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Summer/Winter debate


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#101 RugbyLeagueGeek

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 08:38 AM

I think the level playing field quote wasn't really aimed at allowing payments to players either.

I think it was replying directly to the comment in the preceding post about "artificial distinctions and divisions" based around amateur status.



#102 Death to the Rah Rah's

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 09:20 AM

I had a quick look at the North West Rugby League website last night and out of 30 games scheduled in the last two weeks - 17 have gone down as 24-0. Ulverston who are top of their league have had 3 forfeits in their last 5 games.

This at the start of the traditional winter season!

There has also been a similar trend in the Cumberland League, although nowhere near as bad with 5 league games being cancelled due to lack of numbers since the start of September, and only 2 league games in the previous 6 months, and I believe similar problems in the Barrow & District.

So if thats anything to go by, the problems aren't going to disappear with a move en-block back to a winter season!

#103 The 4 of Us

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 10:40 AM

It's a summer/winter debate not a pay or not to pay debate and the coincidence with the reduction in people playing the sport and the switch from winter to summer.

I think the level playing field quote wasn't really aimed at allowing payments to players either.


I think it is an indicator of a wider problem though M. As a sport generally we are very backward looking sport. As our sporting competitors look to the future we do go out of our way looking to "grander" times when perhaps they weren't. The good old, 50's, 60's, 70's or 80's for that matter have little relevance to today's players.

One issue is the difference between pro-am players which even RL's most ardent critic RU has long dispensed with.

Rather than being an open sport and one which allows teams to find their level through open competition, we have one which is run based upon rumour, misinformation , jealousy and trying to get one over each other.

Winter/Summer is as much to do with who's not getting what they want as to what's best for the sport. A unified sport with a strong governing body would in my opinion allow a firm plan put in place for the whole game rather than it be ruled by various factions in either camp. Summer may or may not be the best time for RL to base most of it competitions and grow ( after all it wasn't doing it much in Winter ) but we'll never know because those perhaps lost the debate previously having continued to talk things down. If people continually say something's rubbish, others will think it.

The sport needs to go forward together. If the bickering could stop there may be a chance that the players will think its worth giving it a go.

The money is incidental. It's a symptom not a cause but I do think it could assist in helping the game appear dynamic and may make a difference with some in choosing RL first rather than a sport where they have an opportunity now.

It may also prevent , as I have now doubt happens now, them drifting off to a local union club.

#104 Pottsy

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 08:01 PM

I've got my own thoughts about summer/winter. One general observation I'll make, however, is that as a sport we've talked ourselves into a crisis and I almost wonder if some people are getting a perverse kick out of it.

#105 The 4 of Us

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 09:49 PM

I've got my own thoughts about summer/winter. One general observation I'll make, however, is that as a sport we've talked ourselves into a crisis and I almost wonder if some people are getting a perverse kick out of it.


My brother-in-law is convinced Trevor McDonald was responsible for the recession through his News at 10 contributions. 12 months later he was saying told ya so.

#106 Death to the Rah Rah's

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 07:20 AM

Crisis or no crisis, you can't hide from the facts, and it seems the game is struggling at the cross over point in the seasons. In reality that's maybe all it is, in Cumbria, the worst week for fixture forfeits was on the opening day of the RU season (1st week in Sept), but the following weekend there was only one game conceded.

Coincidence or hard facts?

Pretty sure you will make your own minds up

#107 sbull

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 10:16 AM

The game struggled over the cross over point!! What about all the games that got called off during the season, isn't that struggling to?

#108 Death to the Rah Rah's

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 02:48 PM

of course it is, but it got worse at the cross over point

#109 Mr Smeaton

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 05:43 PM

In Division 3 of the NWML, out of a total of 90 scheduled games, only 39 took place with 51 being 'walk-overs'. The sad thing is, 9/10 clubs are NCL 'A' teams.



#110 sbull

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 05:53 PM

Just a minor set back!!

#111 Marauder

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 06:02 PM

of course it is, but it got worse at the cross over point

It will get a lot worse


Carlsberg don't do Soldiers, but if they did, they would probably be Brits.



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#112 Spidey

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 07:34 PM

In Division 3 of the NWML, out of a total of 90 scheduled games, only 39 took place with 51 being 'walk-overs'. The sad thing is, 9/10 clubs are NCL 'A' teams.


Ended up being a farce of a league my club (Crosfields A) were clearly out of their depth when we actually had opposition turn up 100 odd and 80 odd registered against us this year. Still think we played in the most actual games though but teams finishe higher simply because of where their fixtures fell

#113 sbull

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Posted 14 October 2013 - 07:51 AM

The NCL committee says know one has approached them saying they have a problem with summer, if that is the case albeit difficult to believe than were do we go from here?with a large proportion of the NCL clubs loosing an affective competitive reserve side will the NCL be lowering the criteria to be a member? So fare we have had a trickle of first team games being called off, how long before the tap gets turned on.
With the main selling point for summer being we will have a better quality of games, most clubs admitting to using 50 plus players in their first team some of wich are signing on the day they play to make numbers up, do people except this as the norm now?
are we hoping that the youth will change this in years to come because they will know no better and will embrace the summer concept.
Personally I believe the kids of today will still get a girlfriend still be distracted with their college work, go on the holiday with their mates go to festivals get married have kids ect,
Although I support the traditional season which still had problems no denying that, I haven't stop supporting summer,
By now I think it has been a stablished that we have major problems ahead and I don't see any suggestions wich will solve the issues of attracting more players and more supporters.
Prior to the move to summer we only had speculation to debate on, now we have hard facts and it's up to the clubs to chose their path.

#114 Marauder

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Posted 14 October 2013 - 08:11 AM

Crisis or no crisis, you can't hide from the facts, and it seems the game is struggling at the cross over point in the seasons. In reality that's maybe all it is, in Cumbria, the worst week for fixture forfeits was on the opening day of the RU season (1st week in Sept), but the following weekend there was only one game conceded.

Coincidence or hard facts?

Pretty sure you will make your own minds up

This has been the problem from has far back as I can remember with summer rugby, once the winter season started clubs in the RLC fell apart when the Union and BARLA players went back to their clubs, this situation has now expanded to the end of both winter and summer seasons.


Carlsberg don't do Soldiers, but if they did, they would probably be Brits.



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#115 Back In The Good Old Days

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Posted 14 October 2013 - 08:52 PM

I find it hard to believe that not one person has informed the NCL committee of the problems related to summer rugby.
Are the NCL committee wearing rose coloured spectacles all the time so everything in the summer garden looks rosy?
Games having not been fulfilled and one team dropping out due to poor fixture planning and another team being made to play away nine games on the bounce!

If the NCL was a business it would be subject to a 360 degree review to identify the high points and the low points and then an action plan developed from the review.
Unless we get such a review and some positive action points expect more of the same next season.
Im not against summer or winter for that matter but what I am against is those at the top appearing to do nothing to improve the situation.

#116 Guardsman

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Posted 15 October 2013 - 03:20 PM

Let's offer some constructive ideas as to what we think would help.

I think teams should be allowed to select at least THREE free weeks PRIOR to the season starting. This will allow teams to plan stag do's, weddings etc.,

This will inevitably require more work and organisation from the powers that be at the NCL, but then they are being paid for their respective roles and I'm sure there would be a way round this i.e. extending the season a week either side etc.,

Opinions and suggestions ?

#117 Back In The Good Old Days

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Posted 15 October 2013 - 04:31 PM

Similar suggestions have already been made guardsman just hope the powers that be are listening.

#118 Marauder

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Posted 15 October 2013 - 05:37 PM

Let's offer some constructive ideas as to what we think would help.

I think teams should be allowed to select at least THREE free weeks PRIOR to the season starting. This will allow teams to plan stag do's, weddings etc.,

This will inevitably require more work and organisation from the powers that be at the NCL, but then they are being paid for their respective roles and I'm sure there would be a way round this i.e. extending the season a week either side etc.,

Opinions and suggestions ?

How do you coordinate all the free dates of every club within a division and fit all the fixtures into a 9 month season without having teams going weeks without a game.


Carlsberg don't do Soldiers, but if they did, they would probably be Brits.



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#119 sbull

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Posted 15 October 2013 - 07:22 PM

Let's offer some constructive ideas as to what we think would help.
I think teams should be allowed to select at least THREE free weeks PRIOR to the season starting. This will allow teams to plan stag do's, weddings etc.,
This will inevitably require more work and organisation from the powers that be at the NCL, but then they are being paid for their respective roles and I'm sure there would be a way round this i.e. extending the season a week either side etc.,
Opinions and suggestions ?


Don't think this will give team consistency in playing alternate games home and away, teams got the chance to change a game last season and we ended in playing 9 away games in 10 ,

If it was just a few teams who were complaining about lack of players and suporters I can understand but the majority are saying that the crowds are down and they are struggling for players yet we seam that we are determined to make the most of a bad job,

I will continue to support my club during the summer when I can but I really can not understand the reasoning behind the summer concept when all the statistics are pointing towards its failiar, we all like the nice weather and the good conditions but practically will it ever work for the masses ?

Good luck to any club who are thriving through the summer months but look at what it's done to the foundation with regards to how many games now get called off.

#120 Guardsman

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Posted 15 October 2013 - 10:07 PM

How do you coordinate all the free dates of every club within a division and fit all the fixtures into a 9 month season without having teams going weeks without a game.


With difficulty I'm sure. But if teams give their dates well in advance then I feel that it's doable. Maybe the NCL would come back and say clubs can only have two weeks or say give a free week carte blanch to every team and one that the teams can choose themselves. There are all sorts of permutations but as I said earlier there are people in paid positions who have the time to sort this out and if the game is to go forward, we need to look at every option to improve the situation.




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