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RFL Leadership


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#121 The Parksider

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 11:06 AM

 

Moran at Warrington often discussed his dismay at some of the crowds we get. Maybe he just doesn't believe in the product enough!

 

Davey continues to baulk at the crowds the hi flying Fartowners get.

 

But by what measure?

 

Crowd growth in the top half of SL is 50% during it's 17 years of existence.

 

The crowds are good by the best measure i.e. Rugby Union.

 

If they are disappointed with the crowds it may be they aren't realists, or alternatively they don't like making up the extra money to sustain their full professional operations.


Edited by The Parksider, 24 June 2013 - 11:06 AM.


#122 John Drake

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 11:21 AM

can I just say that I feel it was wrong to merge these threads, they have little in common

 

one was about what people desired from the sports' leadership

 

now its about bagging the current leadership

 

The seperate threads may have started with different intentions, but the last few posts of the first thread were pretty similar in tone to the opening few posts of the second. That's why I merged them. Whether that was the right call is a matter of opinion, I accept.

 

I'll reword the title of the merged thread.

 

Feel free to post something that you feel will drag it back into a more positive direction.


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#123 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 11:24 AM

The seperate threads may have started with different intentions, but the last few posts of the first thread were pretty similar in tone to the opening few posts of the second. That's why I merged them. Whether that was the right call is a matter of opinion, I accept.

 

I'll reword the title of the merged thread.

 

Feel free to post something that you feel will drag it back into a more positive direction.

no worries john i didn't have the a rse on or owt


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#124 GeordieSaint

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 12:28 PM

Yes, the playing numbers are almost half of what they were last year. Stands for itself really. Of course it's not up to me, it's up to everyone. If I try and fail because I'm a one man nut job fair enough, I'll go crawl under rock and never come out. But if I'm right and the game is genuinely going backwards why not stand up / say so and try to do something.

 

I'd like to mention that similar issues are being seen elsewhere in the regions. Clubs are struggling for numbers in various areas and more importantly in my opinion, RL in some schools has completed stopped due to no development officers and in some cases, the local RU professional club have taken over the banton. Read some of the threads on the NCL and Community Boards and read about the damage being caused to the junior and youth games. It is shocking!


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#125 ckn

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 12:41 PM

I'd like to mention that similar issues are being seen elsewhere in the regions. Clubs are struggling for numbers in various areas and more importantly in my opinion, RL in some schools has completed stopped due to no development officers and in some cases, the local RU professional club have taken over the banton. Read some of the threads on the NCL and Community Boards and read about the damage being caused to the junior and youth games. It is shocking!

The strange thing is that the RFL committed to Sport England that 3 of their 4 promised participation specific approaches would include working on retention at Conference and Regional league levels as well as increasing HE/FE school participation.  (Link, click on the Rugby League document to get to their promises)  These are supposed to be the promises the RFL makes to Sport England about how they'll use the money granted.  They received £11,000,000 for participation based on those promises for the period 2013-2017 but then we lose development officers.  It just makes no sense at all and is surely something that can be rolled up and used to beat the management committee that decided that we don't need development officers.  If that money can't be at least partially earmarked for development officers then I'd really like to see where it has been allocated, if it has gone to the top 3 leagues of the game then that's a bit of a disgrace.


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#126 terrywebbisgod

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 12:45 PM

The strange thing is that the RFL committed to Sport England that 3 of their 4 promised participation specific approaches would include working on retention at Conference and Regional league levels as well as increasing HE/FE school participation.  (Link, click on the Rugby League document to get to their promises)  These are supposed to be the promises the RFL makes to Sport England about how they'll use the money granted.  They received £11,000,000 for participation based on those promises for the period 2013-2017 but then we lose development officers.  It just makes no sense at all and is surely something that can be rolled up and used to beat the management committee that decided that we don't need development officers.  If that money can't be at least partially earmarked for development officers then I'd really like to see where it has been allocated, if it has gone to the top 3 leagues of the game then that's a bit of a disgrace.

For whatever reason,the RFL lost a percentage of the Sport England funding and the RFL decided to do away with development officers.Some clubs,such as Leeds set up their own foundations to keep some officers in employment and try and continue the work that was being done.


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#127 ckn

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 12:47 PM

For whatever reason,the RFL lost a percentage of the Sport England funding and the RFL decided to do away with development officers.Some clubs,such as Leeds set up their own foundations to keep some officers in employment and try and continue the work that was being done.

I do understand that but the RFL knew they were losing that money but still committed to increase participation through local retention throughout England.  Almost impossible to do that, especially at school level, without development officers.  For me, it's shameful.


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#128 Just to be clear

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 12:48 PM

The Rugby League World Cup appears to be run by the  Rugby League International Federation Ltd


Just to be clear, the RFL bid for, and were awarded by the RLIF, the rights to host the 2013 tournament.

The organisation and running of the world cup is the responsibility of the RFL. If it goes wrong then the RLIF are only accountable for having awarded them a license when they clearly had no business plan, or something like that.

#129 terrywebbisgod

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 12:51 PM

I do understand that but the RFL knew they were losing that money but still committed to increase participation through local retention throughout England.  Almost impossible to do that, especially at school level, without development officers.  For me, it's shameful.

It was very shortsighted of the RFL.


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#130 GeordieSaint

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 12:54 PM

I do understand that but the RFL knew they were losing that money but still committed to increase participation through local retention throughout England.  Almost impossible to do that, especially at school level, without development officers.  For me, it's shameful.

 

I don't see a single mention of schools, junior or youth rugby in that attachment. How do they expect to get people through the Elite Performance Pathway for sod all kids coming through junior and yhouth rugby? I honestly despair. With the current policy, participation levels will drop further and lead to further Sport England cuts as there is no way they are going to hit targets without the Development Officers.There is no way that Touch Rugby will create enough interest to alleviate the drop in full contact playing numbers, which I fear is what the RFL are hoping for.


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#131 Ackroman

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 12:58 PM

Participation is everything. If you want to throw away investment in developing the game you don't deserve to be in charge. This has to be the key performance indicator for the game of RL.



#132 tim2

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 12:59 PM

I don't see a single mention of schools, junior or youth rugby in that attachment. How do they expect to get people through the Elite Performance Pathway for sod all kids coming through junior and yhouth rugby? I honestly despair. With the current policy, participation levels will drop further and lead to further Sport England cuts as there is no way they are going to hit targets without the Development Officers.There is no way that Touch Rugby will create enough interest to alleviate the drop in full contact playing numbers, which I fear is what the RFL are hoping for.


Sport England places restrictions on what NGBs are allowed to bid for. It depends what latest muddled thinking some idiot in Whitehall/Westminster has decided. For example, Primary RL, which you would think would be a priority, can have no funding allocated from the SE pot. So, the RFL must fund that itself, and we all know that there is very little money being generated within the game right now that isn't being used to prop up the pro game.
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#133 GeordieSaint

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 01:02 PM

Sport England places restrictions on what NGBs are allowed to bid for. It depends what latest muddled thinking some idiot in Whitehall/Westminster has decided. For example, Primary RL, which you would think would be a priority, can have no funding allocated from the SE pot. So, the RFL must fund that itself, and we all know that there is very little money being generated within the game right now that isn't being used to prop up the pro game.

 

Surely Development Officers can get involved in SE rugby? There are clubs down here who are struggling for numbers in their junior teams as there is no SE engagement. The consequence of that will affect playing numbers at tier 3 and 4 levels. The RFL have got themselves into a vicious circle...

 

NB. Sorry - I mis-interpreted the meaning of SE; initially thought it meant Secondary Education. Bloody acronyms! :D


Edited by GeordieSaint, 24 June 2013 - 01:34 PM.

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#134 ckn

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 01:09 PM

Surely Development Officers can get involved in SE rugby? There are clubs down here who are struggling for numbers in their junior teams as there is no SE engagement. The consequence of that will affect playing numbers at tier 3 and 4 levels. The RFL have got themselves into a vicious circle...

I'm convinced that there are plenty of people in the RFL who believe that there's nothing outside of the national leagues.  I'm also convinced there are plenty who would shrug their shoulders if RL died entirely in some regions justifying it as too expensive to fight for.


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#135 amh

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 01:15 PM

Kids being involved and either playing or spectating at least is crucial, not just for the good of RL but the good of their future health. 

http://wales.gov.uk/...review/?lang=en


Edited by amh, 24 June 2013 - 01:16 PM.

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#136 GeordieSaint

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 01:17 PM

I'm convinced that there are plenty of people in the RFL who believe that there's nothing outside of the national leagues.  I'm also convinced there are plenty who would shrug their shoulders if RL died entirely in some regions justifying it as too expensive to fight for.

 

Me too and there are plenty of supporters who think the same as well. I have been involved for a number of years playing the game at clubs all over the country and there is just as much enthusiasm and appetite for the game. There are also plenty of cracking players around who would do very well if the professional clubs actually looked outside of their Service Areas. It is truly dispiriting for some people at the moment. It is also incomprehensible that our so-called leaders cannot see the long term benefits. We are run by a bunch of baffoons at present who have absolutely no idea of what leadership actually involves.


Edited by GeordieSaint, 24 June 2013 - 01:17 PM.

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#137 Saintslass

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 01:20 PM

Surely Development Officers can get involved in SE rugby? There are clubs down here who are struggling for numbers in their junior teams as there is no SE engagement. The consequence of that will affect playing numbers at tier 3 and 4 levels. The RFL have got themselves into a vicious circle...

I thought the whole point of Sport England money was to fund development officers?  I know a number have been made redundant as a result of the drop in SE funding.  I read recently about an amateur club in Croydon which has been expanding its youth teams but is now looking uncertain due to the redundancy of their development officer (who the heck decided to make redundant a development officer in an actual development area?).



#138 Saintslass

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 01:22 PM

Me too and there are plenty of supporters who think the same as well. I have been involved for a number of years playing the game at clubs all over the country and there is just as much enthusiasm and appetite for the game. There are also plenty of cracking players around who would do very well if the professional clubs actually looked outside of their Service Areas. It is truly dispiriting for some people at the moment. It is also incomprehensible that our so-called leaders cannot see the long term benefits. We are run by a bunch of baffoons at present who have absolutely no idea of what leadership actually involves.

Somehow, it appears to me, the RFL have become (or maybe they have always been?) an inward looking group of administrators which is not what you want for a governing body. 



#139 Dave T

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 03:15 PM

To play Devil's advocate here.

 

The way I understand it is that we got a large funding pot which was spent on Development Officers. The next time, our participation went down, funding was cut, so we got rid of the Development Officers.

 

Doesn't this suggest that the strategy of throwing a load of money at Development Officers around the country isn;t the right one?

 

By the way, I am well aware I am being simplistic on this and know little about it, I am commenting as an outsider here, it's an interesting discussion though, keep it up!



#140 ckn

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 03:42 PM

To play Devil's advocate here.

 

The way I understand it is that we got a large funding pot which was spent on Development Officers. The next time, our participation went down, funding was cut, so we got rid of the Development Officers.

 

Doesn't this suggest that the strategy of throwing a load of money at Development Officers around the country isn;t the right one?

 

By the way, I am well aware I am being simplistic on this and know little about it, I am commenting as an outsider here, it's an interesting discussion though, keep it up!

An easy way to think about the role of a development officer is to think about the people they influence.  Imagine you're a school headmaster or head of PE in a school not in the RL heartlands, you're being pushed to cut costs almost every day.  You want to keep playing both codes of rugby but you have the union development officer offering free coaching for both the kids and the PE teachers, kit, competition organisation, links into clubs for even more freebies, etc and nothing but tumbleweed from the rugby league side.  Which one would you drop if you had to pick?  Imagine you're that headmaster again and you're teaching rugby league on sufferance just because other local schools do so then that rugby league development officer stops showing up, why should you keep your kids playing it if the sport couldn't care about your school?

 

The other side is that most good development officers are essentially part-time scouts with their bank of contacts into the local, regional and national clubs.  Where will the quick phone calls come from for clubs to come have a look at a promising talent at a school or youth game?  Why should kids even think about rugby league if they have a union scout come talent sniffing and rugby league not even aware they exist?

 

The job of development officer has always heavily exploited their love for the game by paying them far less than they deserve for the effort they put in.


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