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18 replies to this topic

#1 Judge Mental

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 05:06 PM

Interesting to see Chris Hough coming back into the fold. Also very interested to read in the Observer Friday eyestrain comments on Houghies return. Comments are that we need a leader on the field dictating the play. Not so sure this is right. Against Thunder we performed well, it was only when, for God knows what reason, we decided to tinker with the half back set up and incorporate Lee Gaskell that it all fell apart, and it had to be against the old enemy, and by the Coach's own admission, by the time it was put right it was to late the game had gone. Lee Gaskell was the weak link in the team and if we had left it as it was against Thunder, I feel sure we would have had a different result.

If it aint broke, don't fix it.

Did anyone think Lee Gaskell had a good game?

I welcome Houghy back, he is a 110%er without a doubt, and we will be stronger with him than without him.

#2 kingkenny

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 08:52 PM

i agree if we were a loose forward short why didnt we use one from st helens,isnt that the point of dual registration we didnt need a stand off we had one but he moved to accomodate a st helens player in need of a game ,so whose decision was it to change talbot or nathan browns i think the latter

#3 fillipo del toro

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 09:30 AM

Spot on Judgemental. Moving players in key pivot positions will be our downfall if we keep doing it. As for Houghy, will he get a game? Maybe not. But a great person to have in the squad. In my opinion we need some size in the pack. We will look tiny at Wrexham on Sunday
Phil Bull.

Hopefully my post are viewed as positive, and I cannot be held responsible for causing any offence to anyone associated with this message board

#4 Anita Bath

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 04:07 PM

Interesting that in RL World, Cru coach Clive Griffiths has a go referring to Hornets as St Helens 'A'

#5 kingkenny

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 04:34 PM

well he would know after all last season crusaders must have been widnes 'A'

#6 boro hornet

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 04:56 PM

NWC coach and fans seem to have very short memories of duel registration and forget those they used last year.
Success does not consists in never making blunders,but in never making the same one the second time.

#7 AlwaysCru

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 07:43 PM

Ahaaahahaha, I love that, best form of defence is attack and all that!

If you check the record books Crusaders had two players on DR from Saints, one played one game and never played again cause he was shockingly bad - the second, I can't remember his name, played about four or five games before he was dropped. This was under the previous DR scheme that all teams operated under.

The (excuse the block caps) MASSIVE difference in these situations is that the North Wales team didn't get their licence granted until 9 weeks before the season started and recruited an entire squad from scratch. Yet we still attempted to do it on our own.

As for being 'Widnes A' how does that work? We had Kurt Haggerty on loan for one game?!!! Other than that we signed two Widnes players who'd already been released from their academy at the very start of 2012.

Not wanting to burst the bubble but Mike Rush from St Helen's approached North Wales for a partnership before Hornets but Crusaders said no. When it was suggested out coaching team could be relieved of their duties and replaced by Saints staff it was too much for our Board, but clearly not yours....

I appreciate youre coming over tomorrow and with the addition of your Super League stars its going to be a very difficult game for us, but please don't try to drag us down to a DR level.

As fans we understand you didn't vote for this but you must question it's merits. Having spoken to a few people this week I know for a FACT that Nathan Brown has dictated what players are going to be in your team on Sunday.

I think we can all agree Ian Talbot isnt 'his own man'

I would have thought a club with the tradition of Hornets and knowledgable fans of the game wouldn't have accepted such a situation but hey ho, your call.

I'd put you as favourites on Sunday for the win, but don't know if I'm putting you as favourites or St Helen's!

But win or lose it'll be Crusaders players.




#8 Lakeside

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 08:12 PM

There is a big difference here. We have a group of Supporters who run the club muddling on as best they can. So the Saints offer was always going to be snatched at given that the Committee wont put any money in. A bit like a social club if you like.

#9 boro hornet

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 08:14 PM

and he's on the hook
Success does not consists in never making blunders,but in never making the same one the second time.

#10 Number 7

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 09:04 PM

Hmmmm seems to me, to be only one hook being swallowed here and that is the one dangled by the SL clubs.
And they seem to have fooled some minnows into taking the bait.
Well done NWC for resisting the farce of DR this year, it will probably be dead in the water next year, or at least altered so that the 'Big Boys' can't dictate to the grass roots clubs.

Edited by Number 7, 16 March 2013 - 09:05 PM.


#11 no1 saints fan

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 12:04 AM

Let me try and give Saints' perspective on this. Saints didn't want this DR partnership in the first place. We voted against it. But when the system was put in place, the club had no alternative but to try and make it work.

You can hardly blame Saints for trying their best to get their players some game time. We have 31 first team players who are all on good money. If you look at the game tomorrow, Joe Greenwood, Nathan Ashe and Lee Gaskell are all on DR. Last year, all of these players would have played in our academy. This year, none of them are allowed because of their age. So for these players, its either DR or no game at all.

What you have to understand is that these players are full time. Playing rugby is their job. They train 5 or 6 days a week. They work incredibly hard. At the end of the week, they want to play. They don't want to be sat on their backsides at the weekend. They will be saying to Nathan Brown during the week, "will you try and get us a game this week". You can hardly blame them. It wasn't the players that put this system in place.

#12 Anita Bath

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 01:58 AM

and what about the players whose place they take? It wasn't them that put the system in place either, but it seems their playing time is at the whim of an australian who has no position at Rochdale Hornets and couldn't give a rats a**e about them.

Your players are full time employees of St Helens, yet they appear to be taking the jobs (or at least the playing time) of part time employees of Rochdale Hornets.

#13 no1 saints fan

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 02:27 AM

and what about the players whose place they take? It wasn't them that put the system in place either, but it seems their playing time is at the whim of an australian who has no position at Rochdale Hornets and couldn't give a rats a**e about them.

Your players are full time employees of St Helens, yet they appear to be taking the jobs (or at least the playing time) of part time employees of Rochdale Hornets.


I was just simply pointing out Saints' point of view. I assume I am allowed to do that? This was always going to happen. It shouldn't really surprise anyone.

As I said, in Saints' first team there are 31 players. 4 are eligible for the u19s. Only 17 players can play each week. So that leaves 10 players. Last year they could play in the academy because there was no age restrictions. This year, they can't play in the academy. You have to be 19 or under. The only opportunity that they have is to go out on DR. Everybody knew that this was going to happen. It is the same for all SL clubs.

Nathan Brown is paid a lot of money to look after the interests of his players. That is his job. Answer this question honestly: does it surprise you that he is doing all he can to get game time for the saints players?

#14 AlwaysCru

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 08:10 AM

The big difference No1 Saints Fan is that it's Nathan Brown dictating to another club who they should be picking in the team!

But the Coach of that other team (Rochdale) isn't going to say "No, thanks" because Nathan Brown is his boss!! He's also paid by St Helen's and, as I understand it, is based at St Helen's training ground where all the Rochdale training sessions take place.

Thats why you have a very talented player in Paul Crook being played out of position because the Head Coach of St Helen's says that's what's going to happen.

It's a real shame in my opinion that Super League clubs can effectively own a Championship Club in this way and someone should do something about it.

Dual Reg and the loan system existed last year and Super League coaches offered out players to clubs with a view to getting them game time, the only difference is that the Coach of the Championship Club decided if they wanted them or not. They didn't shift their 6 to Loose Forward to accommodate the whims of a Super League coach (again, his BOSS!).

Lakeside makes the point that this is a "supporters owned club" and if that's true I can't understand how those supporters could let their club be taken over like this. Ultimately whoever owns the club is supposed to take decisions not just give that power away to a bigger club to do it for them.

In John Stakvitch you had a good coach, a good set up and a very good side. What changed? Why did you feel the need to give all that power over to an over rated Australian who's only interest is keeping his Super League players happy?

Who knows what contract has been signed but for the good of the game and your own self respect, I urge you as a fellow Rugby League fan to take back control of your club before its too late.

We played Gateshead last week at Craven Park as part of their deal with Hull KR... How long before someone says "langtree park is a nice stadium" and "isn't it a shame it sits empty 13 days out of 14"

After all it'd closer for the coaches.... and the players.... In fact everyone except the "owners" of Rochdale Hornets... the fans.




#15 Lakeside

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 08:49 AM

The long term problem with this deal will be all Hornets, disgrunteled players, fans not knowing who is who from week to week, Saints players unavialable for big games, local businesses losing out i.e. Kit washing being done at Saints.

On the face of it the deal looks a "no brainer" but when you drill down I'm not so sure.

One big plus its that it's less resposibility for the people running Hornets which I'm sure they will welcome as ever.

#16 The Collector

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 10:20 AM

I have supported Rochdale Hornets through thiick and thin (mainly thin) for 60 years, and initially I was in favour of DR, but only on the understanding that it was to be used to blood young players, not to give super league stars a game. My views have now changed.

My concern at NWC today is how are we to accomodate two halfbacks, Gaskell & Ashe? Do we drop Crooky & Roper (who are our established players in theses positions, or move other players around thereby disrupting the team (and their moral) even further. It must be pretty upsetting to find you have trained hard all week to suddenly find out you are being replaced by a saints player.

Recently we had the farce of Tommy Makinson playing for 3 different teams in 3 different divisions on 3 consecutive weeks. Namely Hornets, Whitehaven & Saints. How can this be fair to anyone least of all Makinson. I have to say this in no way is detremental to Tommy, who played his heart out for us against Gateshead Thunder.

It's now time for Hornets board to stand up and be counted, and start selecting our own team without the obvious influence of saints coaching staff.

Unless things change, ww will find ourselves totally run by saints, which will be a disaster.

ONWARD HORNETS (not saints) ONWARD!!

#17 StarfireHypervixen

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 11:10 AM

The last 2 posters may not be entirely wrong. However,I don't believe that the Hornet's board acted with anything but the club's interest at heart. They worst they can be accused of is being sincerely wrong.
They are people with full time jobs away from Hornets, families to look after, and will need time for themselves, they're not paid, but do it for the love of the club.
Just some things for the critics to think about.
Living life in such a way, that when my feet hit the floor in the morning, Satan says "Oh *@$^! She's awake!"

#18 StarfireHypervixen

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 11:11 AM

Deleted due to repeat posting

Edited by StarfireHypervixen, 17 March 2013 - 11:12 AM.

Living life in such a way, that when my feet hit the floor in the morning, Satan says "Oh *@$^! She's awake!"

#19 The Collector

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 12:07 PM

My posting was not a direct criticism of any board members. I know how much unpaid effort they put in, but comments on DR and that perhaps the board may want to reconsider the current satae of play!!




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