Jump to content


RUGBY LEAGUE WORLD MAGAZINE (ISSUE 397 - MAY 2014): Available to download now. Get the app from Apple Newsstand or GooglePlay, or click here to read it online now at Pocketmags.com - Print edition in shops from Friday, or click here to get it delivered by post in the UK or worldwide.

Rugby League World - April 2014
League Express

Podcast

Photo
- - - - -

New League Structures


  • Please log in to reply
83 replies to this topic

#21 a.n Other

a.n Other
  • Coach
  • 1,546 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 05:21 PM

This will just undue the strides that some of these clubs have made in recent years to improve themselves, the top few will be even further from reach as the standard at the bottom end of the table decreases. eventually this will lead to an eight or ten team league. So in a generation we'll have gone from a 14/16 team top division of British clubs to a 8/10 team league with just 6/10 British clubs, and shock horror the French national side will still be awful.

Progress?

Or if Could make the league much more vibrant and interesting which leads to more teams being able to step up and challenge the big 4. May I ask which team you support?

#22 jannerboyuk

jannerboyuk
  • Coach
  • 4,814 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 06:59 PM

Don't forget Coventry are joining the semi pro ranks
PROUD TO BE A MEMBER OF http://www.rugbyleaguecares.org/ and http://www.walesrugb...-wales-for-2013
Predictions for the future -
Crusaders RL to get a franchise for 2012 onwards -WRONG
Widnes Vikings also to get a franchise - RIGHT
Crusaders RL to do the double over Widnes and finish five places ahead of them -WRONG
Widnes Vikings NOT to dominate rugby league in years to come! STILL TO COME

http://www.pitchero.com/clubs/cardiffdemonsrlfc/
http://www.walesrugbyleague.co.uk/

I promise to pay �10 to the charity of Bomb Jacks choice if Widnes Millionaires finish above the battling underdogs Crusaders RL. I OWE A TENNER!
http://www.jaxaxe.co...89/Default.aspx

#23 Larry the Leit

Larry the Leit
  • Coach
  • 2,275 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 07:06 PM

Or if Could make the league much more vibrant and interesting which leads to more teams being able to step up and challenge the big 4. May I ask which team you support?

 

Wakefield Trinity, not that I think that has any bearing on my views.  I've always been a supporter of P&R, before and since superleague, and before and since Wakefield won their way back to the top flight in 1998.



#24 Lobbygobbler

Lobbygobbler
  • Coach
  • 5,691 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 08:52 PM

Wakefield Trinity, not that I think that has any bearing on my views. I've always been a supporter of P&R, before and since superleague, and before and since Wakefield won their way back to the top flight in 1998.


Just so happens that your club has been basking in SL with no threat of relegation and a garbage ground, why clubs like mine are dying with no hope of getting out of NL 1 - despite having a better ground.

I cant wait for us to be back playing and thrashing the likes of Wakey in the new setup. It will really revitalise many current coop clubs. Also I think that crowds at the likes and Wakey might even increase because youll get a new breed of eager away fans - something else that is dying in SL

#25 Rascal Bongo Stork

Rascal Bongo Stork
  • Coach
  • 425 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 09:07 PM

As I understand it the proposed 2 tier SL splitting into 3 x 8 teams IS NOT a closed shop and WOULD have promotion from tier 3. I think the idea is for two tier 3 conferences based on geographical lines - presumably there'd be a Grand Final between the two winners.  I think the whole thing is great but the problem is money - there has to be a realistic opportunity for one of the top 4 in SL2 to be able to take on the bottom 4 in SL1 once the split happens and gain promotion.

I'd be very interested to hear what the other plans are, we only seem to be getting mention of this radical one.


Edited by Rascal Bongo Stork, 09 May 2013 - 09:08 PM.


#26 S72 Cat

S72 Cat
  • Players
  • 28 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 09:13 PM

Just so happens that your club has been basking in SL with no threat of relegation and a garbage ground, why clubs like mine are dying with no hope of getting out of NL 1 - despite having a better ground.
I cant wait for us to be back playing and thrashing the likes of Wakey in the new setup. It will really revitalise many current coop clubs. Also I think that crowds at the likes and Wakey might even increase because youll get a new breed of eager away fans - something else that is dying in SL


Don't think Leigh will be thrashing anyone soon.

Not sure why Wakey are your target.

It's not a ground competition and Wakey aren't relying on away support (you are probably mixing us up with Salford).

#27 Gav Wilson

Gav Wilson
  • Coach
  • 3,264 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 09:16 PM

Just so happens that your club has been basking in SL with no threat of relegation and a garbage ground, why clubs like mine are dying with no hope of getting out of NL 1 - despite having a better ground.

I cant wait for us to be back playing and thrashing the likes of Wakey in the new setup. It will really revitalise many current coop clubs. Also I think that crowds at the likes and Wakey might even increase because youll get a new breed of eager away fans - something else that is dying in SL

 

Lets hope Leigh can actually afford the squad they sign up to thrash Wakey eh... ;)


Posted Image

#28 Ponterover

Ponterover
  • Coach
  • 1,715 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 09:21 PM

Didn't attend myself, but those posting on fb that went to chat to our chairman tonight are portraying it as more or less a done deal

#29 Terry Mullaney

Terry Mullaney
  • Coach
  • 1,911 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:22 PM

Didn't attend myself, but those posting on fb that went to chat to our chairman tonight are portraying it as more or less a done deal


It sounds as though it has found favour with many clubs according to what was said tonight. Great system In my opinion if one or two flaws can be ironed out
Wedding Films For The Discerning by Picture House
Free Showreel DVD On Request

http://www.pictureho...ingfilms.co.uk/

#30 Steve May

Steve May
  • Coach
  • 10,111 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 12:41 AM

If it does come off I think they will be no relegation from SL2 more like a franchise to enter like it is for SL now..

 

Not for the first time I'm moved to think that people in favour of P&R tend to be much more in favour of P than R.


That's me.  I'm done.


#31 winnyason

winnyason
  • Coach
  • 372 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 03:40 AM

So if Toulouse join sl2 what is the difference between this and the championship debacle. They will be semi pro still explain someone?

#32 Ponterover

Ponterover
  • Coach
  • 1,715 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 04:25 AM

So if Toulouse join sl2 what is the difference between this and the championship debacle. They will be semi pro still explain someone?

I think the point is that clubs will be allowed to be pro in the 2nd div, allowing them to build a promotable team.

#33 Forever Trinity

Forever Trinity
  • Coach
  • 628 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 05:56 AM

Logistical nightmare with season tickets and fixture lists, I really hope they have considered the law of unintended consequence when looking at 24 teams in two leagues splitting into 3 after a period of time (11 games) and then will it be a further 7 games or 14 who is going to play at home and who is going to play away games, 11 games gives an imbalance some teams will play more home games than away games and vice versa, yes there could be a magic fixture but who plays home and who plays away against home the rest of the time, I cant visualise fairness at the moment.

The concept on paper looks good but so did the Titanic.

#34 winnyason

winnyason
  • Coach
  • 372 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 06:26 AM

Look it I suppose pleases everyone, facts are it is in fabric of game in uk so this format if funded properly could make bottom table games exciting. Give team in sl2 something on field to aspire to not a criteria off it.

#35 thundergaz

thundergaz
  • Coach
  • 2,638 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 07:55 AM


Not for the first time I'm moved to think that people in favour of P&R tend to be much more in favour of P than R.


You've got me wrong if it was up to me I would have P&R throughout all the leagues. I just thought if the RFL wanted 2 competitive leagues then I doubted whether they would allow relegation from SL2 that's all.I just thought they would have the franchise system in place for P&R to SL2. Just for the simple reason how can a club who is in a partnership with a SL club be aloud to play possibly in the same league.

Edited by thundergaz, 10 May 2013 - 07:59 AM.


#36 Larry the Leit

Larry the Leit
  • Coach
  • 2,275 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 08:02 AM

Just so happens that your club has been basking in SL with no threat of relegation and a garbage ground, why clubs like mine are dying with no hope of getting out of NL 1 - despite having a better ground.

I cant wait for us to be back playing and thrashing the likes of Wakey in the new setup. It will really revitalise many current coop clubs. Also I think that crowds at the likes and Wakey might even increase because youll get a new breed of eager away fans - something else that is dying in SL

 

Have you been to Belle Vue in the last year or so?  The atmosphere has improved dramatically, and the ground is so garbage that it is now attracting 7000-8000 paying fans on a regular basis.  It's staggering to me that it took 140 years to put a roof on the North Terrace, but boy what a difference it's made.  

 

As for protected from relegation, I think that's only really true for some of the time, however Trinity have never finished in a relegation spot since the advent of superleague, and when relegation was in place they fought very hard to legitimately avoid it.  I'd hardly describe Trinity as a club that was protected from relegation, it certainly didn't feel like it at the time.  Huddersfield on the other hand.....


Edited by Larry the Leit, 10 May 2013 - 08:03 AM.


#37 Griff

Griff
  • Coach
  • 7,361 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 09:13 AM

I think the point is that clubs will be allowed to be pro in the 2nd div, allowing them to build a promotable team.

They're allowed to be full time now. Just so happens they can't afford it.

That's the weakness, isn't it ? We're to have a middle division with four teams with (about) £1m a year more funding that the other four. There are two possibilities

1. The four better funded teams occupy the top four positions, which means no change in the starting 12 next season


2. A less well funded team gets itself into debt trying to get into the top four.

Even throwing money at it isn't going to even things up completely. Players are far more likely to sign for a team starting in the top (first phase) division rather than one in the second tier.

"We'll sell you a seat .... but you'll only need the edge of it!"
 


#38 Ponterover

Ponterover
  • Coach
  • 1,715 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 09:21 AM

They're allowed to be full time now. Just so happens they can't afford it.

That's the weakness, isn't it ? We're to have a middle division with four teams with (about) £1m a year more funding that the other four. There are two possibilities

1. The four better funded teams occupy the top four positions, which means no change in the starting 12 next season


2. A less well funded team gets itself into debt trying to get into the top four.

Even throwing money at it isn't going to even things up completely. Players are far more likely to sign for a team starting in the top (first phase) division rather than one in the second tier.

The salary cap prevents KPC teams from being pro, some clubs can afford to be pro, or near pro.

I agree there is a danger of piling up debt from the smaller clubs, clearly this needs to be monitored

#39 Steve May

Steve May
  • Coach
  • 10,111 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 09:48 AM

Just so happens that your club has been basking in SL with no threat of relegation and a garbage ground, why clubs like mine are dying with no hope of getting out of NL 1 - despite having a better ground.

 

What makes you think Leigh have no chance of getting promotion to SL?

 

It seems to me that there are two possible ways for Leigh to get into Superleague.  The first is to decide that's where they are heading and work consistently and damned hard to build a club that can meet the entry criteria and use the three years to continue building until they stabilise.

 

The second is to campaign to have open promotion restored into SL, get lucky enough to go up and then hope to God that they can scrape enough wins together to stay up, and build the club's finances on an overly optimistic forecast of a boom in attendances that in reality will never be big enough.

 

I believe Leigh have already tried the second route.  It didn't go well.


That's me.  I'm done.


#40 Steve May

Steve May
  • Coach
  • 10,111 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 09:53 AM

As for protected from relegation, I think that's only really true for some of the time, however Trinity have never finished in a relegation spot since the advent of superleague, and when relegation was in place they fought very hard to legitimately avoid it. 

 

Wakefield spent a long time battling against relegation.  It seemed to be the only success criteria that the club had - quite understandably.

 

The effect of the change of ownership cannot be underestimated, but it surely helps the club that they have had a sustained period where they have been able to work on a longer term basis without the fear of financial oblivion.

 

It just seems to me that the vagaries of the business world are unpredictable enough on their own, particularly in these difficult times.  We shouldn't be adding an ever present threat of catastrophe into the mix when we don't need to.


That's me.  I'm done.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users