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Mike Calvin- Unadulterated Rubbish


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#221 Severus

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 09:20 AM

Thats your reply to his post? Wow, just wow. You know exactly the point he was making and why he brought ru into a conversation with you.

 

Great contribution to the debate there. No, seriously, well done. *slow hand clap*


Edited by Severus, 29 August 2013 - 09:33 AM.

Fides invicta triumphat

#222 Severus

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 09:30 AM

I was making the point that tripe is perceived to be accurate by people ignorant of the facts.

 

But my point was that some of the things you mentioned have an element of truth in them regarding RU. In this hypothetical situation this is partly down to the perception of RU, but partly this is down to RU itself. Had this article been written about RU I would hope that rather than dismissing it, an attempt would be made to address 1. why this is the perception and 2. how this could be changed.

 

Whether its right or wrong this type of article is damaging to the sport of RL and the best course of action would be to have a look at how RL is perceived from the outside and address any issues. I understand the defensive reaction and the siege mentality, but by ignoring or dismissing any criticism and failing to ask why there is this view RL is doing itself no favours at all. 


Fides invicta triumphat

#223 ckn

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 09:38 AM

But my point was that some of the things you mentioned have an element of truth in them regarding RU. In this hypothetical situation this is partly down to the perception of RU, but partly this is down to RU itself. Had this article been written about RU I would hope that rather than dismissing it, an attempt would be made to address 1. why this is the perception and 2. how this could be changed.

 

Whether its right or wrong this type of article is damaging to the sport of RL and the best course of action would be to have a look at how RL is perceived from the outside and address any issues. I understand the defensive reaction and the siege mentality, but by ignoring or dismissing any criticism and failing to ask why there is this view RL is doing itself no favours at all. 

Unfortunately some people are just thwaites, they like being that way and get chubbies from people biting from their trolling.  Sometimes they're journalists and can get their trolling printed in national newspapers.


Arguing with the forum trolls is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good you are, the bird will **** on the board and strut around like it won anyway


#224 Johnoco

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 09:50 AM

But my point was that some of the things you mentioned have an element of truth in them regarding RU. In this hypothetical situation this is partly down to the perception of RU, but partly this is down to RU itself. Had this article been written about RU I would hope that rather than dismissing it, an attempt would be made to address 1. why this is the perception and 2. how this could be changed.

Whether its right or wrong this type of article is damaging to the sport of RL and the best course of action would be to have a look at how RL is perceived from the outside and address any issues. I understand the defensive reaction and the siege mentality, but by ignoring or dismissing any criticism and failing to ask why there is this view RL is doing itself no favours at all.

Who is arguing that there should be no criticism of RL? Not on here that's for sure.

Valid opinion pieces about RL are welcome, whether the writer is a fan or not. Criticising the fans dress sense or calling the event a moonie wedding is pathetic however.
I am not sensitive to people's opinion on RL, I don't give a monkeys if someone doesn't like it, so I aren't coming from a 'don't dare criticise RL' mindset.
I just think that this piece is puerile trash and don't see why we should apologise if some people get upset about it.

#225 OMEGA

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 10:33 AM

But my point was that some of the things you mentioned have an element of truth in them regarding RU. In this hypothetical situation this is partly down to the perception of RU, but partly this is down to RU itself. Had this article been written about RU I would hope that rather than dismissing it, an attempt would be made to address 1. why this is the perception and 2. how this could be changed.
 
Whether its right or wrong this type of article is damaging to the sport of RL and the best course of action would be to have a look at how RL is perceived from the outside and address any issues. I understand the defensive reaction and the siege mentality, but by ignoring or dismissing any criticism and failing to ask why there is this view RL is doing itself no favours at all.


The indignation is a result of out and out insults levelled at Rugby League fans, let's not retrospectively attach any kind of credibility to the bilious tirade from this jerk. I have no doubt Rugby League has a huge job to do in selling itself outside the traditional heartlands of the game and you're right to say we should be engaging with others to identify and strategise a solution. Let's not confuse the image problem of the game and the article by Calvin, one is a real issue for the game that we all knew of before the weekend the other is a desperate attempt to foster attention by penning bigoted, pre-conceived, outdated and insulting generalisations.

The fool can desperately try and attach credibility to his drivel all he wants but the evidence of his stupidity is there in back and white.

#226 John Drake

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 10:35 AM

I never read the red tops.  I'm strictly a broadsheet girl (and yes, I do still enjoy reading a real paper rather than just online - some of us can do both!).  But I went out and bought a copy of The People last weekend because I read on Twitter that there was an article about London Skolars in the print issue, which there was, alongside a good report of the Challenge Cup final.  I would do that again, because I want to read what has been said about the rugby league.  So while I wouldn't give up my broadsheet, I would buy The People just for the rugby league coverage, when I know there is going to be some.

 

And how many papers of any description - including the rugby league press - carry an article on The Skolars?  I don't mean the match; I mean a piece about the club?  None as far as I can remember, certainly in recent times anyway.

 

Rugby League World Magazine (May 2013), Issue 385 has a two page feature on London Skolars.

 

Part of its regular Championship/Championship 1 coverage every month.

 

I can recommend it! :)

 

Available online here

http://www.pocketmag...by League World


John Drake
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#227 Martyn Sadler

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 10:39 AM

Rugby League World Magazine (May 2013), Issue 385 has a two page feature on London Skolars.

 

Part of its regular Championship/Championship 1 coverage every month.

 

I can recommend it! :)

 

Available online here

http://www.pocketmag...by League World

And of course there is news every week about London Skolars in League Express.



#228 OMEGA

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 10:39 AM

Reply to my complaint, which doesn't address the insults levelled at Northerners at all.

Thank you for contacting us via our online complaints form.  We are always glad to hear from our readers, whether or not feedback is positive, and I am grateful to you for taking the time to get in touch.
 
I am naturally sorry to hear that you found Michael Calvin's column so disagreeable.  We are very conscious that not all readers will agree with the views of all of our writers – but in the final analysis we would rather that columnists felt able to recount their experiences and express their honestly-held opinions, even if they provoke a strong reaction, than stick to the anodyne for fear of causing offence.  I can assure you, however, we do not set out to make a mockery of rugby league or its fans. 
 
I hope very much that in spite of your concern on this particular occasion, you will continue to read our newspapers and find much to enjoy (even if you don’t always agree with our commentators).
 
Thanks again for making the effort to write.
 
With best regards
 
Will Gore
Deputy Managing Editor

#229 Martyn Sadler

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 10:41 AM

The indignation is a result of out and out insults levelled at Rugby League fans, let's not retrospectively attach any kind of credibility to the bilious tirade from this jerk. I have no doubt Rugby League has a huge job to do in selling itself outside the traditional heartlands of the game and you're right to say we should be engaging with others to identify and strategise a solution. Let's not confuse the image problem of the game and the article by Calvin, one is a real issue for the game that we all knew of before the weekend the other is a desperate attempt to foster attention by penning bigoted, pre-conceived, outdated and insulting generalisations.

The fool can desperately try and attach credibility to his drivel all he wants but the evidence of his stupidity is there in back and white.

This is the best post I've read on this particular article.

 

I don't see any point in trying to humour someone whose bigotry is there in black and white.



#230 fetlar

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 10:56 AM

This is the best post I've read on this particular article.

 

I don't see any point in trying to humour someone whose bigotry is there in black and white.

 

But earlier in the thread you were suggesting that you could have taken him under your wing on the day and guided him towards enlightenment. Are you now saying it's ok to release the killer whippets?


Edited by fetlar, 29 August 2013 - 11:00 AM.


#231 Futtocks

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 10:59 AM

Reply to my complaint, which doesn't address the insults levelled at Northerners at all.

Thank you for contacting us via our online complaints form.  We are always glad to hear from our readers, whether or not feedback is positive, and I am grateful to you for taking the time to get in touch.
 
I am naturally sorry to hear that you found Michael Calvin's column so disagreeable.  We are very conscious that not all readers will agree with the views of all of our writers – but in the final analysis we would rather that columnists felt able to recount their experiences and express their honestly-held opinions, even if they provoke a strong reaction, than stick to the anodyne for fear of causing offence.  I can assure you, however, we do not set out to make a mockery of rugby league or its fans. 
 
I hope very much that in spite of your concern on this particular occasion, you will continue to read our newspapers and find much to enjoy (even if you don’t always agree with our commentators).
 
Thanks again for making the effort to write.
 
With best regards
 
Will Gore
Deputy Managing Editor

Basically, they are saying that they feel Calvin has the right to come out with any old rubbish.

 

Happily, you have the right to stop buying the paper.


A mind is like a parachute. It doesn’t work if it isn’t open. Frank Zappa (1940 - 1993)


#232 Dave T

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 11:01 AM

But my point was that some of the things you mentioned have an element of truth in them regarding RU. In this hypothetical situation this is partly down to the perception of RU, but partly this is down to RU itself. Had this article been written about RU I would hope that rather than dismissing it, an attempt would be made to address 1. why this is the perception and 2. how this could be changed.

 

Whether its right or wrong this type of article is damaging to the sport of RL and the best course of action would be to have a look at how RL is perceived from the outside and address any issues. I understand the defensive reaction and the siege mentality, but by ignoring or dismissing any criticism and failing to ask why there is this view RL is doing itself no favours at all. 

But nobody is complaining about the reasonable point made - the challenges in London and with the commercial market.

 

A bit like you would be offended by the racist and homophobic comments that BB used to illustrate his point, many RL Fans were offended by the widespread bigoted views that the event was some kind of freakshow, full of fat comedy characters from the North.

 

That isn't a perception that can be influenced, it is just an idiot's bigoted views.



#233 Martyn Sadler

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 11:05 AM

But earlier in the thread you were suggesting that you could have taken him under your wing on the day and guided him towards enlightenment. Are you now saying it's ok to release the killer whippets?

That was prior to the event, not after it.

 

And even now it would be interesting to know what leads someone to write such garbage.



#234 fetlar

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 11:07 AM

That was prior to the event, not after it.

 

And even now it would be interesting to know what leads someone to write such garbage.

 

Inadequacy.



#235 Pottsy

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 11:09 AM

That was prior to the event, not after it.

And even now it would be interesting to know what leads someone to write such garbage.


I did try to draw him into a reasoned debate on twitter but he had little to back up his points and ended up trying to pass opinion as fact.

#236 Dave T

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 11:13 AM

Reply to my complaint, which doesn't address the insults levelled at Northerners at all.

Thank you for contacting us via our online complaints form.  We are always glad to hear from our readers, whether or not feedback is positive, and I am grateful to you for taking the time to get in touch.
 
I am naturally sorry to hear that you found Michael Calvin's column so disagreeable.  We are very conscious that not all readers will agree with the views of all of our writers – but in the final analysis we would rather that columnists felt able to recount their experiences and express their honestly-held opinions, even if they provoke a strong reaction, than stick to the anodyne for fear of causing offence.  I can assure you, however, we do not set out to make a mockery of rugby league or its fans. 
 
I hope very much that in spite of your concern on this particular occasion, you will continue to read our newspapers and find much to enjoy (even if you don’t always agree with our commentators).
 
Thanks again for making the effort to write.
 
With best regards
 
Will Gore
Deputy Managing Editor

Identical reply to mine.



#237 dkw

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 11:50 AM

Great contribution to the debate there. No, seriously, well done. *slow hand clap*

While your "I dont know what you mean" reply was a marvelous effort though. Well done you.



#238 RidingPie

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 12:20 PM

Maybe we are looking at this the wrong way! Maybe we should see it as an opportunity!

I'm not saying that this article isn't bad or insulting, it clearly is. However, perhaps the RFL should go all out to get him to the grand final. Offer him a hotel room after, free transport, whatever it takes to get him there. Then make sure that there is someone like Martyn, or maybe Andy Wilson (they share an interesting in cricket after all), or Clair Blading to act as a brand ambassador, and as much as possible make sure he has a good time. Mr Calvin will probably know he went over the top in his generalisations and I'd hope would be willing to entertain the notion of going to the Grand Final or some other big event, especially since we all acknowledge that as a sport we didn't have our best foot forward. We need to be courting people involved in the media at this level. Not alienating them from the sport.

#239 gingerjon

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 12:22 PM

Maybe we are looking at this the wrong way! Maybe we should see it as an opportunity!

I'm not saying that this article isn't bad or insulting, it clearly is. However, perhaps the RFL should go all out to get him to the grand final. Offer him a hotel room after, free transport, whatever it takes to get him there. Then make sure that there is someone like Martyn, or maybe Andy Wilson (they share an interesting in cricket after all), or Clair Blading to act as a brand ambassador, and as much as possible make sure he has a good time. Mr Calvin will probably know he went over the top in his generalisations and I'd hope would be willing to entertain the notion of going to the Grand Final or some other big event, especially since we all acknowledge that as a sport we didn't have our best foot forward. We need to be courting people involved in the media at this level. Not alienating them from the sport.

 

I was pondering whether he should get an invite to The Big Hit.

 

But all he'd do is stare at the unsold upper tier.


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#240 deluded pom?

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Posted 29 August 2013 - 12:36 PM

The deputy managing editor calls himself Will. Best leave it there peeps and save your time and electricity.

Edited by deluded pom?, 29 August 2013 - 12:37 PM.

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