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Well Done Widnes For Sticking With Betts


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#1 westhuller

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 10:39 AM

Credit were its due, Widnes have stuck with a young English coach instead of going for a quick fix.Hopefully now there patience in Dennis is paying off, they seem to be improving season after season and bringing some great young talented players through.Hopefully Bradford will follow there lead and give Francis Cummins the time he needs to develop as a coach too.

#2 TheDuke

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 10:48 AM

Has licencing also helped allow the club to operate without the pressure of relegation and bring youngsters through?

 

I'm all for P and R but think that new teams should get a years grace from relegation



#3 Vikingste

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:01 PM

Has licencing also helped allow the club to operate without the pressure of relegation and bring youngsters through?

 

I'm all for P and R but think that new teams should get a years grace from relegation



#4 Vikingste

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 12:05 PM

Widnes are making nice progress, and we have some very good young players.- that ultimately is the future.- We need to rebuild our whole structure within the town as Widnes was in danger of becoming a football town, trapped in the nowhere land between Liverpool and Manchester.Jack Owens and Danny Craven and Alex Gerrard are as good as any young players in Super League, and in Dennis Betts we have a coach who speaks his mind. We also have a Chief executive and the re structure at the Club has made absolute sense. Providing there is no Ridiculous re structure again like some Rugby league commentators are pushing for, we will again be a true rugby league town



#5 Viking Warrior

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 01:28 PM

widnes are proof that licensing works, if we were promoted under the p&r system then we would have packed out team with old men and antipodeans, as it is we are reaping the benefits of our player developmental system and the likes of owens, craven, gore, lawton and gerrard are proving to be able young players and as the previous poster said are as good as can be found anywhere in super league.
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#6 South Wakefield Sharks

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 01:31 PM

Please to see a club not panic with their coach. Too many clubs fail to give coaches sufficient time. However, I'm no fan of Betts and I'd be surprised if he has a long career as a head coach at the top in rugby league.

I see him as a Karl Harrison type. Decent enough coach, but not cut out for the very top.

#7 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 02:14 PM

Whilst last night was great, let's not get carried away. This win came off the back of 3 poor performances. It is clear though that we are much better this year than last so you won't find me knocking Betts any more. Don't get me wrong, I still don't think he will end up a top coach.

It was really pleasing to hear the kids being given a chance and playing well but I think the downside is that they aren't playing in as high intensity games.

Any Widnesian that isn't watching the games this year though needs their head testing. I can't remember a more exciting season. We've beaten Wire, Saints and Hull; had an epic comeback game against Bradford with 12 men and even some of our defeats have been by 2 points. We even nearly took part in one of the biggest cup upsets ever! This more than makes up for the 3/4 beatings we've suffered.

#8 Larry the Leit

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 08:28 PM

I'm pretty much of the opinion that if your coach is basically competent then given time then they'll come good.  Stability is a massive thing with squad and coaches, so well done Widnes.  I just wish Betts would refrain from sharing his views in the media, he's a bit one eyed, but understandably so.



#9 jonnyg28

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 05:56 AM

It's amazing, Widnes fans wanted him out last season. Certainly a fickle bunch

#10 chuffer

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 08:02 AM

Some did, not all.....

#11 The Daddy_merged

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 01:53 PM

I rate Betts highly as a coach, lets not forget when he was in charge at Wigan the club was a total mess off the field and despite this he still got the team to perform really well. Those criticising him have absolutely no idea what it takes to coach a team which has just come up from the Championship. Were people expecting Widnes to challenge for the play offs last year?

#12 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 08:15 PM

It's amazing, Widnes fans wanted him out last season. Certainly a fickle bunch

 

Yep because I can't remember a single set of fans of any other clubs that have wanted their coach out after a bad set of results. 



#13 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 08:32 PM

 rate Betts highly as a coach, lets not forget when he was in charge at Wigan the club was a total mess off the field and despite this he still got the team to perform really well. Those criticising him have absolutely no idea what it takes to coach a team which has just come up from the Championship. Were people expecting Widnes to challenge for the play offs last year?

 

I didn't accept this as a point then and I still don't now. If you use this argument then there is almost no situation where a coach can be doing a poor job. Let's not forget that out of the whole season we only conceded less than 30 in something like 3 games. Early on we were conceding huge scores (higher than any other previously promoted club) despite having the luxury of almost a year to prepare, which other clubs didn't have.

 

Betts was never a particularly popular choice of coach and his record in the Championship was not good. We should have been in a situation where we were competing for the title but we weren't, we were an average Championship side. Under pressure the club even admitted that they had planned to get a more experienced coach with Betts underneath them, so they aren't quite as committed as many are making out like they are.

 

It soon became apparent that the club were sticking with Betts regardless of what happened, implying that they couldn't afford to get another coach. It also became apparent that the team were starting to improve so most fans calmed towards Betts, myself included. I never said that he couldn't turn it around I just doubted that he was going to based on past experience. Given the choice I would still replace him with a coach like Noble any day of the week.

 

It's bizarre to state as fact that he did a good job at Wigan. The year that Gregory was ill and he took over the team did well, but the season after he was replaced after a really poor set of results with Wigan in 7th out of 12. This team was beaten 75-0 something like 2 weeks after Betts left; he'd have to take some responsibility for that.  

 

So prior to the end of last season his coaching CV included an inconclusive (at best!) record at Wigan; years as a skills coach in Union; a poor record in charge of Widnes in the Championship and a Super League record that was amongst the worst starts ever. I still believe that it wasn't by any means irrational to question whether the coach was good enough. 



#14 jonnyg28

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 05:57 AM

Yep because I can't remember a single set of fans of any other clubs that have wanted their coach out after a bad set of results.


Still fickle whatever you say, it comes mostly from people who have never played or coached.

#15 Brigg Rover

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 09:26 AM

Please to see a club not panic with their coach. Too many clubs fail to give coaches sufficient time. However, I'm no fan of Betts and I'd be surprised if he has a long career as a head coach at the top in rugby league.

I see him as a Karl Harrison type. Decent enough coach, but not cut out for the very top.

Hos close to the "top" is the very top? There are 1000's of RL teams around the world and Denis Betts is coaching a team that is in the top 30 in the World, surely that has to be pretty close to the "very top".

#16 South Wakefield Sharks

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 08:14 PM

Hos close to the "top" is the very top? There are 1000's of RL teams around the world and Denis Betts is coaching a team that is in the top 30 in the World, surely that has to be pretty close to the "very top".

If Tony Smith made himself available to coach another SL club, every club, bar maybe Wigan & Leeds would be very interested in taking him on.

That's what I mean by the "very top".

If Denis Betts left Widnes, I think he'd struggle to persuade any SL club that he was a better choice than what they already had.

I don't see that changing any time soon.

Edited by South Wakefield Sharks, 07 May 2013 - 08:14 PM.


#17 Mumby Magic

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 06:44 AM

100% right. Look at Wolves now (football) Dean Saunders gone after being asked to do the impossible in 3 months, leaving a good post in the process. Giving coaches time is vital, particularly when there is a lack of funds within the game too. How can a coach set up structures etc when he could be shown the door in a small amount of time.

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