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George Burgess


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#41 bobbruce

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 06:38 PM

So automatic selection into Souths is the benchmark for England? I think that's a case of giving the NRL too much respect. I wouldn't say that everyone that is an automatic selection for Souths is good enough for England's starting 17.


Of course not but for me he has been the best impact player in the NRL this season off the bench. Not bad for a player in his first proper season over there. If he keeps this form up he has to be down as a bench player for England in the WC.

#42 Dave T

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 09:44 PM

To be fair they are right.

I remember when we signef NRL regulars Chris Leikvoll and Paul Rauhihi. They blitzed SL and showed the class they had.

No disrespect to these players btw who had solid stints at Wire.

#43 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 10:13 PM


Automatic selection for Souths isn't the benchmark for England, but they are one of the best teams in the world and George is ripping it up for them. He's the form English forward at the moment and there's no one in SL at his level currently.


That's fine, and they are reasons why he should be considered for selection. NOT because he gets selected for Souths.
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#44 CGD

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 01:17 PM

George Burgess scares me as an Aussie.

#45 hindle xiii

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 01:22 PM

George Burgess scares me as an Aussie.

Psst.

 

There's another one who is exactly the same.


2826856.jpg?type=articleLandscape

 

On Odsal Top baht 'at.


#46 petero

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 08:10 PM

So automatic selection into Souths is the benchmark for England? I think that's a case of giving the NRL too much respect. I wouldn't say that everyone that is an automatic selection for Souths is good enough for England's starting 17.

 

Presently I would!............Or Melbourne..........or Manly.........or the Bronco's etc etc etc.

I was expecting such a reply that you offerred, so I will answer with what I really believe is fact, that being that as the NRL is so much in superiority to the S/L (playing standards wise), then those capable of gaining the accolade of having not simply regular first team selection but, automatically so, would qualify as being good enough to warrant selection for our rep side at the present time.

 

No apologies for that either. I do watch all of the NRL and I contend that the standard over there is so much higher than ours and, consistently so, that I see no reason whatever to deny any English player down there from being capable and good enough, to be selected for our rep side in October.

 

These lads are competing to a much higher game standard on a weekly basis and, will be very used to what it takes to thrive against such opposition that they will face in the W/Cup. Consequently it would be an absolute no brainer to not include them when they will be facing the best that the S/Hemi can offer.   



#47 RSN

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 08:23 PM

That's abit to far petero, fair enough the NRL is a higher standard but everyone playing in a top 6 NRL side wouldn't get in the England side, far from it.

I know that Australia are ahead of England in many ways, I still think that if England had Smith, Cronk and Thurston playing in 6 7 9 instead of Australia England would beat them.

Most Englishman recently who have gone to Australia have excelled, most Englishmen who have played against Australia recently have played reasonably well.

If you forget about the respective competitions in each country and just look at the first teams there isn't a huge gap in between them. Although England's first choice squad is paper thin underneath especially in the backs, the first choice England players are more than a match for the Aussies apart from 6, 7, 9 and a centre.

So I have to disagree that any top end NRL player would start for England, I'd say realistically 20% would have a decent shot, but all of them not a chance.

#48 Wiltshire Rhino

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 10:03 PM

I still think that if England had Smith, Cronk and Thurston playing in 6 7 9 instead of Australia England would beat them.

I'd agree with that

#49 petero

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 07:43 PM

That's abit to far petero, fair enough the NRL is a higher standard but everyone playing in a top 6 NRL side wouldn't get in the England side, far from it.

I know that Australia are ahead of England in many ways, I still think that if England had Smith, Cronk and Thurston playing in 6 7 9 instead of Australia England would beat them.

Most Englishman recently who have gone to Australia have excelled, most Englishmen who have played against Australia recently have played reasonably well.

If you forget about the respective competitions in each country and just look at the first teams there isn't a huge gap in between them. Although England's first choice squad is paper thin underneath especially in the backs, the first choice England players are more than a match for the Aussies apart from 6, 7, 9 and a centre.

So I have to disagree that any top end NRL player would start for England, I'd say realistically 20% would have a decent shot, but all of them not a chance.

 

I do not believe that I stated that any TOP end NRL player would gain an England place, did I?

What I stated was, that those Englishmen presently playing down under are definitely worthy of gaining representative selection if they have made themselves automatic first team choices in the NRL.

 

I do believe you would not deny that if anyone of our players is considered good enough for the NRL then he would definitely be a first choice player here too and obviously then be in line for selection come October?

 

So far each and everyone, barring the three more obscure Burgess lads have been at the top of their profession in the S/L prior to going to OZ.

Burgess G has undoubtedly shown that he would have been a sensation here also and to a lesser degree Burgess L also gained recognition at the end of his half term session last season as well, why even Mac took notice! And included him in his squad for the tri-Nations and training in S/Africa.

 

It may have slipped by, but Luke Burgess was given good game time at Souths and proved that he could be far better than he seemed at Leeds where he never really got to settle into their side. I cannot say he will regain a permanent place after injury, at Souths, but should he and then become an automatic choice there again, then he to would have to, I maintain, also be re-examined as to whether he was worthy of a place.

Should he accomplish all that, then yet again I would say he would be too.

 

PS I also agree with your notion concerning Smith, Slater and Cronk, only a fool would not do ;).    



#50 bobbruce

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 08:19 PM

I do not believe that I stated that any TOP end NRL player would gain an England place, did I?
What I stated was, that those Englishmen presently playing down under are definitely worthy of gaining representative selection if they have made themselves automatic first team choices in the NRL.

I do believe you would not deny that if anyone of our players is considered good enough for the NRL then he would definitely be a first choice player here too and obviously then be in line for selection come October?

So far each and everyone, barring the three more obscure Burgess lads have been at the top of their profession in the S/L prior to going to OZ.
Burgess G has undoubtedly shown that he would have been a sensation here also and to a lesser degree Burgess L also gained recognition at the end of his half term session last season as well, why even Mac took notice! And included him in his squad for the tri-Nations and training in S/Africa.

It may have slipped by, but Luke Burgess was given good game time at Souths and proved that he could be far better than he seemed at Leeds where he never really got to settle into their side. I cannot say he will regain a permanent place after injury, at Souths, but should he and then become an automatic choice there again, then he to would have to, I maintain, also be re-examined as to whether he was worthy of a place.

I think George should be in the England squad at the end of the year provided he keeps his form. Due to him playing well though not just because he's getting a game.

As for Luke Burgess I actually think he goes against your argument. Forgetting this year as he's injured but last year he got himself a regular spot at souths. It certainly made me look at him in a new light a brought his game on. It didn't though have me thinking he was a shoe in for England. Same as Scott Moore this year I'm not sure if he's injured at the minute but early in the season he was playing well at NQ but that shouldn't have him down as the starting 9 for England.

Edited by bobbruce, 16 April 2013 - 08:20 PM.


#51 OMEGA

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 09:41 PM

Scott Moore is a good case in point, he wouldn't get past 6 or 7 other hookers who are all ahead of him.
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#52 statties

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 09:56 PM

forget bench warmer, if George keeps going the way he is then I would have him starting every game!

 

His form in the NRL is almost unequalled



#53 petero

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Posted 17 April 2013 - 04:23 PM

forget bench warmer, if George keeps going the way he is then I would have him starting every game!

 

His form in the NRL is almost unequalled

 

Quite agree, and thanks for the support.

 

Bobbruce: Thats absolutely correct concerning Moore, he has not played well enough nor long enough at NQ, nor was his form that inspiring and most importantly Bob he misses out on the credential I have pointed to; automatic selection because his form and play demands of it. He is not injured but dropped to the whatever comp there that is the equivalent of what was called once the A team over here. I would not say that he was playing that well either, competently, yes, but by no means outstanding

 

 

 

 Omega: I also agree with your rating of Moore alongside those other hookers , playing here too. I was surprised when I realised that he was in the NQ side but not at all so when he was overlooked as Kostyason having been a decent player at Melbourne, would I imagine, have gained the spot at hooker over Moore before long anyway. 






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