Jump to content


TotalRL.com Shop Alert: Last Ordering Date for Free Pre-Xmas Delivery within UK: 2pm Thursday 18th December!!
Rugby League Yearbook 2014/15 The Forbidden Game League Express League Express Gift Card Rugby League World Rugby League World Gift Card
Buy Now £14.99 / Kindle Buy Now £14.99 / Kindle Print / Digital Subscription Gift Cards Print / Digital Subscription Gift Cards



Photo
* * * - - 1 votes

Diminishing Junior Teams


  • Please log in to reply
52 replies to this topic

#1 TedCharlton

TedCharlton
  • Players
  • 24 posts

Posted 28 March 2013 - 02:24 PM

What do you think? Junior RFL League Teams are diminishing because of the tight age ranges between the 14's to the 17's. It is now allowed to move up a year above your age. So some teams of U15's age are playing up to 16's from a larger U15's age group. This is great!, it means more games in each of the leagues and a better standard of game in both leagues. The question is should over age players (one year above) be allowed to also move down an age group?
Could a number of over age be nominated in teams of which two or three can enter the field of play at any one time.
We are loosing teams because of the imbalances in any years when full teams cannot be fielded because of age restrictions. We need leagues consisting of more than sometimes only six teams contesting in a season.

#2 terrywebbisgod

terrywebbisgod
  • Coach
  • 8,625 posts

Posted 28 March 2013 - 03:04 PM

Many years ago team structures were 9's,11's,13's,15's,17's.That seemed to work.
Cannibal chiefs chew Camembert cheese,cos chewing keeps them cheeky.

#3 Marauder

Marauder
  • Coach
  • 11,822 posts

Posted 28 March 2013 - 03:12 PM

What do you think? Junior RFL League Teams are diminishing because of the tight age ranges between the 14's to the 17's. It is now allowed to move up a year above your age. So some teams of U15's age are playing up to 16's from a larger U15's age group. This is great!, it means more games in each of the leagues and a better standard of game in both leagues. The question is should over age players (one year above) be allowed to also move down an age group?
Could a number of over age be nominated in teams of which two or three can enter the field of play at any one time.
We are loosing teams because of the imbalances in any years when full teams cannot be fielded because of age restrictions. We need leagues consisting of more than sometimes only six teams contesting in a season.

I saw teams play overaged players before and the result was kids who where in the age brackets being hurt, It also does no good in trying to develop the core skills, the bigger older lad will just run with the ball more than he would against players his own age and size, like it or lump it, BARLA has it right and it's a system born from years of trial and error.
Carlsberg don't do Soldiers, but if they did, they would probably be Brits.



http://www.pitchero....hornemarauders/

#4 TedCharlton

TedCharlton
  • Players
  • 24 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 11:21 AM

I saw teams play overaged players before and the result was kids who where in the age brackets being hurt, It also does no good in trying to develop the core skills, the bigger older lad will just run with the ball more than he would against players his own age and size, like it or lump it, BARLA has it right and it's a system born from years of trial and error.


Hi Coach, I have been involved in many sports in my 70 years, the one saying that is relevent is "If your good enough your old enough". Between the ages of 14 to 17 years stature can vary from 8 stone dripping wet to 18 stones of muscle. I am not suggesting a full team of U16s play a team of U15's, only a few in number maybe (less than) 4/5 U16's in any U15s team. Barla now allows a full U15's team to play up a year. I now see younger players far outstriping older players. Allowing some over-age lads playing down a year can relay experience to the younger ones, and allow under subscribed Club Squads to continue playing RFL by creating more league teams with more games to play. Thanks for your reply. What do you others think?

#5 Wilber

Wilber
  • Coach
  • 131 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 11:52 AM

The problem is not that Simple.
The rule can only apply one way because of fear of an older player playing against a player two years younger! It is probable that if you allow older players to play down they could clash with younger players playing up.
A true under 15 playing against a true under 13 in junior years is not acceptable in a physical contest. The argument is not the same for Under 16's playing up to 18's or Open age as once you attain the age of 16 in the UK you are classed as an adult.
The rule will never change for that reason and to be honest that's the correct decision

#6 South Wakefield Sharks

South Wakefield Sharks
  • Coach
  • 2,224 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 12:06 PM

I think things work pretty well as they are. Not sure why a team of U15s would want to play in an U16s league rather than an U15s league though?

Usually it is only a few players who play up a year, although I know there was a Hull team who played a year above the other year, but that was simply because there was no one else in Hull at their own age group capable of giving them a decent game. They have since moved to Yorkshire Juniors and are back playing at their own age group.

A mate of mine had a lad who played union, and they allowed players to play both up a year and down a year, with the aim of allowing smaller kids a chance to play down a year with lads more their size.

#7 tim2

tim2
  • Coach
  • 8,379 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 12:07 PM

The RFL looked into size/weight categories as a way round this but the insurance companies weren't interested. I guess that players grow/change quickly between 13 and 16 so keeping track of a players dimensions is tricky!
North Derbyshire Chargers - join the stampede

Marathon in 2015 - the hard work starts now

#8 tim2

tim2
  • Coach
  • 8,379 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 12:08 PM

I think things work pretty well as they are. Not sure why a team of U15s would want to play in an U16s league rather than an U15s league though?

Usually it is only a few players who play up a year, although I know there was a Hull team who played a year above the other year, but that was simply because there was no one else in Hull at their own age group capable of giving them a decent game. They have since moved to Yorkshire Juniors and are back playing at their own age group.

A mate of mine had a lad who played union, and they allowed players to play both up a year and down a year, with the aim of allowing smaller kids a chance to play down a year with lads more their size.


I think two Hull sides have done that - they were way too strong for the Hull league so they went up to U16 in YJL instead of staying at U15 in Hull.

We have a couple of players in our U16 playing a year up but we have had some who we don't think is physically safe to play at that age group. Tough call as we don't have an U15 team but you have a duty of care.

Edited by tim2, 29 March 2013 - 12:11 PM.

North Derbyshire Chargers - join the stampede

Marathon in 2015 - the hard work starts now

#9 TedCharlton

TedCharlton
  • Players
  • 24 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 01:08 PM

The problem is not that Simple.
The rule can only apply one way because of fear of an older player playing against a player two years younger! It is probable that if you allow older players to play down they could clash with younger players playing up.
A true under 15 playing against a true under 13 in junior years is not acceptable in a physical contest. The argument is not the same for Under 16's playing up to 18's or Open age as once you attain the age of 16 in the UK you are classed as an adult.
The rule will never change for that reason and to be honest that's the correct decision

Hi Walter, I obviously have opened "a can of worms". Using the age of 16 as a guide to being an adult is questionable, height, weight, physique, knowledge etc. I know of a 14 year old being questioned of his status because he shaved. "We will not play your team if he plays" regardless of the team cards being produced. In your area you maybe have a large player containment area and 30+ years of RFL. In the North East we have six teams forming a league (10 games) one of the teams being mostly U15's playing up as well as them playing in thier U15's league. Protection against over aggressive play would need to be watched, but even that is addressed in Super League? its expensive for our teams to travel to Yorkshire for more games with out financial help for the progress of RFL.

#10 TedCharlton

TedCharlton
  • Players
  • 24 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 01:20 PM

I think things work pretty well as they are. Not sure why a team of U15s would want to play in an U16s league rather than an U15s league though?

Usually it is only a few players who play up a year, although I know there was a Hull team who played a year above the other year, but that was simply because there was no one else in Hull at their own age group capable of giving them a decent game. They have since moved to Yorkshire Juniors and are back playing at their own age group.

A mate of mine had a lad who played union, and they allowed players to play both up a year and down a year, with the aim of allowing smaller kids a chance to play down a year with lads more their size.

Hi Assistant Coach, You have said it, allow smaller 16's players to play down, mixed age teams 14's-17s' sensibly put together would create more teams and more games to play. No one wants games of humiliation, we can ask under subscribed teams to play and then even out the numbers to get a game going.

#11 TedCharlton

TedCharlton
  • Players
  • 24 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 01:23 PM

Many years ago team structures were 9's,11's,13's,15's,17's.That seemed to work.


What no U16's, we need to cover all ages and play up and down a year!

#12 TedCharlton

TedCharlton
  • Players
  • 24 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 01:30 PM

The RFL looked into size/weight categories as a way round this but the insurance companies weren't interested. I guess that players grow/change quickly between 13 and 16 so keeping track of a players dimensions is tricky!

Hi Tim2, Can see why that stance would be a no go, common sense is the answer? control of the game by the coaches and officials upto the age of 17's should be paramount.

#13 Marauder

Marauder
  • Coach
  • 11,822 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 02:15 PM

I think things work pretty well as they are. Not sure why a team of U15s would want to play in an U16s league rather than an U15s league though?

Usually it is only a few players who play up a year, although I know there was a Hull team who played a year above the other year, but that was simply because there was no one else in Hull at their own age group capable of giving them a decent game. They have since moved to Yorkshire Juniors and are back playing at their own age group.

A mate of mine had a lad who played union, and they allowed players to play both up a year and down a year, with the aim of allowing smaller kids a chance to play down a year with lads more their size.

If you get elite squad building an elite U15's will be OK a year above.
Carlsberg don't do Soldiers, but if they did, they would probably be Brits.



http://www.pitchero....hornemarauders/

#14 Marauder

Marauder
  • Coach
  • 11,822 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 02:22 PM

What no U16's, we need to cover all ages and play up and down a year!

The welfare of kids far out strip the game and moving down a year is a no no, it's been explained earlier the difference in growth over 12 months in kids between 14 and 17 is massive and some kid will get hurt, I joined the army at 15 and the 17 year olds who where ready to go to their units looked like growm men at the side of us recruits.
Carlsberg don't do Soldiers, but if they did, they would probably be Brits.



http://www.pitchero....hornemarauders/

#15 Marauder

Marauder
  • Coach
  • 11,822 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 02:36 PM

Hi Coach, I have been involved in many sports in my 70 years, the one saying that is relevent is "If your good enough your old enough". Between the ages of 14 to 17 years stature can vary from 8 stone dripping wet to 18 stones of muscle. I am not suggesting a full team of U16s play a team of U15's, only a few in number maybe (less than) 4/5 U16's in any U15s team. Barla now allows a full U15's team to play up a year. I now see younger players far outstriping older players. Allowing some over-age lads playing down a year can relay experience to the younger ones, and allow under subscribed Club Squads to continue playing RFL by creating more league teams with more games to play. Thanks for your reply. What do you others think?

Hi Supporter In theory it sounds good, but who will police this older player moving down a year (A Certain club earlier this year played a player against our U17'S who we later got told was 24)
Carlsberg don't do Soldiers, but if they did, they would probably be Brits.



http://www.pitchero....hornemarauders/

#16 TedCharlton

TedCharlton
  • Players
  • 24 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 02:43 PM

Hi Marauder, Take your point about welfare of our kids, its important, but I see the differences in statuer and age. Why is it OK to move up and not to move down within restrictions and reason, the idea is to try create more games where there are now few. Think I will put to bed now, thanks for your input.

#17 TedCharlton

TedCharlton
  • Players
  • 24 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 02:46 PM

Hi Marauder, 24 years old, bet he shaved, I think player cards are important and should be looked at. Regards Ted C.

#18 Marauder

Marauder
  • Coach
  • 11,822 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 08:50 PM

Hi Marauder, 24 years old, bet he shaved, I think player cards are important and should be looked at. Regards Ted C.

They had them, he also had tattoos all over and tagged, he kept causing fights and actually stampped on and broke a young lads ankle - Not going to mention the club who are actually a well respected club within the amateur game (can't blame everyone at the club)
Carlsberg don't do Soldiers, but if they did, they would probably be Brits.



http://www.pitchero....hornemarauders/

#19 Marauder

Marauder
  • Coach
  • 11,822 posts

Posted 29 March 2013 - 08:59 PM

Hi Marauder, Take your point about welfare of our kids, its important, but I see the differences in statuer and age. Why is it OK to move up and not to move down within restrictions and reason, the idea is to try create more games where there are now few. Think I will put to bed now, thanks for your input.

Because a coach can move up a player who is equal to his peers but to bring a elite 16 year old into a 15 year olds competition could get a lesser mature 15 year old hurt or even put them and others off of the game for life, that would create less teams.

If you've got a lad at an age where he can't get a game at his own age, travel, we have lads who have travelled to Castleford, Featherstone and to the nearest Doncaster club which is 12 miles away, I've seen lads at Stanley Rangers who have travelled from Goole.

Edited by Marauder, 29 March 2013 - 09:05 PM.

Carlsberg don't do Soldiers, but if they did, they would probably be Brits.



http://www.pitchero....hornemarauders/

#20 LordCharles

LordCharles
  • Coach
  • 808 posts

Posted 30 March 2013 - 08:06 AM

What do you think? Junior RFL League Teams are diminishing because of the tight age ranges between the 14's to the 17's. It is now allowed to move up a year above your age. So some teams of U15's age are playing up to 16's from a larger U15's age group. This is great!, it means more games in each of the leagues and a better standard of game in both leagues. The question is should over age players (one year above) be allowed to also move down an age group?
Could a number of over age be nominated in teams of which two or three can enter the field of play at any one time.
We are loosing teams because of the imbalances in any years when full teams cannot be fielded because of age restrictions. We need leagues consisting of more than sometimes only six teams contesting in a season.



Ted you are hardly JR Hartley so perhaps another hobby might be more suitable..................how's the weather in Wigan today?




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users