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#41 Exiled Townie

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 02:06 PM

It was a bit more than promotion of RU actually, our head of PE would tell the pupils that they had to play for the school i.e. RU ahead of the local RL club and if the did not they would be banned from playing league, quoting some regulation that I don't remember anymore. I know ir's all lies now but at 11/12 its difficult tp believe a senior teacher would so blatently lie. Thankfully the RL club coach would always reassure that it didn't matter what anyone said he would still pick us if we wanted to play

In Workington, (late 60's early 70's) I played union for the school (all we were allowed to play as PE teacher played for Netherhall ru,) union on Saturday afternoon for Workington Zebras and league on Sundays for Workington Boys club. When I was 16 I was taken to one side by the union coach (ooh er missus) and told that I had to decide which code I wanted to play as once I reached 17, if I continued to play league, I would be 'banned for life' from playing union. This was the norm then.

As for league in schools, down here at St Albans we had a very, very keen RL development coach. At one point he had senior schools in Potters Bar, Welwyn Garden City, Hatfield and St Albans all playing against each other in various age groups. Schools were contacting him to come along and teach their pupils. Then junior schools began getting in touch and asking for training and games. We could have done with three development officers. Unfortunately local union clubs didn't like this and they began offering their services at schools as well (well, rugby is rugby to someone not in the know). Now our development officer has retrurned to Aus in August last year, and we are waiting to see if we will be getting another one with all the cut backs etc. In the mean time, there is very little league now in senior schools after all the good ground work already done. The Dev Oficer from Hemel helped out after ours left but I believe covering both areas was just too much.
The good news is that we have a minis set up that is doing sterling work with junior schools children at the moment (all volunteers).

Edited by Exiled Townie, 06 January 2013 - 02:11 PM.

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#42 bowes

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 02:14 PM

1,678 teams took part in The Carnegie Champion Schools tournament, which was an increase of 175 from the previous year. http://www.therfl.co...championschools

Broncos Champion Schools Competition http://www.londonbro...ion_schools.php
RL seems to be doing well in a 10 mile square in SW London/NW Surrey. I'm guessing about 10-20 schools. All the secondary schools in Kingston-upon-Thames http://www.kingstonssp.co.uk/?_id=586 now play RL. There's also RL in Elmbridge (i.e. Weybridge), Richmond and Feltham. Thomas Knyvett in Ashford Middx has taken it up this year - it's the sister school to Howard of Effingham, who won at Wembley.

actually forgot about Richmond they're the only actual junior club in west London. There's more development in Surrey though

#43 keighley

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 02:22 PM

The figure was just for the Carnegie schools competition.

My son's school (in Surrey) does teach RL, but it's predominately a Union school (actually it's first and foremost a soccer school). They don't have a RL team as far as I am aware, but you can see with a bit of a push it could easily grow.


From an old man's point of view, you have no idea how amazing a statement that is. As can be seen from other posts the game had difficulty being played in the schools in the North and a school in Surrey playing the game was in the realms of pure fantasy. No wonder the RU fought against the "free gangway" rulings tooth and nail. The relaxation of such and the end of the :"Rules as to professionalism:" led to such things as your son's school in Surrey playing RL. With any luck it will ultimately lead to our game overtaking their unattractive version of Rugby It was fear of our game and class warfare at it's worst.

The way things went on in the past in the RU v RL relationship was like the way the black population in the US was treated after the abolition of slavery. Yes, you are free, but don't dare to want to enter our schools and live in our neighbourhood and if you do we will make life very uncomfortable for you.

#44 tw15

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 02:31 PM

From an old man's point of view, you have no idea how amazing a statement that is. As can be seen from other posts the game had difficulty being played in the schools in the North and a school in Surrey playing the game was in the realms of pure fantasy. No wonder the RU fought against the "free gangway" rulings tooth and nail. The relaxation of such and the end of the :"Rules as to professionalism:" led to such things as your son's school in Surrey playing RL. With any luck it will ultimately lead to our game overtaking their unattractive version of Rugby It was fear of our game and class warfare at it's worst. The way things went on in the past in the RU v RL relationship was like the way the black population in the US was treated after the abolition of slavery. Yes, you are free, but don't dare to want to enter our schools and live in our neighbourhood and if you do we will make life very uncomfortable for you.


Union still dominates in Surrey, and there are only handful of RL clubs outside of the schools. Staines Rugby Club (Union) shares with Staines Titans (League), but I'm not sure if all union clubs would be happy to share with a League club. The reason for the growth in Surrey has a lot to do with the Broncos. London Irish Rugby Union club also works in the area, from its original Sunbury base. I suspect League is even more attractive, in comparison to Union, for girls. The school figures are for both sexes, so the growth might not result in affecting Super League.

Edited by tw15, 06 January 2013 - 02:36 PM.


#45 keighley

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 02:45 PM

Union still dominates in Surrey, and there are only handful of RL clubs outside of the schools. Staines Rugby Club (Union) shares with Staines Titans (League), but I'm not sure if all union clubs would be happy to share with a League club. The reason for the growth in Surrey has a lot to do with the Broncos. London Irish Rugby Union club also works in the area, from its original Sunbury base. I suspect League is even more attractive, in comparison to Union, for girls. The school figures are for both sexes, so the growth might not result in an effect on Super League.


Yes, I appreciate that RU is still the dominant code there but prior to the free gangway, it was not possible to have any significant RL presence due to the banning of most likely recruits from playing and their complete ostracisation from their friends and social strata if they did see the light.

From small acorns, huge oaks grow, and eventually all this will lead to RL being part of the culture down South as it is in the North and this should transalate to crowd growth for the Broncos. Your point on the girls game is very relevant. Not only do they grow up to have their own disposable income which could end up being spent on attending RL games but they also go on to become mothers, which could influence whether or not their children take up the game in the future. This point is also very relevant in the heartlands. Females are over 50% of the population and are a demographic we should be targeting.

#46 marklaspalmas

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 02:59 PM

Excuse me sir, but I think you'll find you're in the wrong discussion. ;)


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#47 southstand loiner

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 03:39 PM

The figure was just for the Carnegie schools competition.

My son's school (in Surrey) does teach RL, but it's predominately a Union school (actually it's first and foremost a soccer school). They don't have a RL team as far as I am aware, but you can see with a bit of a push it could easily grow.


thanks i was not having a go as it takes time to devlop leagues and was wondering how far along they were and i do think the junior game in the south has come on leaps and bounds in the last 10 years . what is needed now is for the rfl not to dismantle much of the good work that has been done due to the sport england money been cut .
ah a sunday night in front of the telly watching old rugby league games.
does life get any better .

#48 shaun mc

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 03:39 PM

In Workington, (late 60's early 70's) I played union for the school (all we were allowed to play as PE teacher played for Netherhall ru,) union on Saturday afternoon for Workington Zebras and league on Sundays for Workington Boys club. When I was 16 I was taken to one side by the union coach (ooh er missus) and told that I had to decide which code I wanted to play as once I reached 17, if I continued to play league, I would be 'banned for life' from playing union. This was the norm then.

As for league in schools, down here at St Albans we had a very, very keen RL development coach. At one point he had senior schools in Potters Bar, Welwyn Garden City, Hatfield and St Albans all playing against each other in various age groups. Schools were contacting him to come along and teach their pupils. Then junior schools began getting in touch and asking for training and games. We could have done with three development officers. Unfortunately local union clubs didn't like this and they began offering their services at schools as well (well, rugby is rugby to someone not in the know). Now our development officer has retrurned to Aus in August last year, and we are waiting to see if we will be getting another one with all the cut backs etc. In the mean time, there is very little league now in senior schools after all the good ground work already done. The Dev Oficer from Hemel helped out after ours left but I believe covering both areas was just too much.
The good news is that we have a minis set up that is doing sterling work with junior schools children at the moment (all volunteers).

sounds as though we didn't have such a good time of it up in West Cumbria judging by the posts.
I had similar experience. I played for Glasson u-18's and Netherhall RU, as did many others. They both had good teams and the better players (3 of whom became regulars for the Carlisle RL club) were also told that come 17 years of age they had to decide which code they were playing or face being banned from RU forever. I wasn't that good, was off the radar and didn't have to make that decision.

#49 Pie tries

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 09:29 PM

Excellen thread. It really upsets me when RU types state that our sports lack of growth is an indication of RLs popularity. Make sure the world knows the truth, schools rugby is just the proverbial tip

#50 tw15

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 10:16 PM

I think the Sports England report suggests nationally there's 3 x as many Union players as League, but in the schools, it looks like it's much much closer. I've not heard of a Public School yet to take up League in Surrey. Hampton Boys School is mostly rowing and union, St James School and St George's Weybridge are Union. If they ever take up League, then League will be well and truly be accepted.

Edited by tw15, 06 January 2013 - 10:33 PM.


#51 The Parksider

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 11:08 PM

From an old man's point of view, you have no idea how amazing a statement that is. As can be seen from other posts the game had difficulty being played in the schools in the North and a school in Surrey playing the game was in the realms of pure fantasy. No wonder the RU fought against the "free gangway" rulings tooth and nail. The relaxation of such and the end of the :"Rules as to professionalism:" led to such things as your son's school in Surrey playing RL. With any luck it will ultimately lead to our game overtaking their unattractive version of Rugby....


here you are popping up getting all excited about RL in Surrey.

Then Tw 15 pops up and says "The reason for the growth in Surrey has a lot to do with the Broncos".

My how that must have burst your bubble.

The Broncos - you know, the useless SL club that has no effect on the growth of RL in London. :lol: :lol:

#52 keighley

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 05:21 PM

here you are popping up getting all excited about RL in Surrey.

Then Tw 15 pops up and says "The reason for the growth in Surrey has a lot to do with the Broncos".

My how that must have burst your bubble.

The Broncos - you know, the useless SL club that has no effect on the growth of RL in London. :lol: :lol:


Touchee, Parksider. One thumb up to you but the fact remains most amateur growth in London has has nothing to do with the Broncos/Crusaders/Harlequins/ Fulham team. It takes exceptions to prove every rule.

And why shouldn't RL followers get excited about the wholesale spread of our game, not only in Surrey but throughout the country.

I played amateur RL just before the advent of BARLA and, trust me, the game was in dire straights. The progress since the has been extraordinary and most of it has had nothing whatsoever to do with SL.

#53 Northern Sol

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 08:52 PM

here you are popping up getting all excited about RL in Surrey.

Then Tw 15 pops up and says "The reason for the growth in Surrey has a lot to do with the Broncos".

My how that must have burst your bubble.

The Broncos - you know, the useless SL club that has no effect on the growth of RL in London. :lol: :lol:


Surrey being in London. Obviously.

#54 tw15

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 09:06 PM

Surrey being in London. Obviously.

Kingston and Richmond have Surrey postal addresses, but are part of Greater London (London Boroughs of...) . Staines, Ashford, Sunbury & Shepperton have a Middlesex postal address, but are in the area administered by Surrey County Council. Elmbridge and Effingham are less confusing - they are in Surrey and have a Surrey postal address.

Edited by tw15, 07 January 2013 - 09:10 PM.


#55 Northern Sol

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 09:11 PM

Kingston and Richmond have Surrey postal addresses, but are part of Greater London (London Borough of...) . Staines and Ashford have a Middlesex postal address, but is in the area administered by Surrey County Council. Feltham and Twickenham: Middlesex and in Greater London. Elmbridge and Effingham are less confusing - they are in Surrey and have a Surrey postal address.


Kingston and Richmond are both thought of as "not London" by those in London.

I'm not disagreeing with you, just find the idea of proving a point with London by citing clubs not in London as odd.

I doubt that Parky would cite Bradford clubs in response to a point about Leeds.

Edited by Northern Sol, 07 January 2013 - 10:36 PM.


#56 WakefieldCityLoyal

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 09:11 PM

That's great and just the kind of thing I was hoping to hear. Are there schools that still won't have anything to do with rugby league? There has never been a better time for the Leeds club to do all that it can to encourage every school in the area to give the game a chance.

How about schools around Wakefield? The Grammar school is regularly featured in the Daily Mail for its rugby union exploits - is rugby league part of the curriculum?

The 2 private schools in Wakefield, QEGS ( grammar school) and silcoates play RU . All the normal schools play RL always have done Outwood Grange regularly feature in the schools finals

#57 trakl

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 10:30 PM

The 2 private schools in Wakefield, QEGS ( grammar school) and silcoates play RU . All the normal schools play RL always have done Outwood Grange regularly feature in the schools finals


Thanks for that answer. Is it impossible to imagine rugby league being taken board on by the above? Has it ever been encouraged by, say, Wakefield Trinity and then dismissed out of hand by these schools?

#58 southstand loiner

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 10:36 PM

Thanks for that answer. Is it impossible to imagine rugby league being taken board on by the above? Has it ever been encouraged by, say, Wakefield Trinity and then dismissed out of hand by these schools?


i am sure i have heard of some rugby league invovlment at wakey grammar school but not sure how far it went .
ah a sunday night in front of the telly watching old rugby league games.
does life get any better .

#59 WakefieldCityLoyal

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 09:14 PM

Thanks for that answer. Is it impossible to imagine rugby league being taken board on by the above? Has it ever been encouraged by, say, Wakefield Trinity and then dismissed out of hand by these schools?

I know Trinity use QEGS playing fields sometimes to train on and the
QEGS headmaster or head sports teacher is a big Trinity fan and has introduced RL to that school but not sure if they've played competitive RL there. QEGS & silcoates ( ironically where Trinity charman A Glover was educated) will always be RU just like all private schools in England, like said before all the state schools in Wakefield play RL always have done. On the other end of the scale Outwood grange tried playing RU for the first time in their history few years ago and ended up getting to the schools finals at twickers with a team through of RL lads playing RU for the first time.

#60 southstand loiner

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 10:48 PM

I know Trinity use QEGS playing fields sometimes to train on and the
QEGS headmaster or head sports teacher is a big Trinity fan and has introduced RL to that school but not sure if they've played competitive RL there. QEGS & silcoates ( ironically where Trinity charman A Glover was educated) will always be RU just like all private schools in England, like said before all the state schools in Wakefield play RL always have done. On the other end of the scale Outwood grange tried playing RU for the first time in their history few years ago and ended up getting to the schools finals at twickers with a team through of RL lads playing RU for the first time.


cheers i thught i had read something about the school and rugby league that must have been it
ah a sunday night in front of the telly watching old rugby league games.
does life get any better .




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