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Bring Back GB / Ashes Tests etc (Merged Threads)


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#21 Cardiff Cymru

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 09:37 PM

I'm aware that GB and the UK aren't quite the same but this constitutional nicety doesn't translate into sport. The UK olympics team competes as GB but is still the UK's team.

 

The ECB's team is called England (and long may it stay that way - if the Welsh don't like it they can get their own team) but players from Scotland and Ireland have played for them.

 

No need to worry about the niceties - players from NI will play for a GB side with no complaints about the technicalities - players from the republic will do so as individuals a la Brian Carney. Adding "and Ireland" to the team name doesn't make it into a genuinely Irish side.

 

Slight diversion but here in Wales a lot of us want to see our own 20-20 international side at very least. But I've been told by Glamorgan that any attempt to form a separate Wales side at any level would mean no more Ashes tests for Cardiff. So it's money over pride. I disagree as I think we should keep England for tests and have separate nations for limited over matches.


About time I updated this.

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#22 Northern Sol

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 12:03 AM

Slight diversion but here in Wales a lot of us want to see our own 20-20 international side at very least. But I've been told by Glamorgan that any attempt to form a separate Wales side at any level would mean no more Ashes tests for Cardiff. So it's money over pride. I disagree as I think we should keep England for tests and have separate nations for limited over matches.

I agree. Wales should have their own T20 side as a minimum.



#23 Methven Hornet

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 04:25 AM

How is it possible to get beaten by 160 points? ?? Fair play to them I remember when SSG wear getting a lot of 80 - 110 points beatings. Glad to see they have spirit.

 

I did wonder that!


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#24 HappyDave

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 06:57 PM

I did wonder that!

 

In 2010 Swindon St George traveled to Elmbridge Eagles with 11 guys most of who were either between 16 - 18 most of whom had never played Rugby League before and a few of the older heads had very little experience too and where beaten around 100 - 0, as Elmbridge were a very well drilled squad played their full 13 players (20 inc. rolling subs?) against us in late-20' heat with no/very little breeze, as they were in the looking to make the play-offs a couple of weeks after so needed to try out their set moves.  However it shows character when teams don't give up.

 

How would the RFL get Scottish players up to SL/Championships standard?  Could a SL team team up with an area of Scotland like Leeds have done with the West of England?


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#25 Methven Hornet

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 08:51 PM

In 2010 Swindon St George traveled to Elmbridge Eagles with 11 guys most of who were either between 16 - 18 most of whom had never played Rugby League before and a few of the older heads had very little experience too and where beaten around 100 - 0, as Elmbridge were a very well drilled squad played their full 13 players (20 inc. rolling subs?) against us in late-20' heat with no/very little breeze, as they were in the looking to make the play-offs a couple of weeks after so needed to try out their set moves.  However it shows character when teams don't give up.

 

How would the RFL get Scottish players up to SL/Championships standard?  Could a SL team team up with an area of Scotland like Leeds have done with the West of England?

 

It's difficult, isn't it? You're taking kids, many of whom have not had any exposure to rugby of any sort, and coaching them with limited resources and expertise, and you're trying to get them to a comparable standard to those who have grown up in areas steeped in the game. I suppose the idea is, to put it simply, to introduce as many kids as possible to the game, identify those who have the raw talent, and give them intense coaching (and hope they stick with it!). But, and there is no escaping this fact, you have got to provide the appropriate playing opportunities for the standard you are aiming at. And that is always the problem in new areas.

To give the them credit, the RFL have started to address this problem with the new expansion clubs at Championship One level, but Scotland has the isolation problem. I can't think of any other sport where someone at that standard would have to travel hundreds of miles every other week to play part time sport. And young kids leaving home to go to a strange town to play at that standard brings its own problems.

Super League 'twinning' probably has its uses but I fear that there is no real alternative, at this stage, to doing the necessary hard work of building up the game's infrastructure in Scotland: introducing and strengthening clubs, schools, representative sides and coaching structures. There's over 100 years of neglect to catch up on.


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#26 HappyDave

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 11:26 PM

Yeah, excellent post well said but there must be some way to get some Scottish players in the SL/NRL in the next 20 years?

Are there any Aussies players with a 'Mc' in their surname? ;)

Edited by HappyDave, 12 June 2013 - 11:29 PM.

"I've never seen a woman with hairy ears... And I've been to St Helens" - John Bishop

#27 Methven Hornet

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 09:11 AM

Yeah, excellent post well said but there must be some way to get some Scottish players in the SL/NRL in the next 20 years?

Are there any Aussies players with a 'Mc' in their surname? ;)

 

Plenty! And Kiwis!

 


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#28 HappyDave

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 01:52 PM

Well,.if they have 'Mc' (or is it 'Mac'?) in their surname then they're Scottish. ;)
"I've never seen a woman with hairy ears... And I've been to St Helens" - John Bishop

#29 bobbruce

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 04:45 PM

Yeah, excellent post well said but there must be some way to get some Scottish players in the SL/NRL in the next 20 years?

Are there any Aussies players with a 'Mc' in their surname? ;)


McManus is Scottish I think moved over as a young kid

#30 Methven Hornet

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 05:29 PM

Well,.if they have 'Mc' (or is it 'Mac'?) in their surname then they're Scottish. ;)

 

We could go the whole hog and include anyone whose surname appears in this, the recognised reference book on Scottish surnames:-

51-0fASNiML._SL500_AA300_.jpg

 

:biggrin:


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#31 joe elliot

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 05:42 PM

It's fairly simple to get players up to standard very quickly, both countries already play at school level.
The difference at 16 years of age isn't massive between England and Wales especially, the only difference is that every single English lad is snapped up by a Super League club if they already aren't. If every player in the Welsh and Scottish teams was given the same treatment then it would take the same time as it would for players to develop.
waddell

#32 HappyDave

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 04:41 PM

We could go the whole hog and include anyone whose surname appears in this, the recognised reference book on Scottish surnames:-

51-0fASNiML._SL500_AA300_.jpg

:biggrin:


Good point. :D
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#33 ParraEelsNRL

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 05:52 PM

From the heartlands, how many hours bus trip would it take to get to say somewhere in Scotland where RL has a club in a decent sized city?

 

I know the distances in Aus are way different and we use that excuse all the time, but the UK would make up for that in terms of mass population and being a complete pain in the bum to drive around, so it sort of works out the same to a degree. So I guess my question really is, how hard would it be to actually put a scottish or even Irish team into Champ 1 and what type of finances would it take?



#34 HappyDave

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 09:08 PM

From the heartlands, how many hours bus trip would it take to get to say somewhere in Scotland where RL has a club in a decent sized city?

I know the distances in Aus are way different and we use that excuse all the time, but the UK would make up for that in terms of mass population and being a complete pain in the bum to drive around, so it sort of works out the same to a degree. So I guess my question really is, how hard would it be to actually put a scottish or even Irish team into Champ 1 and what type of finances would it take?


It would be like the NZ Warriors or Catalans Dragons with all the plane flights too and from Scotland, so not really a viable option and 'heatland' fans would winge if there was a Scottish team in the Championships.
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#35 Ponterover

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 09:22 PM

It would be like the NZ Warriors or Catalans Dragons with all the plane flights too and from Scotland, so not really a viable option and 'heatland' fans would winge if there was a Scottish team in the Championships.

 

Plane flights to Scotland?

 

Maybe if the team was in Aberdeen, but Edinburgh is only 3 and bit hours up the A1, less travelling time than the Cumbrian clubs.

 

As a "heartland" fan, I'd welcome clubs from anywhere than can generate enough interest to warrant one, be it John O'Groats or The Scilly Isles.



#36 RugbyLeagueGeek

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 10:37 PM

Plane flights to Scotland?
 
Maybe if the team was in Aberdeen, but Edinburgh is only 3 and bit hours up the A1, less travelling time than the Cumbrian clubs.

Only for Oldham and Rochdale. For the majority of clubs in C1 it's closer to 6 hours.

#37 ParraEelsNRL

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 05:52 AM

Hmmm, fair distance for some by the looks of it, so that's a no then unless someone with deep pockets comes in and more or less makes them a semi pro/pro side off the bat. Can't see too many young fellas with families and full time jobs wanting to be away on a bus for 6 hours each way once a fortnight or month.

 

Maybe the RFL could help out any new teams with some sort of fund that eases the pressure a bit (extra traveling expenses/ accommodation/higher cap/whatever to get them going.? I don't know how fans of other clubs would react, well some I do, but I would love to see a centrally funded club in Scotland, Wales, maybe Ireland and defo London.

 

They would certainly pay for themselves in the long run with TV rights alone if the clubs were run right.



#38 TheBinman

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Posted 16 June 2013 - 02:45 PM

With the changes to the structures of our leagues and potentially a few new sides coming into the semi pro game Coventry bears been 1 hopefully we'll get to see another South Wales club love to see another London club Medway?, possibly Nottingham outlaws? But going forward would live to see the rfl work towards getting a Scottish club in the championship certainly think there's potential for small success at that level thoughts?

#39 HappyDave

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Posted 16 June 2013 - 05:45 PM

Who knows, maybe in 20 - 30 years time there could be a 6 team semi-pro 'Celtic Leagues' like the RaboDirect Pro 12 in Rugby Union but on the level of Championship 1?
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#40 TheBinman

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Posted 16 June 2013 - 05:52 PM

As a game we've certainly got to encourage devolpment and growth in expansion areas such as the midlands ect and getting as many sustainable semi pro clubs as possible to allow a genuine pathway for players to aim for and on the back of that you'll hav super league clubs looking for potential stars.




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