Jump to content


Rugby League World Issue 400 - Out Now!

RUGBY LEAGUE WORLD MAGAZINE - ISSUE 400 - OUT NOW!
84 pages, 38 years of history from Open Rugby to the present day.
Click here for the digital edition to read online via smartphone, tablet and desktop devices including iPhone, iPad, Android & Kindle HD.
Click here to order a copy for delivery by post. Annual subscriptions also available worldwide.
Find out what's inside Issue 400
/ View a Gallery of all 400 covers / WH Smith Branches stocking Issue 400
Read Jamie Jones-Buchanan's Top 5 RLW Interviews including Marwan Koukash, Lee Briers, Gareth Thomas, Steve Ganson & Matt King OBE


League Express

Podcast

Photo
- - - - -

what do you really want?


  • Please log in to reply
78 replies to this topic

#1 Barnie

Barnie
  • Coach
  • 1,986 posts

Posted 26 January 2013 - 12:46 AM

I personally are fed up with all the moaning surrounding the partnership with Wire. to me it seems sensible to use this to strengthen our squad on the cheap. lets face it even if we signed them all on permanent deals a SL club could cherry pick them on the cheap.

So having nailed my colours to the mast its over to you. to me it seems simple there are only 3 other options.

1) take the moral high ground, have no DRs lack quality and have to dig deep to combat this risk financial meltdown and invest heavily in the squad. after all we dont have a ming the merciless look-a-like begging us to let him throw money at us.

2)Take the moral highground, have no DRs dont invest get relegated and spend years in C1 playing oxford and other joke teams.

3) pull the shutters down and call it a day.

Id rather have things the way they are than any of these other options.

Edited by Barnie, 26 January 2013 - 12:47 AM.

Dont worry, it will soon be Christmas!

Posted Image

#2 marshy1

marshy1
  • Coach
  • 1,600 posts

Posted 26 January 2013 - 01:00 AM

I personally are fed up with all the moaning surrounding the partnership with Wire. to me it seems sensible to use this to strengthen our squad on the cheap. lets face it even if we signed them all on permanent deals a SL club could cherry pick them on the cheap.

So having nailed my colours to the mast its over to you. to me it seems simple there are only 3 other options.

1) take the moral high ground, have no DRs lack quality and have to dig deep to combat this risk financial meltdown and invest heavily in the squad. after all we dont have a ming the merciless look-a-like begging us to let him throw money at us.

2)Take the moral highground, have no DRs dont invest get relegated and spend years in C1 playing oxford and other joke teams.

3) pull the shutters down and call it a day.

Id rather have things the way they are than any of these other options.

All we are doing is playing to the rules which every other club can and which some are doing.

I wonder how many grumbles there would be if we had sat on the fence and not linked with any club. In the current state most players are only ever signed for one year with many moving on for a number of reasons, sadly loyalty seems a thing of the past where we had players serving the same club through their career. With that in mind does it matter if we borrow another teams players.

#3 Bryce

Bryce
  • Coach
  • 911 posts

Posted 26 January 2013 - 01:57 AM

I agree with your post Barnie. Let's get on with it!

#4 iomlion

iomlion
  • Players
  • 76 posts

Posted 26 January 2013 - 07:49 AM

I would use whatever is legally available to maintain and improve the club and team. Getting results is important and with no big money financier coming forward, the only way way to realise our aspirations.

Winning builds confidence and experience which in turn attracts support and players. Coupled with quality management we are on the right track, it just takes time......but this also depends on consistency in all areas, that is one area we have fallen down at in the past.

http://www.iomtoday....eline-1-5352558

Just kidding!



#5 iomlion

iomlion
  • Players
  • 76 posts

Posted 26 January 2013 - 07:51 AM

Bet I just got them more hits on their site than they have had for months, and they will never understand why lol

#6 mark richardson

mark richardson
  • Coach
  • 2,910 posts

Posted 26 January 2013 - 11:20 AM

I agree with Barnie,at last a bit of reality.
My outlook has always been smile and get on with it.

Ian,very funny!

#7 class of 63

class of 63
  • Coach
  • 234 posts

Posted 26 January 2013 - 09:52 PM

I agree with Barnie,at last a bit of reality.
My outlook has always been smile and get on with it.

Ian,very funny!


Those two statements sum it up Mark - this is 2013 and the reality of rugby league is what we have (Dual Registration, Super League Franchise etc. etc etc.) - we either smile and get on with it or walk away from the game - this is not forgetting your principles but accepting the consequence of a changing society.
As a passionate Swinton supporter for a long, long time I have experienced the ups and downs of rugby league - but I will simply relate to this - I worked for 15 years or so for a large company in Wigan, as you will appreciate this was a rugby league dominated environment - I worked alongside mainly Wigan, St. Helens, Warrington and Leigh supporters and as I was aware I being the only Swinton supporter - but the great thing that in all our organised trips to Wembley, Old Trafford, International matches etc I was a member of the Rugby League family - as now being retired I can reflect on those times with great pleasure - so without John Kidd and his support of this club, I may not have had a club to support and would have felt left out.

#8 mark richardson

mark richardson
  • Coach
  • 2,910 posts

Posted 26 January 2013 - 10:02 PM

Those two statements sum it up Mark - this is 2013 and the reality of rugby league is what we have (Dual Registration, Super League Franchise etc. etc etc.) - we either smile and get on with it or walk away from the game - this is not forgetting your principles but accepting the consequence of a changing society.
As a passionate Swinton supporter for a long, long time I have experienced the ups and downs of rugby league - but I will simply relate to this - I worked for 15 years or so for a large company in Wigan, as you will appreciate this was a rugby league dominated environment - I worked alongside mainly Wigan, St. Helens, Warrington and Leigh supporters and as I was aware I being the only Swinton supporter - but the great thing that in all our organised trips to Wembley, Old Trafford, International matches etc I was a member of the Rugby League family - as now being retired I can reflect on those times with great pleasure - so without John Kidd and his support of this club, I may not have had a club to support and would have felt left out.

You write some heartfelt stuff my friend. Lovely to read .

#9 marshy1

marshy1
  • Coach
  • 1,600 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 01:26 AM

Excellent sentiments and so very true.

#10 PhillH

PhillH
  • Coach
  • 2,242 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 09:53 AM

I would prefer not to have the concept of Dual Registered players at all. The rules as they have been framed for this season:

- Have not been put in place to benefit Championship clubs (when was the last time the RFL did anything of that nature?). The true driving force is to assist Super League clubs by allowing them to cut costs while retaining the registrations of young players that would otherwise have to be released. This is all about SL clubs having their cake and eating it.

- Undermine the credibility of the Championship. Apparently next week's opponents Workington are going to work the rules so they effectively soak up any slack in the Widnes first team squad. Up there a 12 month contract may start to look like an incredibly long term relationship!

And yes I fully appreciate this goes beyond Swinton Lions. For what its worth I think what has happened with Rochdale Hornets (where a Saints youth coach has been appointed Hornets first team coach) is absolutely horrific. If that isn't a long established name being levered towards status of a feeder club I don't know what is.

We are gravitating evermore towards the Aussie system of an untouchable franchised top division and feeder leagues. Just because it is being steadily imposed doesn't mean I have to like it. We have seen the RFL's sheepishness in following all things Australian many times, for me a lot of the changes don't suit UK sporting culture and this is a step too far.

Perhaps I will get a bit more used to the idea as time goes by, but in the two games so far supporting the side has felt different due to the presence of so many players in the side that belong first and foremost to another club. To me it feels like the identity of the side has changed. If we were to take the final step of playing at the Halliwell Jones it would be exactly the same scenario as Bramley went through with Leeds and we know what the end result of that was.

I feel sorry for Steve McCormack. The side he put together last season showed real promise. The way to achieve success is to retain the best players and each year add a bit of quality. Instead he is having to start again virtually from scratch with a host of players that in all likelihood he won't have long to work with, belong to another club and should he have a positive impact on them they will be off pronto. I fear 50% of the side will now change every season - that's not a formula to make progress.

The club has pushed to the full limit of the new rules and arguably a bit beyond that with the likes of Hulme and Birkett also joining. It didn't have to do so. There was a degree of choice involved. The more ambitious Championship clubs have said "non".

For me it all boils down to a fundamental question: Have we lost the belief that Swinton Lions can ever become a bigger club ever again?

For that the club needs to grow its sustainable inherent income streams. My belief is that the club is currently operating at nowhere near its full potential.

At the moment, with a total lack of tangible progress with Agecroft the key factor, none of that is being addressed - the focus is purely on minimising overheads.
Rugby League - great game, shame about the administration.

#11 Barnie

Barnie
  • Coach
  • 1,986 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 10:56 AM

Rage against the machine!
Dont worry, it will soon be Christmas!

Posted Image

#12 iomlion

iomlion
  • Players
  • 76 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 10:56 AM

I never lose belief but to be a bigger club again will be a massive struggle. However we do have a club to support so be a little happy? We have never been a truly big club in all the time I have been a supporter....some 46 yrs, but I still support and am passionate about e club. I hope Phill, a lot.

I truly wish either everyone had your time, and I presume from your posts, ability to set up inherent revenue streams and progress planning. All at a time of financial constraint and uncertainty and with a support base of at best a few hundred souls.

I just wish you would be a little positive and less confrontational.

The title of the thread is "what do you really want?" Well I really want a financially secure club playing at a community facility in or as near M27 as possible with a regular grounded support base with a team playing open honest rugby.





#13 hilly

hilly
  • Players
  • 56 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 09:42 PM

Swinton will struggle to put a team out half the squad will walk the players have trained and grafted all winter for what to see there places taken by Warrington players who no matter how good or bad will play every week so put yourself in there boots if it was happening to you at work how would you feel. These players have been stop from plying there trade for the sake of Warrington salary cap and R.F.L.just wanting super league and using the championship as a feeder league for this purpose only soon we will all lose our identity we all will have to sign up to a super league club or be kicked out of the league .i think as fans we should stand up and support the clubs identity and the players who signed for SWINTON LIONS not Warrington these lads will all be lost to the game if we don't back them all for the gain of Warrington wolves

#14 mark richardson

mark richardson
  • Coach
  • 2,910 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 10:01 PM

Swinton will struggle to put a team out half the squad will walk the players have trained and grafted all winter for what to see there places taken by Warrington players who no matter how good or bad will play every week so put yourself in there boots if it was happening to you at work how would you feel. These players have been stop from plying there trade for the sake of Warrington salary cap and R.F.L.just wanting super league and using the championship as a feeder league for this purpose only soon we will all lose our identity we all will have to sign up to a super league club or be kicked out of the league .i think as fans we should stand up and support the clubs identity and the players who signed for SWINTON LIONS not Warrington these lads will all be lost to the game if we don't back them all for the gain of Warrington wolves


Ive been doing my job for twenty years. Despite government cutbacks and constant and very real attacks ftom within and without I still do it to the best of my ability. It is however a young mans job so I keep myself fit..work to my strength. .use my experience.
When I realise the newer younger men are doing better than me and im no longer near the top performer..I sulk like a baby and go home....oh no I dont because im getting paid...
I knuckle down and try a bit harder again to prove ive still got it.
Our players are not big babies.

We wont have any identity at all if we go bust. We are not in a position of strength to pick and choose how we progress. The dual reg is happening. It might end up as a disaster but we need to MAN UP
AND MOST IMPORTANTLY CHEER UP!

#15 hilly

hilly
  • Players
  • 56 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 10:19 PM

You miss the point what iam saying the players can burst a gut get themselves super fit training and still will not be selected so is this fair and no they are not babies they are men who want to play for SWINTON and as for getting paid most of the team only get paid if they play this is a fact ask them I HAVE so you sit back say nothing and let the players go iam sure they will thank you for your support but never mind you can always go watching Warrington next season

#16 Bryce

Bryce
  • Coach
  • 911 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 10:23 PM

Without promotion and relegation, any decent players in the championship will end up at a SL club, or at the very least top CC club. It's been the same for years. Or maybe we should give calls to Al Hurst, Tom Armstrong, Phil Joseph, Adam Highson etc and talk to them about loyalty. It's nonsense, if players can make a living from playing SL or high level CC then they will (and good luck to them), there's nothing we can do about it.

Also, don't talk nonsense about losing identity, if you believed that you'd have stopped going as soon as Station Road was sold from beneath us.

Also, there wasn't too much moaning when Walker, Forster and co were playing pivotal roles for us last season.

#17 hilly

hilly
  • Players
  • 56 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 10:36 PM

Ok I will have a friendly bet that we will struggle to put a team out this season nobody will want to sign for us knowing they are playing second fiddle to Warrington players the squad is small now and will get smaller so we will end up looking at players in the amateur game to make the squad up I have been a swinton fan for 50 years a and it saddens me to watch us being used by warrington

#18 duffymoon

duffymoon
  • Coach
  • 2,565 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 10:54 PM

I think we can only use a maximum of five dual reg players per game? How many did we have last season.Also I cannot believe that a Coach of Steve MCCormacks stature would let another club dictate which players he has to select! the situation is not ideal but if we elected to Go it alone and get battered every week we'd be slaughtered for not joining in.

#19 Bryce

Bryce
  • Coach
  • 911 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 11:03 PM

I think that with the Warrington lads on board we have a fighting chance of staying up. Without them, I wouldn't be so confident. It's not ideal but survival is all that matters this season, we cannot go down to that awful CC1.

Not sure if it's 5 or 6 players we can have in our 17. Either way, how do people think we'll shape up against Town on Sunday?

#20 Barnie

Barnie
  • Coach
  • 1,986 posts

Posted 27 January 2013 - 11:15 PM

Where is all this money coming from to fund a full squad of world beaters. lets face it on crowds of 800 or so we cannot challenge for the playoffs let alone promotion, if that is ever reintroduced.

its a case of either putting the money in yourself to pay for the rest of the squad or being happy to have a team to support.

in conclusion, put up or shut up!
Dont worry, it will soon be Christmas!

Posted Image




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users