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How good could the World Cup have been?

With a bit more faith

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55 replies to this topic

#21 Mick Carroll

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 09:33 AM

What is it that is making people think that the semis and Cardiff could be close to sell out crowds??

#22 Dave T

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 11:00 AM

I think a few people are hoping for 50k plus due to a few reasons:

The organisers have clearly stated the are aiming for near sellouts at these and that ticket sales are exceeding expectations.

Cardiff has a fair few sold out sections and loads of areas on all tiers have been opened.

The promotion and advanced sales exceed anything seen before - 200k sales plus.

We are seeing all sorts of coverage, even this week there have been a couple of excellent articles in the Indy and Guardian.

Itd be nice to hear actual numbers for these events, and being an rl fan i am naturally cynical about the sales progress, but the signs are positive.

#23 nathanwood7

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 11:14 AM

What is it that is making people think that the semis and Cardiff could be close to sell out crowds??

 

What is making people think they won't be?

 

We are told that 200k+ tickets have been sold of which 40k relate to the final. It is therefore reasonable to assume that both Wembley and Cardiff have sold tens of thousands of tickets already, and with 3 months still to go it is not unreasonable to expect ticket sales to pick up further e.g. if/when England qualify for the semis there will undoubtedly be a surge of sales for Wembley.

 

The only time I've seen someone suggest Cardiff and Wembley sales have been poor has been the YEP journalist on Twitter who has not given any indication as to where his "source" may have come from. The fact that the ticket website is showing 30 bays as already sold out, suggests he is wrong, or that the RFL are adopting a bizarre and doomed policy of preventing people from buying tickets which have actually not been sold.



#24 Tiny Tim

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 02:57 PM

.......or that the RFL are adopting a bizarre and doomed policy of preventing people from buying tickets which have actually not been sold.

Surely not even the RFL would be that daft.....would they....?  :nono:


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#25 Mick Carroll

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 03:59 PM

I really hope we get these figures, international rl gets me interested more than super league or the nrl ever could. I reckon if each pro club maybe tried to fill a coach for the opener that would be a good idea, I'd certainly be up for going on one from leeds.

#26 Doghead

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 05:02 PM

What is it that is making people think that the semis and Cardiff could be close to sell out crowds??

54 hotels matching your search , 27 available for your dates.

 

 

Hotels selling out fast for the Cardiff opener, half have already gone, limited in the rest.



#27 deluded pom?

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 06:11 PM

54 hotels matching your search , 27 available for your dates.

 

 

Hotels selling out fast for the Cardiff opener, half have already gone, limited in the rest.

I bet the prices have been bumped up too.


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#28 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 12:22 PM

What is making people think they won't be?
 
We are told that 200k+ tickets have been sold of which 40k relate to the final. It is therefore reasonable to assume that both Wembley and Cardiff have sold tens of thousands of tickets already, and with 3 months still to go it is not unreasonable to expect ticket sales to pick up further e.g. if/when England qualify for the semis there will undoubtedly be a surge of sales for Wembley.
 
The only time I've seen someone suggest Cardiff and Wembley sales have been poor has been the YEP journalist on Twitter who has not given any indication as to where his "source" may have come from. The fact that the ticket website is showing 30 bays as already sold out, suggests he is wrong, or that the RFL are adopting a bizarre and doomed policy of preventing people from buying tickets which have actually not been sold.


Have we been told that 200k have been sold or has this been deduced?

My scepticism comes from the 2008 World Cup where much of this deduction was done on Australian forums based on numbers of bays sold out and of course they have the controversial PAX system. They often proved to be way off the mark.

I'd love to be proved wrong and to believe what we see on the other thread but I have a sneaky feeling that their announcements are based on numbers of tickets that have been released rather than the actual numbers.

That said, it's still early days. I have a Widnes programme from 1995, discussing the numerous problems with the 1995 World Cup and it's pure doom-monger stuff. One of them is that they have sold barely any tickets for the whole tournament. My memory for this isn't great but I think it's either 100,000 (which you'd think would be good?) or £100,000 worth. It's probably neither but we all know how the tournament turned out don't we?

#29 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 12:55 PM

Whilst I agree with you to an extent and share some of your nervousness, I think your memory may be playing tricks about the 20k at Belfast - the stadium didn't even hold that many. I also don't remember the kind of sellout talk that you do.
 
The 2008 tournament did have the same issue as you say, the semis apparently were a sellout well before the games, despite ending up with almost 60 empty seats over the 2 games.


My memory's not that bad, especially for RL related matters!

I don't think it was far off 20k. It's 12k now but that's because of safety restrictions down from 24,000. Don't get me wrong I'm only talking about optimism. I remember distinctly an article in RLW where Brian Carney and a few others took a trip to Windsor park and walked on the pitch. They were commenting on how they then were selling tickets in a local shopping centre and were hopeful of a sellout. I even remember hearing on the morning in a newspaper that they were hoping for 5,000 and being gutted after previous reports. They ended with 3,200.

Also from that WC I remember a newspaper report mentioning that Cardiff council were confident of getting 35,000 for their game at the Millenium Stadium and also being again disappointed when a report said they were expecting 55,000 for England at Twickers. There was definitely an article in RLW where an official (or a pundit my memory's not that good!) saying we should aim to sellout the quarters onwards.

http://forums.league...=187190&page=31

Here is the main Australian forum talking about tickets sold. Even though they have a more precise system you see the same cycle of optimism followed by disappointment. The week of the England-PNG game most are still talking about 20k plus and we ended up with just over 10k. My point is that we should take any announcements and predictions with a big dose of salt. It's hard to know how successful it'll be and a lot will depend on things such as England's performances and the weather.

I fully expect that it'll be better than 2000 but I think 14 is too many and that we'll have some real disappointments with hopefully some real positives along the way.

#30 nathanwood7

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 01:17 PM

Have we been told that 200k have been sold or has this been deduced?
 

From the article in this thread which you may want to have a look at (it's a decent read), "Bolton says she is targeting ticket sales of 500,000, and organisers say they have reached 40% of that figure with three months to go. More than 40,000 tickets have been sold for the final at Old Trafford, which still leaves some way to go to sell out."



#31 Dave T

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 01:33 PM

My memory's not that bad, especially for RL related matters!

I don't think it was far off 20k. It's 12k now but that's because of safety restrictions down from 24,000. Don't get me wrong I'm only talking about optimism. I remember distinctly an article in RLW where Brian Carney and a few others took a trip to Windsor park and walked on the pitch. They were commenting on how they then were selling tickets in a local shopping centre and were hopeful of a sellout. I even remember hearing on the morning in a newspaper that they were hoping for 5,000 and being gutted after previous reports. They ended with 3,200.

Also from that WC I remember a newspaper report mentioning that Cardiff council were confident of getting 35,000 for their game at the Millenium Stadium and also being again disappointed when a report said they were expecting 55,000 for England at Twickers. There was definitely an article in RLW where an official (or a pundit my memory's not that good!) saying we should aim to sellout the quarters onwards.

http://forums.league...=187190&page=31

Here is the main Australian forum talking about tickets sold. Even though they have a more precise system you see the same cycle of optimism followed by disappointment. The week of the England-PNG game most are still talking about 20k plus and we ended up with just over 10k. My point is that we should take any announcements and predictions with a big dose of salt. It's hard to know how successful it'll be and a lot will depend on things such as England's performances and the weather.

I fully expect that it'll be better than 2000 but I think 14 is too many and that we'll have some real disappointments with hopefully some real positives along the way.

I know you are right about the crowds being lower than anticipated, I was questioning the 20k specifically, I remember they were hoping for 10k plus. I also remember the Cardiff crowd being a disappointment, despite the fact that it is the highest Wales home test crowd ever.

 

I agree with all you are saying, just questioned some of the numebrs.



#32 Dave T

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 01:35 PM

Have we been told that 200k have been sold or has this been deduced?

My scepticism comes from the 2008 World Cup where much of this deduction was done on Australian forums based on numbers of bays sold out and of course they have the controversial PAX system. They often proved to be way off the mark.

I'd love to be proved wrong and to believe what we see on the other thread but I have a sneaky feeling that their announcements are based on numbers of tickets that have been released rather than the actual numbers.

That said, it's still early days. I have a Widnes programme from 1995, discussing the numerous problems with the 1995 World Cup and it's pure doom-monger stuff. One of them is that they have sold barely any tickets for the whole tournament. My memory for this isn't great but I think it's either 100,000 (which you'd think would be good?) or £100,000 worth. It's probably neither but we all know how the tournament turned out don't we?

Sally Bolton has stated a couple of times that the target is 500k and they have sold 40%.

 

If I'm honest I have some nervousness around these numbers - I wouldn't be surprised if there are large sections for official tours and sponsors held back that are counted as 'sold'.

 

Based on previous RL history, it seems rather strange that 40k tickets have suddenly been sold for a World Cup final that England may not even be in. 



#33 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 01:43 PM

From the article in this thread which you may want to have a look at (it's a decent read), "Bolton says she is targeting ticket sales of 500,000, and organisers say they have reached 40% of that figure with three months to go. More than 40,000 tickets have been sold for the final at Old Trafford, which still leaves some way to go to sell out."


It's obviously a good figure and thanks for the link but I'll still wait until I see them there, I've been disappointed too many times!

If this figure is accurate (I'm still sceptical!) it compares very favourably to the total of 263,000 that attended the 2000 World Cup.

#34 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 01:45 PM

I know you are right about the crowds being lower than anticipated, I was questioning the 20k specifically, I remember they were hoping for 10k plus. I also remember the Cardiff crowd being a disappointment, despite the fact that it is the highest Wales home test crowd ever.
 
I agree with all you are saying, just questioned some of the numebrs.


I'll accept I could be wrong with the 20k figure, maybe that's what I thought capacity was at the time. I also remember it being revised to 10,000 and then to 5,000 before ending at 3,200.

If there's any difference this time around it's that the positive figures appear to be what have been sold rather than predicting what will sell.

#35 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 01:47 PM

Sally Bolton has stated a couple of times that the target is 500k and they have sold 40%.
 
If I'm honest I have some nervousness around these numbers - I wouldn't be surprised if there are large sections for official tours and sponsors held back that are counted as 'sold'.
 
Based on previous RL history, it seems rather strange that 40k tickets have suddenly been sold for a World Cup final that England may not even be in.


To be positive for a change, Australia sold out their final way in advance and despite the profile over there they don't have a reputation for pre-buying either.

#36 Dave T

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 01:53 PM

To be positive for a change, Australia sold out their final way in advance and despite the profile over there they don't have a reputation for pre-buying either.

That's a good point, I hope they have genuinely sold 200k seats with 200k people actually ready to fill those seats!



#37 Doghead

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 02:06 PM

Sally Bolton has stated a couple of times that the target is 500k and they have sold 40%.

 

If I'm honest I have some nervousness around these numbers - I wouldn't be surprised if there are large sections for official tours and sponsors held back that are counted as 'sold'.

 

Based on previous RL history, it seems rather strange that 40k tickets have suddenly been sold for a World Cup final that England may not even be in. 

Based on RL history, wasn't there 46,000 at old Trafford Australia v KIWI.



#38 Dave T

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 02:07 PM

Based on RL history, wasn't there 46,000 at old Trafford Australia v KIWI.

Yes - thousands were given away free in the week due to poor pre-sales. 



#39 Gruff

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 02:10 PM

If England win the WC I won't give a monkeys uncle if Old Trafford is full or I am the only one there.

 

I actually wouldn't care if we make money or lose it, if we get 1 viewer on BBC or 10m.  I just want to be there for what would be the biggest game in English RL history.



#40 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 02 August 2013 - 02:28 PM

I knew I hadn't dreamt this one up (although my figures were way out).

I have a programme from a Widnes match just 6 days before the opening of the 1995 World Cup. This World Cup is often seen as a great success and many people have lasting memories from that tournament. However, it's easy to forget that it was played during controversial times; it wasn't long since Super League had been announced after all.

The head of the Widnes Supporters Club (Craig Elliot) writes a piece in the programme asking Widnes fans not to boycott the event out of frustration. Here are some quotes from the piece,

The centrepiece of the RL Centenary is the Halifax World Cup - the biggest secret in British sport thanks to low key marketing and scant press coverage. Paul Harrison's appointment as PRO and the interest of Rupert Murdoch in the game has not increased column inches. In addition the BBC's publicity for the event has been virtually nonexistent. The media image of the game is likely to deterioriate if World Cup matches are not well supported. At the time of writing under 20,000 tickets had been sold for the whole tournament with many fans seemingly having decided to boycott the competition.

The rest as they say is history. It seems likely to me that the opening win over Australia gave the tournament a kick start, something that didn't happen in 2000 with a damp squib in Belfast and a disappointing washout at Twickers.

For all the preparation we do I believe the success of the tournament will ultimately come down to that opening match against the Aussies. We must put up a decent fight.