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#421 The Parksider

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Posted 05 June 2013 - 11:58 PM

Are you sure that, pound for pound, London produces many more pro playes than Leigh.

The odd Leigh born lad is in the first teams of SL clubs and there are several London lads.

The professional conveyor belt in London is reported as growing.

Viking Warrior who is a amateur coach reported Leigh East and Miners are struggling for kids.

Make of that what you will I don't care. Maybe you will extrapolate from that that Leigh should have a SL franchise now and London should be banned from playing RL.

#422 The Parksider

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 12:11 AM

Hardly the kind of evidence to convince many.  Lewis, finger on the pulse, really?  His guess is no better than yours.

He ran the game he had the kind of insights to the game I'd die for. To make that statement Larry flies in the face of reality. Lewis had access to all the facts and finances and opinions of the top sports people in general and including all the chairmen of the game itself, SKY and major sponsors.

You have to ask yourself where would this game have gone if say Branson had bankrolled London fully through to today, If the people in Paris who could have made a go of it had decided to do so, and if South Wales investors had got on board with Crusaders.

I'll tell you where, onwards and upwards with new fans in their tens of thousands and new streams of top players and the chance to revive international RL in the northern hemisphere and attract new sponsors.

To hear people on here rail against France, Wales and London and say how Sheffield, leigh and Halifax are "well run" "profitable" and will make great additions to Superleague when in reality they were all "basket cases x 10" is beyond belief.

Maybe RL's worst enemy is some of it's own supporters?

Edited by The Parksider, 06 June 2013 - 12:13 AM.


#423 keighley

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 03:23 AM

The Closes virtually bankrupted themselves to keep the club going, they are heroes for what they did and the commitment they gave. 

 

The idea that London in the championship is good for the club is farcical. That idea won't be popular with some on here that think that all clubs in Lancashire or Yorkshire should get priority over any 1980s out of town upstarts. I would give a London owner free reign to do as he pleases cap wise or other wise. I would also provide a direct subsidy above the usual SL cut.

 

I will be able to hear the howls of mprotest emanating from Wigan in the farthest corners of the earth if you did any such thing. The track record so far suggests that even if you did, London would still struggle remember Branson and Marantra. How did those investor supports work out in making London the success you think it will become if once again they get more funding.t



#424 keighley

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 03:29 AM

Got the viewing figures for comparison?

 

One game a season only? I think not. 

 

London's games are also broadcast on the radio by the way.

 

 l

It used to be a double header with the st div/SL final so the viewing figures would have been quite decent. How many of London s home games do Sky show. If it s more than one or two I ll be amazed and theyt are always on a Saturday with the lowesr viewing figures of the Sky coverage.



#425 thirteenthman

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 07:41 AM

I was around when they made Old Trafford and it was after the Closes had relinquished control. That season the RFL had been running the Crusaders until around Easter time when Brisbane Broncos bought the club. And I remember the game well, one sunday afternoon as a curtain raiser. It still didn't do anything for the club or its profile. Nor did the Brisbane ownership. The club finally started to gain some attention when SL was announced and London were allotted a place. 

 

Go back to the second tier and the club will completely disappear from the public eye. 

 

Found this article from just prior to that Old Trafford final:-

 

http://www.independe...al-1437378.html

 

Interesting to read the quotes about talk of the Broncos 'investing heavily in top British players', something the club has always struggled to do, and the 'fanciful' talk of playing at Wembley within 5 years. But the article does confirm that the club were as close as they ever got to going out of business.



#426 thirteenthman

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 07:44 AM

 l

It used to be a double header with the st div/SL final so the viewing figures would have been quite decent. How many of London s home games do Sky show. If it s more than one or two I ll be amazed and theyt are always on a Saturday with the lowesr viewing figures of the Sky coverage.

 

The viewing figures would probably have been very low. 2nd tier games on Sky always used to get much smaller audiences, and at the time of the 1994 final, Sky's subscriber base was well over half what it is now, so audiences all round would have been a lot smaller.



#427 Padge

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 08:25 AM

 l

It used to be a double header with the st div/SL final so the viewing figures would have been quite decent. How many of London s home games do Sky show. If it s more than one or two I ll be amazed and theyt are always on a Saturday with the lowesr viewing figures of the Sky coverage.

You really think the same number watched game 1 as game 2. Your becoming a serial fantasist.

 

I see your back tracking on the second point rather quickly.



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#428 nadera78

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 08:42 AM

Found this article from just prior to that Old Trafford final:-

 

http://www.independe...al-1437378.html

 

Interesting to read the quotes about talk of the Broncos 'investing heavily in top British players', something the club has always struggled to do, and the 'fanciful' talk of playing at Wembley within 5 years. But the article does confirm that the club were as close as they ever got to going out of business.

Brisbane talked a good game but they had no idea what sort of challenges they wold face in London. When I say the game was invisible, I genuinely mean it. It was impossible to find out anything about the club. I've lived here all my life and I was watching RL on BSB and then Sky for around two years before I found out there was a team in London, and even then I only discovered them because one of my teachers was playing for them on an amateur basis.

 

I'm absolutely certain in my mind that if the club drops down into the second tier again then they will suffer the same fate. There's so much going on in London, and there are so many sports/events ingrained into the culture that for anything 'new' or 'different' to stand out it simply has to be conducted at the top level. Anything else will simply be ignored by the media, and if they decide to dismiss you like that then how will anyone know you exist? A club in the second tier that can barely afford to run a team is going to spend significantly on publicity? Of course not. Out of sight, out of mind.


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#429 thirteenthman

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 11:19 AM

Brisbane talked a good game but they had no idea what sort of challenges they wold face in London. When I say the game was invisible, I genuinely mean it. It was impossible to find out anything about the club. I've lived here all my life and I was watching RL on BSB and then Sky for around two years before I found out there was a team in London, and even then I only discovered them because one of my teachers was playing for them on an amateur basis.

 

I'm absolutely certain in my mind that if the club drops down into the second tier again then they will suffer the same fate. There's so much going on in London, and there are so many sports/events ingrained into the culture that for anything 'new' or 'different' to stand out it simply has to be conducted at the top level. Anything else will simply be ignored by the media, and if they decide to dismiss you like that then how will anyone know you exist? A club in the second tier that can barely afford to run a team is going to spend significantly on publicity? Of course not. Out of sight, out of mind.

 

Yeah, I think the Brisbane directors would probably admit that they completely underestimated the size of the task in London. Seem to recall reading somewhere that that they simply wanted to run a club here as a way of producing players for the team in Brisbane. There was a touch of arrogance in the direction they were taking around that time, which of course ultimately led to the whole SL war down under.

 

Completely agree with your comments on London dropping out of the top tier. I guess we'll find out soon enough how much importance the game as a whole puts on having a top tier presence in the capital.



#430 DeadShotKeen

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 11:47 AM

is that the same glass ceiling hull kr have hit?

Yes and why I've bailed on Hull KR.

If Super League just wants to shuffle around teams with glass ceilings then it is writing its own suicide note.

#431 keighley

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 02:34 PM

Brisbane talked a good game but they had no idea what sort of challenges they wold face in London. When I say the game was invisible, I genuinely mean it. It was impossible to find out anything about the club. I've lived here all my life and I was watching RL on BSB and then Sky for around two years before I found out there was a team in London, and even then I only discovered them because one of my teachers was playing for them on an amateur basis.

 

I'm absolutely certain in my mind that if the club drops down into the second tier again then they will suffer the same fate. There's so much going on in London, and there are so many sports/events ingrained into the culture that for anything 'new' or 'different' to stand out it simply has to be conducted at the top level. Anything else will simply be ignored by the media, and if they decide to dismiss you like that then how will anyone know you exist? A club in the second tier that can barely afford to run a team is going to spend significantly on publicity? Of course not. Out of sight, out of mind.

 

Well, the remedy is for them not to get relegated then. However, looking at their current stellar SL incarnation, I don't think they are more than a blip on the radar of sport in London now and are ignored by the media. They will get more press if they fold or are relegated than they curently do holding down a perrenial bottom four spot in SL.

 

For instance, havn't Hemel had some decent media coverage stemming from their elevation to CC1 whereas the Broncos have had what national coverage from their SL season.



#432 The Parksider

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 02:35 PM

For instance, havn't Hemel had some decent media coverage stemming from their elevation to CC1 whereas the Broncos have had what national coverage from their SL season.

Yes Hemel are the future of Rugby League in the south east.

#433 keighley

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 02:36 PM

You really think the same number watched game 1 as game 2. Your becoming a serial fantasist.

 

I see your back tracking on the second point rather quickly.

 

 No, i never said that. However they got national exposure and i'll bet more watched them that day than watched their last televised home SL game.



#434 keighley

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 02:39 PM

Found this article from just prior to that Old Trafford final:-

 

http://www.independe...al-1437378.html

 

Interesting to read the quotes about talk of the Broncos 'investing heavily in top British players', something the club has always struggled to do, and the 'fanciful' talk of playing at Wembley within 5 years. But the article does confirm that the club were as close as they ever got to going out of business.

 

 Interesting. I'll bet they have never had this kind of press coverage for this  season's SL games.



#435 Larry the Leit

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 02:41 PM

For instance, havn't Hemel had some decent media coverage stemming from their elevation to CC1 whereas the Broncos have had what national coverage from their SL season.

 

It's not translated into gates as yet though, and that's their real challenge over the next five years.  I'm not sure what targets they've set themselves, but if they can get to regularly around 500 in the next couple of years then it'll be very encouraging.


Edited by Larry the Leit, 06 June 2013 - 02:42 PM.


#436 keighley

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 02:47 PM

Yes Hemel are the future of Rugby League in the south east.

 

You just have a vituperative hatred for ambitious underdogs. Any hint of ambtion or progress from a small team sets you off like a rabid dog.

 

Long term, if Hemel continue to upgrade their ground (at least they have one viz a viz the Broncos who shortly will not ) and if they continue to churn out players from their local area and if they get into the Championship via p and r then they will be at the same level as the Broncos when they get relegated.

 

Let the chips fall and we will see which direction each of these teams takes. Your sarcastic last sentence might come back to haunt you 15 years from now.



#437 The Parksider

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 02:53 PM

Long term, if Hemel.....

and if they continue to churn out players.....

and if they get into the Championship....

Two more if's and you have the SL champions.

#438 keighley

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 03:07 PM

It's not translated into gates as yet though, and that's their real challenge over the next five years.  I'm not sure what targets they've set themselves, but if they can get to regularly around 500 in the next couple of years then it'll be very encouraging.

 

 Oh, i agree with you they are at the very start of their odyssey as a pro/semi pro RL club. I don't know the scope of their ambitions either, but the fact that they are here at all is a positive for the game. There ceratinly seems to be a more positive vibe coming from this club than from the Broncos.



#439 keighley

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 03:14 PM

Two more if's and you have the SL champions.

 

 here's some more the.

 

If Broncos get relegated ( than should probably be a "when")

 

If Hughes's financial support disappears for whatever reason and there are a couple of scenarios

 

If they don't improve their crowds

 

A couple more and they will be in CC1 playing Gloucester for the wooden spoon.



#440 thirteenthman

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 03:52 PM

For instance, havn't Hemel had some decent media coverage stemming from their elevation to CC1 whereas the Broncos have had what national coverage from their SL season.

 

That depends on what you call 'decent media coverage'. Is that coverage in national papers, or as I strongly suspect, is it limited to RL trade publications and local media in Hemel? And wouldn't a SL team in Hemel generate even more coverage?






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