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England's backs


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#41 Cumbrian Fanatic

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 07:25 AM

I can't believe we haven't had a mention of Dream Team stars like Crooks, Lineham and Matty Smith.

Maybe a year too early for Lineham and Crooks? though various Hull fans I spoke to at the Magic Weekend and Wembley have said they have been great this season.

 

Matty Smith is and interesting one, I've always thought to beat the Aussies we need to have something different, something they can't plan for. I thought that may be Chase when they picked him but not so far. Maybe Smith is the answer.


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#42 7723

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 07:29 AM

Smith has had a great season for Wigan. He has been consistently one of the better players. He clearly has a good kicking game as seen in the CC final and will happily take the line on. I would have him in the squad even just as back up.



#43 walter sobchak

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 08:19 AM

Here's my 17 I'd like to see if everybody's available:
1. Tomkins
2. Charnley
3. Watkins
4. Reed
5. Hall
6. Widdop
7. Robinson
8. Graham
9. Roby
10. Mossop/hill
11. S. burgess
12. Westwood
13. O'loughlin
14. Burrow
15. G. Burgess
16. Crabtree
17. Hock

#44 roughyedspud

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 08:36 AM

you've missed out the england captain!



seriously i don't know why people bother leaving him out or whinging about it??? kevin sinfield is going to be in the halves for the world cup...get over it!

Edited by roughyedspud, 10 September 2013 - 08:37 AM.

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#45 7723

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 08:38 AM


seriously i don't know why people bother leaving him out or whinging about???

 

Because they are picking their 17 and not McNamara's 17.



#46 christopher

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 08:44 AM

Also I don't get why people are so quick to have a go at JJB and Ablett, JJB gave Farrell a lesson in second row play last Thursday all this having just returned from a spell on the sidelines with an injury, Ablett has always produced the goods when it's mattered for Leeds. I'm not saying they should be first choice but to dismiss them as some kind of joke selection shows either club bias or a lack of knowledge of the game.

#47 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 08:49 AM

Also I don't get why people are so quick to have a go at JJB and Ablett, JJB gave Farrell a lesson in second row play last Thursday all this having just returned from a spell on the sidelines with an injury, Ablett has always produced the goods when it's mattered for Leeds. I'm not saying they should be first choice but to dismiss them as some kind of joke selection shows either club bias or a lack of knowledge of the game.

No it doesn't.

It just shows that people think that on a whole they are nothing but slightly above average at best and not international class.

But because they're from Leeds, you obviously have to give them a cuddle and defend them at every opportunity ;)
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#48 christopher

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 08:55 AM

No it doesn't.

It just shows that people think that on a whole they are nothing but slightly above average at best and not international class.

But because they're from Leeds, you obviously have to give them a cuddle and defend them at every opportunity ;)


Give over, I wouldn't have them in the team, maybe in the squad, all I am saying is they are no where near as bad as people on here seem to think its clever to point out. As I said both totally outplayed Farrell on Thursday a player that people seem to think is good enough.

You would do the same for players from your club.

#49 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:00 AM

Give over, I wouldn't have them in the team, maybe in the squad, all I am saying is they are no where near as bad as people on here seem to think its clever to point out. As I said both totally outplayed Farrell on Thursday a player that people seem to think is good enough.

You would do the same for players from your club.

People were suggesting Briscoe earlier in the season, who I said hasn't been good enough. So no, I wouldn't and haven't.

You can't point to one game were they played well as some kind of benchmark against the other and call that an argument. What about all the average games they've had? And below average?

It's the fact that seem to get picked every year despite ever doing anything special that makes people point it out.
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#50 christopher

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:11 AM

People were suggesting Briscoe earlier in the season, who I said hasn't been good enough. So no, I wouldn't and haven't.

You can't point to one game were they played well as some kind of benchmark against the other and call that an argument. What about all the average games they've had? And below average?

It's the fact that seem to get picked every year despite ever doing anything special that makes people point it out.


The point is they haven't been nearly as bad as people point out. jJB especially has always given a good account if himself for England but for some reason it doesn't register, he has played aswell if not better than player like Ellis (for his country) but people see him as a joke along with Ablett.

You mention Briscoe I've never seen anyone suggest he simply isn't good enough just that he's had an off season (which im sure you'll agree with) Ablett and JJB have had great seasons for their club. Again I'm not saying they should be first choice for England but they are not a joke selection that people on here make out

#51 Viking Warrior

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:14 AM

surely a place must be found in the starting 17 for stefan ratchford.......fantastic utility player.
"Why is Napoleon crying ?" said one sailor to the other, "poor ###### thinks he's being exiled to st helens" came the reply.



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#52 christopher

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:22 AM

People were suggesting Briscoe earlier in the season, who I said hasn't been good enough. So no, I wouldn't and haven't.

.


Sorry just to add, that's kind of the opposite though isn't it, the question is more what you would have said if people were labelling Briscoe as average and not at all International class and a joke selection?

You would probably have issue with that even if you don't think he should be in the squad.

#53 hindle xiii

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:30 AM

The point is they haven't been nearly as bad as people point out. jJB especially has always given a good account if himself for England but for some reason it doesn't register, he has played aswell if not better than player like Ellis (for his country) but people see him as a joke along with Ablett.

You mention Briscoe I've never seen anyone suggest he simply isn't good enough just that he's had an off season (which im sure you'll agree with) Ablett and JJB have had great seasons for their club. Again I'm not saying they should be first choice for England but they are not a joke selection that people on here make out

These two are also joined by Wilkin. Do you think the same about him? Irrespective of him having to play at scrum half this season.

 

(The call for him to be dropped, similar to Jones-Buchanan and Ablett, has come for a few years now, before Jon had his stint at 7.)


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#54 Ant

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:30 AM

JJB and Ablett are joke selections

Both are good club men and good Superleague players but both have shown time and time again that they aren't international class, moreover their defensive frailties have left our centres exposed time and time again at international level

FWIW I don't think Farell has been good enough or consistent enough to be picked either

#55 christopher

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:39 AM

JJB and Ablett are joke selections

Both are good club men and good Superleague players but both have shown time and time again that they aren't international class, moreover their defensive frailties have left our centres exposed time and time again at international level

FWIW I don't think Farell has been good enough or consistent enough to be picked either


Time and time again? Carl Abletts played for England 3 times and they've not lost a game with him playing.

You see Ant you're just blinkered against any Leeds player, admit it.

#56 christopher

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:52 AM

Is the fact that JJB outplayed Liam Farrell in a game last week enough to warrant his continued presence in the England team?

The answer is no, of course it isn't.


No of course it isn't (although one off games often get cited for other players credentials) and if you read what I've posted I wouldn't have him in the team, its the 'joke selection' comments I have issue with.

#57 Ant

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:59 AM

Time and time again? Carl Abletts played for England 3 times and they've not lost a game with him playing.

You see Ant you're just blinkered against any Leeds player, admit it.


Not in the least

Hall has to be nailed on for a wing spot
Watkins deserves a spot without a doubt
I'd take Hardacre as a back back as well
Etc etc

JJB and Ablett are also rans, nothing special
Sinfield is a legend for Leeds but is only at his best for Enland at 9 - and we have better 9s than him and as has been pointed out - he WILL be playing for England so almost certainly at 6

I think Burrows is the reason why Leeds won the final last year

#58 christopher

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 10:06 AM

Not in the least

Hall has to be nailed on for a wing spot
Watkins deserves a spot without a doubt
I'd take Hardacre as a back back as well
Etc etc

JJB and Ablett are also rans, nothing special
Sinfield is a legend for Leeds but is only at his best for Enland at 9 - and we have better 9s than him and as has been pointed out - he WILL be playing for England so almost certainly at 6

I think Burrows is the reason why Leeds won the final last year


It's Burrow, and you are wrong, Sinfield is the reason we won the title last year his GF performance was immense.

You take back the time and time again comments about Ablett? Who had been a vet very important player for Leeds over the last few years.

#59 RSN

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 10:16 AM

Also I don't get why people are so quick to have a go at JJB and Ablett, JJB gave Farrell a lesson in second row play last Thursday all this having just returned from a spell on the sidelines with an injury, Ablett has always produced the goods when it's mattered for Leeds. I'm not saying they should be first choice but to dismiss them as some kind of joke selection shows either club bias or a lack of knowledge of the game.


They are dismissed as joke selections as they should be no where near the squad, yet they always seem to appear.

People I'd rather have playing at second row than them two are: Danny Kirmond, Sean O Loughlin, Ben Westwood, Gareth Ellis, Brett Ferres, Joe Westerman, Ben Currie, John Bateman, Elliot Whitehead, Liam Farrell, Sam Burgess, Gareth Hock, Liam Watts, Ben Harrison.

It's not just Ablett and JJB, I consider Wilkin to be as much as a joke selection. They are solid club players yes but just do not have international quality about them. Then again, I must be the one with club bias blinding me in this debate.

#60 roughyedspud

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 12:55 PM

wilkins career has been horribly mismanaged imo...hes a ball playing loose forward every day of the week......not a 2nd rower,scrumhalf etc....


rant over

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