting the score out of reach.

He gets up off the floor and refuses to be intimidated as in the final. In the semi final he also received some heavy tackles. In that game Leeds were away at the league leaders and appeared to have a game plan of pinning Wigan in their own half with kicks and pushing the score along on scraps, goals, drop goals and he was the captain, the on field general for the coach and also the kicker and he executed the game plan perfectly to pull off the shock victory.

His leadership skills have been mentioned and he is the glue that molds that very good Leeds team together. He has taken a team of mostly British players and beaten the best the game has to offer in the UK for 5 out of the last 6 years.

He has done all this with a physique and speed of Mr Everyman. To me, a players player and a leader of men. He deserves the honour
for his all around accomplishments. The complete player.


Pretty much everything you mentioned Cameron Smith can do equally if not better in my opinion,

Passing Game - Cameron Smith is one of the best passers in the NRL especially when he runs from Dummy Half and sets up attacks and Line Breaks for guys like Slater and Cronk, it's a key part of the Storm attack, wouldn't be able to tell you how many of his passes have lead to line breaks, Line break assists would be off the chart.

Kicking Game - Kicking game is sublime, go back and watch Origin 1, his kicking game was what won QLD that game, the game was in their own half for about 10 minutes, 2 or 3 incredible long range kicks and QLD got control of the game and went on to win when all the momentum was with the opposition, plenty of the Storms tries came from his kicks, most of them to Slater.

Tackling - Smith has been considered for many years as the best defender in Rugby league, has averaged over 40 tackles a game for as long as I can remember.

Versatility - Maybe goes to Sinfield as Smith doesn't move from Half Back or Hooker.

Support Play - Well that's more of a backs role not a Hookers but look at most of the Storm tries and Cam will pretty much play a key role in setting all of them up.

Toughness - Him, Slater and Cronk get targeted more than Hot Chips at an all you can eat buffet and still manage to suck it up and play their natural games.

Ruck play - This is where he excels - no one in the game of Rugby league controls the Ruck like he does, i'd argue the Ruck is one of if not the most important part of the game

Leadership Skills - Probably even I guess, although Cameron does have better consistency in his game than Kevin, Cameron did have the pressure of taking the captaincy from Lockyer with all the media and fans pressure that come with it and still lead Australia to wins over New Zealand, wins over NSW I already mentioned how important he was in origin 1 and his team to a premiership, Kevin lead his team to 5th on the table and a cup final loss, Grand Final performance was exceptional, I did watch the game on Euro Sport and thought he played well but one game still doesn't make you the best in the world.

Size - Smith isn't the biggest of guys either, still manages 40+ tackles and still barely misses any.

Some good points though but I still think Cam does the basics better than anyone despite not being Flashy like a Tomkins, Hall and a Slater. Based on what the Chairman of the magazine said does Cameron have to get knocked out to win this award?

Im not even a QLD fan and I hate the club he plays for but I respect him as a footballer just like I respect guys like Tomkins, Hall, Charnley, S Burgess.

Edited by 1jordy, 05 January 2013 - 01:21 PM.

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#157 roughyedspud

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:17 PM

Thanks Spud.
Why are the Judges some secret panel that can not be named, someone suggested Wally Lewis was a Judge, I would be surprised if that was the case in 2012.
Why can the judges not be named and their experience and knowledge in choosing the right player be celebrated? surely it would give a lot more credence to an award.

Without having any idea who the mysterious men who decide who the Winner is it just looks like an English Rugby League Magazine deciding on who wins the award and that is linked to how many copies of their product they will sell and having some controversy may not be a bad thing.


i asked steve mascord this morning if he voted....he said know,he used to do it but was'nt asked this year..

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#158 boxhead

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:22 PM

Why are the Judges some secret panel that can not be named, someone suggested Wally Lewis was a Judge, I would be surprised if that was the case in 2012.
Why can the judges not be named and their experience and knowledge in choosing the right player be celebrated? surely it would give a lot more credence to an award.

Without having any idea who the mysterious men who decide who the Winner is it just looks like an English Rugby League Magazine deciding on who wins the award and that is linked to how many copies of their product they will sell and having some controversy may not be a bad thing.

#159 1jordy

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:23 PM

To have any weight, opinions should, I think be based on fact, observation, experience, evidence, debate etc. I've see Sinfield only a few times this season and his competitors even less. Thus I am inclined to accept the views of a panel of experts who have collectively more facts, more evidence and clearly more credibility than l have. ..So well done KS. In addition, though not being entirely innocent myself, am I alone in geeting increasingly fed up at the constant stream of criticism that seems to be a feature of the forum?


It's what makes this place fun, complaining, arguing and conflicting opinions, would be boring if everyone agreed with each other.
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#160 roughyedspud

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:29 PM

Why are the Judges some secret panel that can not be named, someone suggested Wally Lewis was a Judge, I would be surprised if that was the case in 2012.
Why can the judges not be named and their experience and knowledge in choosing the right player be celebrated? surely it would give a lot more credence to an award.

Without having any idea who the mysterious men who decide who the Winner is it just looks like an English Rugby League Magazine deciding on who wins the award and that is linked to how many copies of their product they will sell and having some controversy may not be a bad thing.


this is from last year

http://blogs.bettor....players-a111066

The Golden Boot Award is a rugby league award which is handed out towards the end of each year by Rugby League World magazine for player's distinguished contributions. The honour is given out usually in December, when all matches of the year have been played, to the player who is recognised as the best player in the league. The process of sifting out the best rugby league player is achieved through polling done by former players and international rugby league journalists.
The board featuring former Golden Boot winners Ellery Hanley, Garry Schofield, Wally Lewis and Brett Kenny will choose the recepient of the award. Fans can also cast votes for their favourite players. The finalised result will be announced on December 2.


Edited by roughyedspud, 05 January 2013 - 01:31 PM.

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