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the death penalty


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#201 Griff9of13

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 12:04 PM

Perhaps more emphasis on helping defenceless childrenin the first place instead of the perpetrators rights may be a start?

I am waiting for the line about 'lessons being learned' or something.

 

Trojan's point still stands; do you think that having the death penalty would have prevented this vile act of cruelty in the first place? I somehow doubt that if someone can think it is ok to do those things to their own child without natural inbuilt morals and sense of right and wrong preventing them that the consideration of the punishment they would receive ever enters their head.


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#202 Johnoco

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 01:10 PM

Trojan's point still stands; do you think that having the death penalty would have prevented this vile act of cruelty in the first place? I somehow doubt that if someone can think it is ok to do those things to their own child without natural inbuilt morals and sense of right and wrong preventing them that the consideration of the punishment they would receive ever enters their head.

Of course it would probably have not stopped this but.......who is to say that if the attacker knew they would be killed for doing it, they may not have regarded the child's life so cheaply? Not saying it would but many evil scumbags already know their punishment will consist of 3 meals a day, sky tv and no bills thus don't give a sh it.
Sorry bud, it just isn't fair.

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#203 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 01:38 PM

Of course it would probably have not stopped this but.......who is to say that if the attacker knew they would be killed for doing it, they may not have regarded the child's life so cheaply? Not saying it would but many evil scumbags already know their punishment will consist of 3 meals a day, sky tv and no bills thus don't give a sh it.
Sorry bud, it just isn't fair.

It isn't fair

But if you are talking about whether the death penalty would have deterred such people I would say no it wouldn't
If you are twisted and depraved enough to behave in this way then the death penalty isn't even on your radar
There are other reasons to have the death penalty which I'm sure you are aware of and which you know I also dusagree with, but deterrence isn't one of them
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#204 Phil

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 02:57 PM

if only someone had been there to defend that 2 year old in the way that some posters on here defend and cry for the rights of the perpetrators in these cases that happen all too frequently these days, no sorry -I could blast them away like rancid rats on a farm and think nowt of it, the suffering that poor toddler must have gone through should be paid for in real terms and not be another burden on the honest taxpayer

 

 

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#205 bedlam breakout

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 03:51 PM

how much is the "ian bradey circus" costing us this week? not to mention fueling his almost celebrity like infamous status which is what he will be thriving on


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#206 Johnoco

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 05:08 PM

It isn't fair

But if you are talking about whether the death penalty would have deterred such people I would say no it wouldn't
If you are twisted and depraved enough to behave in this way then the death penalty isn't even on your radar
There are other reasons to have the death penalty which I'm sure you are aware of and which you know I also dusagree with, but deterrence isn't one of them

We don't know if the death penalty would have deterred this piece of garbage but from doing what she did. ...but that's the point - we don't know.
I also hear the 'she could have been stopped earlier' routine. I wonder why she wasn't? Willing to bet it was because her rights may have been infringed in some way, thus raising the possibility of her suing the authorities. Its sick

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#207 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 05:29 PM

We don't know if the death penalty would have deterred this piece of garbage but from doing what she did. ...but that's the point - we don't know.
I also hear the 'she could have been stopped earlier' routine. I wonder why she wasn't? Willing to bet it was because her rights may have been infringed in some way, thus raising the possibility of her suing the authorities. Its sick

Well we do know that equally horrific and worse crimes were committed when we had capital punishment

We also know that there are people particularly people who kill will do so whatever the punishment

Think of the type of person who would commit a crime like this: do you think they are rational? Considering the consequences of your actions is a rational act people who are the type or person or in the state of mind to kill someone are by definition irrational either temporarily or because of their personality
Take Shipman Fred West and the Ripper for example. Their personalities were/are so disordered that nothing was going to stop the
Same with this person she is so depraved and evil that rational behaviour is or wasnt an option.
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#208 bedlam breakout

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 05:55 PM

just seen the news and bradey is reveling  in it, loving every minute of his ill gotten fame, one of his victims brothers said he looks very fit and healthy for 70odd!


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#209 Johnoco

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 06:29 PM

Of course you will always have physcos like West and Shipman. You will always get burglary but it doesn't mean we say' 'what's the point we won't stop it so legalise it'
Not the best analogy perhaps but the point is the same

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#210 Severus

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 07:00 PM

Of course you will always have physcos like West and Shipman. You will always get burglary but it doesn't mean we say' 'what's the point we won't stop it so legalise it'
Not the best analogy perhaps but the point is the same

I don't see your point. No one is saying that we should legalise murder.
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#211 Johnoco

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 07:09 PM

I don't see your point. No one is saying that we should legalise murder.

The point is often made that the death penalty doesn't stop murder. But who is to say it hasn't increased since abolition? Moreover, are cases like today's becoming more common?

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#212 Severus

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 07:12 PM

The point is often made that the death penalty doesn't stop murder. But who is to say it hasn't increased since abolition? Moreover, are cases like today's becoming more common?


I haven't done the stats but there was a report recently (in the last year) that showed violent crimes are at an all time low. You say cases like what we are discussing are more common, is this true or are they just reported in the media more often. The media, especially the right wing press, seem to specialise in making people frightened.
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#213 bedlam breakout

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 07:18 PM

I haven't done the stats but there was a report recently (in the last year) that showed violent crimes are at an all time low. You say cases like what we are discussing are more common, is this true or are they just reported in the media more often. The media, especially the right wing press, seem to specialise in making people frightened.

that will be per percentage of the population no doubt- guess what? the population is much bigger now, another pointless flawed waste of time study.


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#214 Griff9of13

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 07:47 PM

no thank YOU for the update and the people with your views who literary let him "get away with murder" and do this.


Get away with murder? Who's he killed since he was tried and locked away?
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#215 bedlam breakout

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 08:02 PM

Get away with murder? Who's he killed since he was tried and locked away?

keith bennets mother !!!!!!!!!!!!!! END OF THREAD!


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#216 Severus

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 10:01 PM

that will be per percentage of the population no doubt- guess what? the population is much bigger now, another pointless flawed waste of time study.


Erm, I'm guessing maths isn't your strong point.
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#217 Shadow

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 10:16 PM

Erm, I'm guessing maths isn't your strong point.

I'm guessing lots of things aren't his strong point 


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#218 Trojan

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 07:15 AM

I was listening the the Brady reports yesterday.  He says he wants to die. Perhaps given that he should be made to live!

Another thought hit me, although the bodies were discovered in 1965, weren't the crimes committed in 1963/64?  In other words before the death penalty was removed.  If so capital punishment certainly didn't act as a deterrent to Brady and Hindley.


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#219 Johnoco

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 07:22 AM

I was listening the the Brady reports yesterday. He says he wants to die. Perhaps given that he should be made to live!
Another thought hit me, although the bodies were discovered in 1965, weren't the crimes committed in 1963/64? In other words before the death penalty was removed. If so capital punishment certainly didn't act as a deterrent to Brady and Hindley.

Its never going to act as a deterrent to people like that. The question is does it lower the murder rate overall? I don't know, that's why I'm asking.
The dismissal that 'it doesn't deter A B or C from commiting crime' can be applied to any crime.

ie the threat of prison doesn't deter burglary, so why not decriminalise it?

No I don't care if you're if you're into different bands

No cause for so much hatred, I'm just a different man

Pull off that cover, I will too, and learn to understand

With music deep inside we'll make world unity our plan

 

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#220 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 07:40 AM

Of course you will always have physcos like West and Shipman. You will always get burglary but it doesn't mean we say' 'what's the point we won't stop it so legalise it'
Not the best analogy perhaps but the point is the same

burglary is illegal, a large proportion of the prison population are burglars


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