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Labour's last chance gone?


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58 replies to this topic

#21 Northern Sol

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Posted 29 March 2013 - 09:16 PM

The debt is increasing.


And?

How do you think debt can be decreased whilst tax revenues are falling (perhaps due to recession)?

Especially since you are against cuts.

#22 Northern Sol

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Posted 29 March 2013 - 09:16 PM

But by less than it would be if the government carried on with the last ones policies so we either need more cuts or higher taxes.


That's about the size of it.

#23 JohnM

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Posted 29 March 2013 - 10:24 PM

And less than it was in May 2011.

However, tax take is down:
some examples:
1. Vehicle excise duty revenue is down as more people choose lower emission vehicles
2. Fuel tax revenue is down as people reduce the mileage they do, so buying less fuel
3. Income tax take is down, for example, the introduction of the 50% tax rate in 2010 actually reduced tax revenue, contrary to what the govt was intending..unless ir was actually trying to punish higher earners
4. Increasing the personal allowance has taken millions of basic rate tax payers out of income tax and saved many more several hundreds of pounds a year and this loss has only been partially offset by bringing half a million more into the 40% tax band.

So, the official opposition has a deliberate policy of wanting to borrow even more!!

6. Twatcher ...traitors .... shysters :lol:
7. A £2.3m house with £400,000 mortgage. :lol: :lol:
8. Tell me Ms Shackelton, what was it that first attracted you the the millionaire Mr Mi£iband? :lol: :lol: :lol:
7. We've abolished boom and bust
8. That bigoted woman




#24 steef

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Posted 29 March 2013 - 10:41 PM

Neither party has an answer or is the answer.
"surely they've got to try somthing different now, maybe the little chip over the top?2


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#25 Griff9of13

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 09:32 AM

Neither party has an answer or is the answer.


Nail on head. Unfortunately. :(

"it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it."

#26 Saint Billinge

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 10:35 AM

Neither party has an answer or is the answer.


That's the way I think. This government as well as previous ones have messed up, resulting in a lack of confidence going forward. They just bleat on and on blaming other factors.

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#27 gingerjon

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 12:06 PM

Neither party has an answer or is the answer.

Sadly, this is my conclusion. There seems to be a line that says the last Labour government's 'mistake' was in maintaining the Tory policies. But they didn't: they expanded them and, combined with ludicrous levels of financial mismanagement, set the platform for what the Coalition has done in the name of austerity. Now, in opposition, Labour have made absolutely no commitment to reversing any of the controversial policies of this government. We have a situation where all of the main parties stand further to the right economically and in a social welfare sense than the majority of the electorate.
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#28 getdownmonkeyman

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 01:13 PM

Same ######, just different colour ties.

#29 The Future is League

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 01:41 PM

Labour doesn't have to do a thing to win the next election. Dave and Gideon are doing it all for them. The Tories know what they they to do to win the next election, but they don't have the courage to do it.

#30 Methven Hornet

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 02:56 PM

Regardless of how badly the coalition are doing, it is difficult to imagine the current shadow cabinet being in power. It is depressing.
"There are now more pandas in Scotland than Tory MPs."

#31 Bedford Roughyed

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 04:22 PM

Regardless of how badly the coalition are doing, it is difficult to imagine the current shadow cabinet being in power. It is depressing.

No real big hitters stand out. Most shadow teams have a couple of terms to get rid of a bit of dead wood and allow new people to shine. Can't think of many stand out performers (including Ed).
With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on!

#32 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 12:34 PM

In voting for Ed Milliband the Labour party proved themselves to be out of touch with the modern voter. Regardless of which of the two is the better politician, there has been a change to the extent where style as well as substance is important. David has the balance, he looks the part which lets face it Ed doesn't. It might sound shallow but the British public are shallow, Ed Milliband looks and talks weird and that's what many will base their opinions on.

I still think Labour will narrowly win next time but not by as much as they should do with the failure of the Tory policies and ridiculous number of U-turns that they seem to make.

#33 JohnM

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 12:41 PM

Sadly, this is my conclusion. There seems to be a line that says the last Labour government's 'mistake' was in maintaining the Tory policies. But they didn't: they expanded them and, combined with ludicrous levels of financial mismanagement, set the platform for what the Coalition has done in the name of austerity. Now, in opposition, Labour have made absolutely no commitment to reversing any of the controversial policies of this government. We have a situation where all of the main parties stand further to the right economically and in a social welfare sense than the majority of the electorate.


For example, the policy of aligning housing benefit and housing need in public sector housing, designed to motivate councils and housing associations to cut under occupation is in fact a continuation of Labour policy.

Announced as far back as 2003 the Labour Govt introduced exactly this in 2008,when it brought in Local Housing Allowance for private tenants receiving housing benefit. LHA is paid direct to tenants not landlords, and is based on the number of bedrooms you are assessed as needing. This was done to reduce the huge cost of housing benefit.

By the way, construction of social housing fell to just 375 in 2008
.

#34 JohnM

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 12:49 PM

......ridiculous number of U-turns that they seem to make.


Quite so. Its as if they just don't think things through and are unable to explain themselves properly, either, or are unable to persuade the Humphreys of this world to do as they are told. I thought we would see and end to all that when 10% tax and boom-and-bust abolitionist Brown was booted out by a British public that had proved themselves far from shallow.

Cameron does his best but has signally failed to push sufficient of his party's Little Englanders into Farage's maw so they could be replaced by a few good men and true from the Lib Dems...not that there are that many.

#35 Trojan

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 03:08 PM

TBH I think the fact that David has cut and run rather than stay, support his brother and try to get his party re-elected speaks volumes for his (lack of) character. He didn't have the bottle to stand against Brown, before the 2010 election and he hasn't the good grace to support his brother, accept a Shadow Cabinet post and try to etablish his view of how our country should be run.
It's true that Labour left a huge deficit. It's also true that up to the crisis Cameron & Co saw nothing wrong with Labour's economic policies,indeed they promised to match Labour's spending plans. They also called for less not more regulation of the banks. This government has reduced the deficit, largely by cutting capital spending, which has crippled the construction industry. The prospects of what Osborne's first budget would do eliminated the 2% growth that was present in the economy and no matter what the next figures say, the coalition's growth record can only be described as a disaster.
Whether the Eds have better policies than this lot remains to be seen. Hopefully they do, but one can only assume they are keeping their powder dry. Any policies announced now will either be shot down in flames by the Tories if they are the least bit suspect or nicked if they are any good.
"Your a one trick pony Trojan" - Parksider 10th March 2013

#36 Steve May

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 09:18 PM

Labour have a substantial lead that's been holding up pretty well. For all that Ed Milliband is meant to be constantly under threat his party seems pretty unified and they don't have to do much beyond point out the failure of austerity politics to win.


Ed Miliband has never been under threat as leader of the Labour Party. Anyone in the press who has claimed otherwise does not know how the Labour Party works and is probably guilty of mischief or wishful thinking.

As I have said before on this board, it is nearly impossible to unseat a Labour Party leader if he doesn't want to go. The Party constitution doesn't work like that.

That's me.  I'm done.


#37 Richard de la Riviere

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 10:37 PM

TBH I think the fact that David has cut and run rather than stay, support his brother and try to get his party re-elected speaks volumes for his (lack of) character.


It also speaks volumes for the fact that Ed's as safe as houses. It's a backhanded compliment really!

#38 Northern Sol

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Posted 01 April 2013 - 06:37 AM

Sadly, this is my conclusion. There seems to be a line that says the last Labour government's 'mistake' was in maintaining the Tory policies. But they didn't: they expanded them and, combined with ludicrous levels of financial mismanagement, set the platform for what the Coalition has done in the name of austerity. Now, in opposition, Labour have made absolutely no commitment to reversing any of the controversial policies of this government. We have a situation where all of the main parties stand further to the right economically and in a social welfare sense than the majority of the electorate.


Not really true.

Reality is to the right of the British electorate.

Labour won't make a commitment because they would get the same advice as the Tories get now and be forced to accept the same conclusions.

#39 Trojan

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Posted 01 April 2013 - 08:24 AM

Not really true.

Reality is to the right of the British electorate.

Labour won't make a commitment because they would get the same advice as the Tories get now and be forced to accept the same conclusions.

Labour won't make a commitment now because we are 2 years from a General Election - how firm policies had Cameron announced in March 2008? Some of them (like NHS privatisation) weren't even in the manifesto when the election came.
"Your a one trick pony Trojan" - Parksider 10th March 2013

#40 gingerjon

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Posted 01 April 2013 - 08:31 AM

Labour won't make a commitment now because we are 2 years from a General Election - how firm policies had Cameron announced in March 2008? Some of them (like NHS privatisation) weren't even in the manifesto when the election came.

You might not agree with it but the Conservatives put out (and promoted) a mini manifesto specifically on the NHS reforms - building entirely on the platform laid by Labour which continued the work of the Thatcher/Major government - before the last election.
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