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Matthew Johns: Sorry bro, but Johnathan Thurston will be better than you


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#21 trakl

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:15 PM

I guess so if we want no one to see it.
I thought the main Forum could use a few new posts....
I will refrain from posting any threads at all.

Cheers.


I enjoy reading your posts and would miss them. Please carry on...

#22 Johnoco

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:23 PM

Thurston is great not because of his athleticism - he isn't fast on his feet and he lacks the confrontational fire that helped to make some of the greats such as Gregory stand out... but he is fast in his head and relentlessly creative and decisive in his play-making.

Absolutely spot on. Like the way Lockyer used to seem to have all day to kick and make a decision.

I won't even mention goalkicking.

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#23 keighley

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:29 PM

The game has moved on so much though and different eras can not be compared in a fair way.
The days when players were part time and each body type had a certain spot in a team are not recognizable nowadays.
Best ever call in this article is just a media seller but Thurston is the best in recent times.
Remember Andy Gregory? would he be up there in this day and age? His skill set and more so his body type and athleticism would see him not be near any first grade team in 2013


I am old enough to have seen Murphy in his prime and he was the best I ever saw.He had blinding pace, a mesmerishing sidestep, a great reader of the game whereby he know when to pass. When many of those skills deteriorated with age, he became a creator in chief. he could kick for touch and drop goals became his speciality. He took an average Leigh team to a Wembley win late in his career and, just to prove it was no fluke, he moved to Warrington and transformed them into winners, all this in the twilight of his career.

In his international hay day he terrified the Aussies. I remember watching him pick the ball up 60 yards from the australian line in Australia and from the base of the scrum beat every Australian to score.

As for the point that he cannot be compared to todays players I will say he played in an era of the 5 yards back from the play the ball. He played in an era when designated head hunters routinely stiff armed half backs with little retribution from the ref. In my opinion, if he was at his prime today, he would absolutly destroy modern defences with the extra 5 yards in which to attack.

Murphy was the best half back I ever saw.

#24 boxhead

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:35 PM

I would have Thurston in my World X111 too and recognise his worth - but it was Johns who placed Holman among the greats and I felt it worth pointing out that he was famously ruined by a teenage genius in Alex Murphy in his first Lions tour of 1958. Too few Australian journalists, fans and players acknowledge that many of the greatest players and teams in the history of the game were other than Australian...

I disagree with your point about Gregory: His body shape, even as a teenager playing for Widnes at Wembley, was one of the curious things about him - but his creative play, his accelerative bursts and his fearlessness would mark him out as a great in any era. Thurston is great not because of his athleticism - he isn't fast on his feet and he lacks the confrontational fire that helped to make some of the greats such as Gregory stand out... but he is fast in his head and relentlessly creative and decisive in his play-making.


I agree with some of your points but Thurston has had pace and acceleration, he may have slowed as he has got older but a few years ago not many players would have run him down if he went through the line.
Gregory did a pretty good job for Great Britain, not so much when he tried his hand in Australia at Illawarra .

#25 MrPosh

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:39 PM

I guess so if we want no one to see it.
I thought the main Forum could use a few new posts....
I will refrain from posting any threads at all.

Cheers.


Don't be silly. You have the NRL balance just perfect in what you post - stuff that is of genuine interest to all fans of the game, without delving too deep into the game over there and you provide some great debate.

I don't agree with a lot of what you post in terms of content - it's too Aussie biased (as evidenced by this thread listing only great Aussie half-backs) and ignorant of the game and history here, but it still makes for great discussion for a forum.
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#26 boxhead

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:39 PM

I am old enough to have seen Murphy in his prime and he was the best I ever saw.He had blinding pace, a mesmerishing sidestep, a great reader of the game whereby he know when to pass. When many of those skills deteriorated with age, he became a creator in chief. he could kick for touch and drop goals became his speciality. He took an average Leigh team to a Wembley win late in his career and, just to prove it was no fluke, he moved to Warrington and transformed them into winners, all this in the twilight of his career.

In his international hay day he terrified the Aussies. I remember watching him pick the ball up 60 yards from the australian line in Australia and from the base of the scrum beat every Australian to score.

As for the point that he cannot be compared to todays players I will say he played in an era of the 5 yards back from the play the ball. He played in an era when designated head hunters routinely stiff armed half backs with little retribution from the ref. In my opinion, if he was at his prime today, he would absolutly destroy modern defences with the extra 5 yards in which to attack.

Murphy was the best half back I ever saw.


I hear what you are saying but the Athletes of today are a different breed than 40 years ago.
Some of those players may have benefited from today's methods and have been better again than what they were but not all would.

One of my favorite players was Brett Kenny, he was one of the best in his day, would he be the same in today's game? maybe, would he benefit from today's Gym work and routines? probably not.

#27 boxhead

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:41 PM

Don't be silly. You have the NRL balance just perfect in what you post - stuff that is of genuine interest to all fans of the game, without delving too deep into the game over there and you provide some great debate.

I don't agree with a lot of what you post in terms of content - it's too Aussie biased (as evidenced by this thread listing only great Aussie half-backs) and ignorant of the game and history here, but it still makes for great discussion for a forum.


Cheers, I can only post on what I know best but I appreciate the sentiment,

#28 boxhead

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:42 PM

I enjoy reading your posts and would miss them. Please carry on...


Thanks.

#29 deluded pom?

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:43 PM

Fishing for compliments is the oldest trick in the book.

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#30 boxhead

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:46 PM

If I want to read threads about the NRL I'll go to the NRL forum. If no one uses the NRL forum that's not my problem.



Feel free, just as long as they are relevant to the forum you post in




That's entirely up to you.


Cheers Mate, I must have upset you along the way, it was not personal.
I might pull my thoughts in though anyway.

#31 hindle xiii

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:46 PM

Fishing for compliments is the oldest trick in the book.

Well spotted, you're really good at that.

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#32 boxhead

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:52 PM

Fishing for compliments is the oldest trick in the book.


Why am I fishing for anything?
I never expect much other than some stick to be honest.

No offence to the others but I do not need any sort of acceptance from anyone, I have never had it before in any shape or form and that has not stopped me posting my thoughts has it?
Its a strange post from you Deluded in context to what you have messaged me previously.

#33 Exiled Wiganer

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:54 PM

Gregory was a wonderful player, who would be a wonderful player in any era. He did just fine in the Winfield Cup, helping Illawarra to their first final iirc. One thing that always amazed me about him was that he could only pass one way over distance and would have to turn around to make sure he could get into position. You couldn't buy his genius for putting players through gaps.

#34 bobbruce

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:03 PM

The game has moved on so much though and different eras can not be compared in a fair way.
The days when players were part time and each body type had a certain spot in a team are not recognizable nowadays.
Best ever call in this article is just a media seller but Thurston is the best in recent times.
Remember Andy Gregory? would he be up there in this day and age? His skill set and more so his body type and athleticism would see him not be near any first grade team in 2013


Gregory had a very similar body shape to Wally Lewis would he not make it in today's game. There are also loads of Current NRL players with Gregory's body shape how come they've made it.

#35 boxhead

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:05 PM

Gregory was a wonderful player, who would be a wonderful player in any era. He did just fine in the Winfield Cup, helping Illawarra to their first final iirc. One thing that always amazed me about him was that he could only pass one way over distance and would have to turn around to make sure he could get into position. You couldn't buy his genius for putting players through gaps.


Unfortunately in 1989 when Gregory played for Illawarra they came last in the Comp 16th from 16 teams, Andy only played in nine of those games where they won 1, drew one and lost seven.

#36 Dennis Bloodnock

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:05 PM

I am old enough to have seen Murphy in his prime and he was the best I ever saw.He had blinding pace, a mesmerishing sidestep, a great reader of the game whereby he know when to pass. When many of those skills deteriorated with age, he became a creator in chief. he could kick for touch and drop goals became his speciality. He took an average Leigh team to a Wembley win late in his career and, just to prove it was no fluke, he moved to Warrington and transformed them into winners, all this in the twilight of his career.

In his international hay day he terrified the Aussies. I remember watching him pick the ball up 60 yards from the australian line in Australia and from the base of the scrum beat every Australian to score.

As for the point that he cannot be compared to todays players I will say he played in an era of the 5 yards back from the play the ball. He played in an era when designated head hunters routinely stiff armed half backs with little retribution from the ref. In my opinion, if he was at his prime today, he would absolutly destroy modern defences with the extra 5 yards in which to attack.

Murphy was the best half back I ever saw.

I am old enough to have seen Murphy in his prime and he was the best I ever saw.He had blinding pace, a mesmerishing sidestep, a great reader of the game whereby he know when to pass. When many of those skills deteriorated with age, he became a creator in chief. he could kick for touch and drop goals became his speciality. He took an average Leigh team to a Wembley win late in his career and, just to prove it was no fluke, he moved to Warrington and transformed them into winners, all this in the twilight of his career.

In his international hay day he terrified the Aussies. I remember watching him pick the ball up 60 yards from the australian line in Australia and from the base of the scrum beat every Australian to score.

As for the point that he cannot be compared to todays players I will say he played in an era of the 5 yards back from the play the ball. He played in an era when designated head hunters routinely stiff armed half backs with little retribution from the ref. In my opinion, if he was at his prime today, he would absolutly destroy modern defences with the extra 5 yards in which to attack.

Murphy was the best half back I ever saw.



I agree,Roger Millward did a lot of damage to the the Aussies too.To mention Billy Smith and not Murphy or indeed Millward is a bit biased IMVHO.
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#37 boxhead

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:10 PM

Gregory had a very similar body shape to Wally Lewis would he not make it in today's game. There are also loads of Current NRL players with Gregory's body shape how come they've made it.


Really? Which ones?

Posted Image

Andy Gregory was 5'5' and built like a chubby barrel.
Wally Lewis is 6ft and 14st, 13lb not much different than todays Stand offs but more on the solid Lock style of build.

Edited by AndyCapp, 15 March 2013 - 01:28 PM.


#38 boxhead

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:15 PM



I agree,Roger Millward did a lot of damage to the the Aussies too.To mention Billy Smith and not Murphy or indeed Millward is a bit biased IMVHO.


I agree Dennis,
The article was from an Australian Paper and as most media do they only look in their own back yard, see "Sinfield wins Golden Boot award" to see what I mean.
I don't think they were dredging back through the decades even in the Australian Game, just in the memories of the people that are still alive and remember the names they are talking about.

Edited by AndyCapp, 15 March 2013 - 01:16 PM.


#39 trakl

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:22 PM

Gregory was a wonderful player, who would be a wonderful player in any era. He did just fine in the Winfield Cup, helping Illawarra to their first final iirc. One thing that always amazed me about him was that he could only pass one way over distance and would have to turn around to make sure he could get into position. You couldn't buy his genius for putting players through gaps.


Andy Gregory was a genius and, for a relatively short time ( or so it seems from this distance), was partnered at Widnes by another genius in Tony Myler.

One of my earliest rugby league memories is of sitting down to watch the Challenge Cup final in the early '80s and hearing Ray French revolve much of his commentary around the fact that Widnes' Gregory had been up all night with a wisdom tooth problem! (I didn't understand what all the fuss was about, until I experienced something similar a few years later). He then proceeded to play a blinder, of course...

Thurston is wonderful - but I don't mind admitting that watching Gregory in his prime was somehow even more exciting.

#40 keighley

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:27 PM



I agree,Roger Millward did a lot of damage to the the Aussies too.To mention Billy Smith and not Murphy or indeed Millward is a bit biased IMVHO.


I agree, Millward was a billiant halfback over a long period of time. Seeing as we are talking Castleford products here, Hepworth and Hardisty were also top class, particularly Hardisty.




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