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Clubs aiming beyond their capabilities


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#41 sweaty craiq

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Posted 17 April 2013 - 11:12 PM

For yet another season the talking point in our country's major sport is the relegation dogfight in the Premier and the promotion from the championship



#42 The Parksider

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 06:10 AM

For yet another season the talking point in our country's major sport is the relegation dogfight in the Premier and the promotion from the championship

Quite.

It's more exciting than the talking point being the collapse of SL clubs and the slow death of the championship.

Are you proposing we all switch to soccer BTW?

Because relegation dogfights that get people talking and watching are very rare in RL.

Always have been.

Edited by The Parksider, 18 April 2013 - 06:10 AM.


#43 The Parksider

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 06:17 AM

Which would give us a give us a team in Wakefield watched by a few thousand fans, a team in Cas watched by a few thousand fans, a team in Fev watched by a few thousand fans and the new Super Club watched by NO fans because they'll be spending their money watching THEIR team in Wakey, Cas or Fev.

A "few thousand fans" don't watch any Championship club apart from the two who still think they may get in SL, then it's only 2,000 fans.

Clubs who will not get in Superleague ever again average 900 fans.

The Wakefield gates and the proposed stadium are not for throwing away on a scheme that will not appeal to any existing fans, and in it's early stages will not attract a significant new fanbase.

It's a shame people can't recognise the potential of Wakefield especially Mr. Nahaboo!

#44 RoytonRoughyed

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 07:36 AM

theres summat that gets u tingling now that the back end of the football season is here- oh yer prom and rel -in otherwords- the whole point of the season!

 Im a football fan and went to watch Oldham on Tuesday night in a game the team needed to win to avoid relegation. It was a great game to be at because it mattered to all 3,800 latics fans in the ground, P&R is the Only way forward. There is a reason it happens in every sport in this country, It even happens in Cricket now.  



#45 The Parksider

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 07:57 AM

Im a football fan and went to watch Oldham on Tuesday night in a game the team needed to win to avoid relegation. It was a great game to be at because it mattered to all 3,800 latics fans in the ground, P&R is the Only way forward. There is a reason it happens in every sport in this country, It even happens in Cricket now.

We're not football

We're not cricket

Last time there was P & R it was one down and you had situations like 2003 and when the relegated team was obvious only several weeks into the season. They won one match. Then again in 2005 when again it was all over before it began when the relegated team won two matches.

The study was done and over the seasons only a few games were relegation dog fights that attracted fans in greater number. Even then such as Widnes.v.Cas 2004 only attracted an extra 830 fans.

The only reason there could be a relegation dogfight this year is that several clubs are collapsing.

I'd love to see the crowd for a Salford.v.London winner stays up........

Edited by The Parksider, 18 April 2013 - 08:00 AM.


#46 Just to be clear

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 08:53 AM

There is a reason it happens in every sport in this country, It even happens in Cricket now.

Just to be clear, it happens in a minority of British sports. Football, English rugby union, first class cricket. That is the least watched form of cricket, with has an average attendance in the hundreds. And the county championship was only split into two to reduce the number of one-sided matches in an 18 team league which were seen as detrimental to producing England players, a reason that is not applicable to rugby league.

The much more popular FPT20 and the YB40 both use conferences and playoffs.

#47 statties

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:19 AM

London have the potential do they?

Oh right

Yes London do have the potential and any person with an IQ above 65 could tell you that.

 

Furthermore, to the one who said that there would be no fans to watch a new Super Wakefield SL club, then in this instance I would send Cas back to Championship with Fev and let Wildcats be the focus SL club for the area. SL cannot sustain that many teams in one small area.

 

All sports across the world have had to move with the times at one stage or another by either folding or merging clubs where the financial aspects no longer support a club's existence in the top flight. SL is not exempt from this and while it is a hard pill to swallow, it is one the three clubs in the Wakefield district will sooner or later..



#48 a.n Other

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:58 AM



All sports across the world have had to move with the times at one stage or another by either folding or merging clubs where the financial aspects no longer support a club's existence in the top flight. .

No they haven't.

#49 statties

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:31 AM

No they haven't.

 

additionally with moving (same difference), all major club sporting competitions have had to deal with issues like merging/folding/moving clubs or realigning the club structure due to the lack of sustainability of clubs.

 

NRL, Wales RU, Super 10 Rugby, NFL, AFL, MLB, NHL, NBA. one each includes:

 

St George Illawarra

Wales RU club realignment

southern hem restructure for provincial over club competitions

St Louis Cardinals,

South Melbourne Swans

NY Giants

Atlanta Thrashers

Kansas City Kings

 

SL will too, its evolution baby



#50 a.n Other

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:37 AM

additionally with moving (same difference), all major club sporting competitions have had to deal with issues like merging/folding/moving clubs or realigning the club structure due to the lack of sustainability of clubs.

NRL, Wales RU, Super 10 Rugby, NFL, AFL, MLB, NHL, NBA. one each includes:

St George Illawarra
Wales RU club realignment
southern hem restructure for provincial over club competitions
St Louis Cardinals,
South Melbourne Swans
NY Giants
Atlanta Thrashers
Kansas City Kings

SL will too, its evolution baby


So not all sports then... in fact hardly any.

Edited by a.n Other, 18 April 2013 - 10:38 AM.


#51 bobbruce

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:13 AM

So not all sports then... in fact hardly any.


I don't particularly agree with statties post but it would be easier for you to name sports that has never had clubs fold or merged. I cant think of any.

#52 a.n Other

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:16 AM


I don't particularly agree with statties post but it would be easier for you to name sports that has never had clubs fold or merged. I cant think of any.


Of course clubs have folded (although mainly not when they are in the top flight) however, I can't think of many other sports other than the few Statties had quoted where clubs have merged to stay in the top flight. Can you?

#53 PREPOSTEROUS

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:52 AM

For yet another season the talking point in our country's major sport is the relegation dogfight in the Premier and the promotion from the championship

 

... and if the country’s major sport had the same structure as SL with an eight team play-off format, it would be about that. They would also have a more exciting end to the PL season to boot.


Edited by PREPOSTEROUS, 18 April 2013 - 11:53 AM.


#54 Death to the Rah Rah's

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 12:07 PM

Nice to see that nobody thinks Cumbria is worthy of a place in these leagues

#55 Griff

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 12:09 PM

Nice to see that nobody thinks Cumbria is worthy of a place in these leagues

Does anyone think they could command the necessary crowds ?


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#56 a.n Other

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 12:13 PM

Does anyone think they could command the necessary crowds ?


Stating the obvious I know...but this doesn't stop Salford or London.

#57 Death to the Rah Rah's

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 12:15 PM

Done properly YES - but it would have to be marketed as a new franchise not as Workington, Whitehaven or Barrow.

Per head of population, the number of people attending matches at the three clubs above will be far higher than it is at Huddersfield, London or Salford, and a Superleague side that was winning its home games would command a 4-5k average attendance.

I'm not for one minute saying they will compete with the top six, but with additional funding from TV money they could certainly compete.

#58 The Parksider

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 12:37 PM

A (cumbria) Superleague side that was winning its home games would command a 4-5k average attendance.

You can't compete at all on those crowds. Look at Cas

Slot in a multi-millionaire owner like O'Connor.

Then maybe.

#59 hindle xiii

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 12:43 PM

You can't compete at all on those crowds. Look at Cas

Slot in a multi-millionaire owner like O'Connor.

Then maybe.

Oof. 3 lines...

 

(Anyway, bored of this game now. Run wild and run free!)


On Odsal Top baht 'at.


#60 keighley

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 12:44 PM

I think these proposals are ludicrous. They do not add to the strength of the game at all. They lessen the number of spectators and diminish overall interest.

 

Currently the two Hull clubs pull in about 19,000 spectators between them. If one went to the wall there is no way the other would pull in 19,000. there might be an increase at the remaining club but there would be a net loss to the game.

 

Widnes and Warrington pull in about 16 to 17,000 between them. If one went to the wall the remaining club would not average that number and, if they, did, there is no stadium to hold them.

 

The calder trio pull in 16 to 17,000 between them. If two went to the wall, there is no way the remaining club would average that number and once again there is no suitable stadium if they did, even if Newmarket is built.

 

RL needs to know where it;'s strengths are and it is not in clubs averaging 15,000. There will never be more than two or three of them. this is not Australia where there is no significant soccer threat. We have huge competition from soccer. Look at Huddersfield, the RL team is in the top three in the SL and the soccer team is facing relegation from the 2nd division and the soccer team outdraws the RL team by almost double. In Wigan, the most successful team ever in the game gets outdrawn by a team which wassn't in the league a few years ago and are pernnial relegation candidates.

 

Look at Bradford, City outdraw the Bulls, a team often touted for their attendances.

 

We need to forget this merger nonsense, allow all clubs to grow as best thery can and there are many encouraging signs that many are and make sure that the salary caps are lowered to make SL a stable competition on crowds in the 7,000 area and less if financing can be found as at the Giants, Salford and London.

 

A small SL struggling like crazy to exist in a vacuum demanding clubs averaging 15,000 is not the answer and will never happen. If it does it will be the final demise of the game.






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