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England's backs


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159 replies to this topic

#121 Gruff

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 07:56 AM

Smith is almost universally recognised as the world's best hooker and one of the greatest hookers of all time, so I think you're a bit wide of the mark on that point.

 

I also think the Australian second row is much stronger than ours (assuming that Sam Burgess plays prop or lock).

 True, but this year he has been ok - not the superstar of old.

 

Too much emphasise is being placed on "names".  Slater, Smith, Cronk have been good this year, but not "the best" by a long shot, and by no means better than any of the players mentioned.



#122 Gruff

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 08:00 AM

Here's the list of second rowers from our current Elite Squad:

 

Westwood, Ablett, Wilkin, JJB, Ellis, Farrell, Tickle.

 

I think that compares unfavourably with

 

Aus - Bird, Myles, Lewis, Thaiday, Watmough, Parker, Papali, James

 

and

 

NZ - SBW, Pritchard, Proctor, Eastwood, Harris, Mannering

 

From the Aus team only Watmough, Parker and maybe Papali have been good this year, with only Parker being outstanding

 

Thaiday has been terrible - him even being mentioned is down to his name and not his standard this season.

Bird and Lewis have been decent enough, but not done anything that the likes of Ellis, Westwood, Ferres, Kirmond and Farrell wouldn't have done.

 

And from the NZ team only SBW has been top drawer - the other have been average at best.



#123 roughyedspud

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 08:03 AM

"An absolute shower of a side"?! You're definitely just trolling now.


trolling?? yeah ok

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#124 7723

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 08:19 AM

From the Aus team only Watmough, Parker and maybe Papali have been good this year, with only Parker being outstanding

 

Thaiday has been terrible - him even being mentioned is down to his name and not his standard this season.

Bird and Lewis have been decent enough, but not done anything that the likes of Ellis, Westwood, Ferres, Kirmond and Farrell wouldn't have done.

 

And from the NZ team only SBW has been top drawer - the other have been average at best.

 

I think you are being unfair to Bird there. He has had a great season and a brilliant SOO series. He has just won the Brad Fittler medal for NSW player of the series. I think he is a world class player.



#125 roughyedspud

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 08:26 AM

aye he's played well this season

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#126 GeordieSaint

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 09:31 AM

I'd go with:

 

1. S Tomkins

2. Charnley

3. Watkins

4. Cudjoe

5. Hall

6. Widdop

7. Chase

8. G Burgess

9. Sinfield

10. Graham

11. Hock

12. S Burgess

13. O'Loughlin

 

14. Lunt

15. Crabtree

16. Hill

17. Westwood

 

Also in the squad: Jones-Bishop, Crooks, M Smith, T Burgess, Mossop, Ferres, Roby


Edited by GeordieSaint, 12 September 2013 - 09:31 AM.

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#127 7723

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 09:51 AM

I'd go with:

 

1. S Tomkins

2. Charnley

3. Watkins

4. Cudjoe

5. Hall

6. Widdop

7. Chase

8. G Burgess

9. Sinfield

10. Graham

11. Hock

12. S Burgess

13. O'Loughlin

 

14. Lunt

15. Crabtree

16. Hill

17. Westwood

 

Also in the squad: Jones-Bishop, Crooks, M Smith, T Burgess, Mossop, Ferres, Roby

 

That looks a good team. I personally would swap Hill with Mossop and Sinfield with McIllorum.



#128 faz'_nose

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 09:54 AM

I'd go with:

1. S Tomkins
2. Charnley
3. Watkins
4. Cudjoe
5. Hall
6. Widdop
7. Chase
8. G Burgess
9. Sinfield
10. Graham
11. Hock
12. S Burgess
13. O'Loughlin

14. Lunt
15. Crabtree
16. Hill
17. Westwood

Also in the squad: Jones-Bishop, Crooks, M Smith, T Burgess, Mossop, Ferres, Roby

If McNamara went with that side (and squad) I'd be ecstatic.

Edit: If you know McNamara, can you 'have a word'?

Edited by faz'_nose, 12 September 2013 - 09:56 AM.


#129 wonky

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 10:02 AM

He's playing whether you like it or not. If he's at 9 his flaws get less exposed at Hooker.

If I was choosing my team I'd have Widdop at 6, Brough at 7 with Lunt starting at 9 interchanging with Danny Houghton.

But we have to be realistic here.

i think thats about the best posible set up. but with brough a definate no go i would probably put tomkins at 7 with somebody a little more reliable as a defensive fullback. probably go for hardaker or lomax. as for hooker, if its anyone other than lunt and houghton interchanging then it will sum mcnamara up completely as a coach who seems to have his favourites
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#130 roughyedspud

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 10:11 AM

Mcnamarra has played with the same 1,6,7,9 spine (tomkins,sinfield,chase,roby) in every game possible.....barring injury thats not going to change with only 1 warm up game before the world cup..

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#131 GeordieSaint

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 10:14 AM

That looks a good team. I personally would swap Hill with Mossop and Sinfield with McIllorum.

 

I'd play Hill as he makes good yards and has better offloading abilities to Mossop. As for Sinfield, the only reason he'd be at hooker is McNamara will play him as captain plus we need a goal kicker. He's too slow for halfback so hooker is the only place he'd have a position to help control the game.

 

If McNamara went with that side (and squad) I'd be ecstatic.

Edit: If you know McNamara, can you 'have a word'?

 

Haha I have actually met him. Watched one of the 2004 Ashes Series matches with him in a bar in Gran Canaria. Decent bloke!


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#132 faz'_nose

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 10:34 AM

I'd play Hill as he makes good yards and has better offloading abilities to Mossop. As for Sinfield, the only reason he'd be at hooker is McNamara will play him as captain plus we need a goal kicker. He's too slow for halfback so hooker is the only place he'd have a position to help control the game.
 

 
Haha I have actually met him. Watched one of the 2004 Ashes Series matches with him in a bar in Gran Canaria. Decent bloke!


In that case, reignite your old 'friendship' and get it sorted. ;-)

#133 brooza

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 10:43 AM

Haha I have actually met him. Watched one of the 2004 Ashes Series matches with him in a bar in Gran Canaria. Decent bloke!

In that case, reignite your old 'friendship' and get it sorted. ;-)

Also, see if you can get his shoes for me...


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#134 christopher

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 12:34 PM

Mcnamarra has played with the same 1,6,7,9 spine (tomkins,sinfield,chase,roby) in every game possible.....barring injury thats not going to change with only 1 warm up game before the world cup..


Apart from the last game where Myler partnered Sinfield.

#135 roughyedspud

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 12:42 PM

chase was on the bench...irrc chase came on for roby & sinfield went to 9 and myler & chase in tbe halves....


makes sense to try some options in a mid year hit out

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#136 GaryO

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 01:06 PM

Would anyone have Tomkins at Stand off?

Up to me replying to this question there has been a total of 135 replies to the topic "England's Backs". Mr Magic's question was number 37, not one person has been troubled to comment on "Would anyone have Tomkins at stand-off", well last year I posed the question that Sam when playing full-back was very suspect under the high ball and that the Aussie's and Kiwi's would play on this frailty of his. I got pilloried for making these comments on this site, but judging by his performance on this particular aspect of his play against Leeds last week I have no reason to alter my views, I would also go as far to say that he is not the best tackler we could put in this position. Sam is too good of a player to leave out, he is devastating on attack and can cause the opposition all manner of problems, so for me yes he would have to be at stand off. I would not go along with when we have the ball he plays full back and when we are defending he plays stand off as some one suggested when I first raised the subject.

So my backs

 

Widdup/Hardacre

Charnley

Watkins

Reed

Hall 

Tomkins

Burrow

 

with Chase or McGuire on the bench


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#137 wonky

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 01:18 PM

Up to me replying to this question there has been a total of 135 replies to the topic "England's Backs". Mr Magic's question was number 37, not one person has been troubled to comment on "Would anyone have Tomkins at stand-off", well last year I posed the question that Sam when playing full-back was very suspect under the high ball and that the Aussie's and Kiwi's would play on this frailty of his. I got pilloried for making these comments on this site, but judging by his performance on this particular aspect of his play against Leeds last week I have no reason to alter my views, I would also go as far to say that he is not the best tackler we could put in this position. Sam is too good of a player to leave out, he is devastating on attack and can cause the opposition all manner of problems, so for me yes he would have to be at stand off. I would not go along with when we have the ball he plays full back and when we are defending he plays stand off as some one suggested when I first raised the subject.
So my backs

Widdup/Hardacre
Charnley
Watkins
Reed
Hall
Tomkins
Burrow

with Chase or McGuire on the bench

reed has been ruled out
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#138 GaryO

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 01:26 PM

reed has been ruled out

Ok then, which ever Widdup or Hardacre at Full Back the other at Centre, 


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#139 7723

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 01:30 PM

Ok then, which ever Widdup or Hardacre at Full Back the other at Centre, 

 

Widdop is a standoff.



#140 GaryO

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 01:46 PM

Widdop is a standoff.

Correct me if I'm wrong but did he not play full back at Leigh Sports Village for England in the last 4 Nations?


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