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when did we go soft?


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#41 gavin7094

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 04:09 PM

It does not make it true because some believe it either.
One of the best players in the World would be in the top three-five players in his position in the World.
I do not believe Sinfield is one of the top five stand offs in the World.
Hard to equate that to one of the best players in the World.
 
The fact he was even nominated and then gifted the "Golden Boot" award by a panel of unnamed Judges carries little or no substance with many League fans.
 
Good solid player? for sure, great Clubman that gives his all? undoubted.
One of the best in the World? not in the majority of fans minds.
 
I hope his selection in a pivotal position for England is not the difference between success and failure in the upcoming Tests.


How does a post about Gareth Hock end up retreading the old ground about Kevin Sinfield?
And why should we or for that matter the current Golden Boot/ Harry Sunderland winner care? If he's no good, he's certainly been deceiving an awful lot of people for an awfully long time. Do you think he uses hypnosis?

#42 RSN

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 06:10 PM

It does not make it true because some believe it either.
One of the best players in the World would be in the top three-five players in his position in the World.
I do not believe Sinfield is one of the top five stand offs in the World.
Hard to equate that to one of the best players in the World.

The fact he was even nominated and then gifted the "Golden Boot" award by a panel of unnamed Judges carries little or no substance with many League fans.

Good solid player? for sure, great Clubman that gives his all? undoubted.
One of the best in the World? not in the majority of fans minds.

I hope his selection in a pivotal position for England is not the difference between success and failure in the upcoming Tests.


+1

#43 RSN

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 06:15 PM

Would you say Cameron Smith fits your criteria for being one of the best players in the world? If so what would you say are his prominent skills that set him above others?


Cameron Smith is the best player in the world in my opinion.

The thing is with Cameron Smith is that every single thing he does is a bit better than most players. His running from dummy half is done at exactly at the right time. He has the ability to know what ball to pass or when to scoot or when to kick in pretty much every game. His disruption from Hooker is better than any player I've ever seen in the history of the game and by some distance.

Smith is just it's hard to explain. He doesn't have the X Factor that Inglis, Slater Tomkins and Barba have it's just he does everything right and on a consistent basis. I've never seen a player be able to control a game from number 9, usually it's a player wearing the 6 or 7 jersey.

The fact he has been in is it 7 consecutive world dream teams countless NRL dream teams, a guarantee starter for Aus despite the likes of Farah making nearly 60 tackles in an origin game is just a testament to how good he really is.

#44 boxhead

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:19 AM

What RSN said.

I have been away and could not post.

Cameron Smith is regarded by most good Judges as the best Hooker in the game for the last seven years. 

He is acknowledged as one of the best players in the game at all levels, certainly in the top handful of players in the World.

 

 
While Sinfield is a good solid player and influential at Club level, he has been widely ineffective at Test level.
 
Sir Kevin has been hotly debated in the last few years as to whether he should even be in the Test squad, but since the England Coach has made him Captain it ends that debate, only the best of the best or Test certainties should be made Captain IMO, at 33 years of age with a patchy Test career making Sinfield Captain was a big risk that may be England's weakest Link in the upcoming WC.
 
We shall see I guess.

Edited by AndyCapp, 07 October 2013 - 08:26 AM.


#45 7723

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:57 AM

Cameron Smith is the best player in the world in my opinion.

The thing is with Cameron Smith is that every single thing he does is a bit better than most players. His running from dummy half is done at exactly at the right time. He has the ability to know what ball to pass or when to scoot or when to kick in pretty much every game. His disruption from Hooker is better than any player I've ever seen in the history of the game and by some distance.

Smith is just it's hard to explain. He doesn't have the X Factor that Inglis, Slater Tomkins and Barba have it's just he does everything right and on a consistent basis. I've never seen a player be able to control a game from number 9, usually it's a player wearing the 6 or 7 jersey.

The fact he has been in is it 7 consecutive world dream teams countless NRL dream teams, a guarantee starter for Aus despite the likes of Farah making nearly 60 tackles in an origin game is just a testament to how good he really is.

 

I fully agree with this.



#46 Konkrete

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 10:20 PM

Cameron Smith is the best player in the world in my opinion.

The thing is with Cameron Smith is that every single thing he does is a bit better than most players. His running from dummy half is done at exactly at the right time. He has the ability to know what ball to pass or when to scoot or when to kick in pretty much every game. His disruption from Hooker is better than any player I've ever seen in the history of the game and by some distance.

Smith is just it's hard to explain. He doesn't have the X Factor that Inglis, Slater Tomkins and Barba have it's just he does everything right and on a consistent basis. I've never seen a player be able to control a game from number 9, usually it's a player wearing the 6 or 7 jersey.

The fact he has been in is it 7 consecutive world dream teams countless NRL dream teams, a guarantee starter for Aus despite the likes of Farah making nearly 60 tackles in an origin game is just a testament to how good he really is.

Interesting isn't it. Smith is a top drawer player, but when asked to explain why, it's not that easy, and it all gets a bit intangible. Also if Smith gets picked for dream teams or accolades it's right and supports his skills, but Sinfield winning the Golden Boot is somehow wrong.

I'm not looking to shoot you down, what my point is is that Sinfield and Smith share a lot of the same qualities but are perhaps judged differently. Influence, presence, leadership and crucial decision making are hard to measure and easy to overlook, so your point about Farrah is a good one. I guarantee that when the time comes you'll be looking to take Sir Kev out of the game at the earlist opportunity.
Integrity is shown when no-one is looking.

#47 bobbruce

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 10:28 PM

Interesting isn't it. Smith is a top drawer player, but when asked to explain why, it's not that easy, and it all gets a bit intangible. Also if Smith gets picked for dream teams or accolades it's right and supports his skills, but Sinfield winning the Golden Boot is somehow wrong.

I'm not looking to shoot you down, what my point is is that Sinfield and Smith share a lot of the same qualities but are perhaps judged differently. Influence, presence, leadership and crucial decision making are hard to measure and easy to overlook, so your point about Farrah is a good one. I guarantee that when the time comes you'll be looking to take Sir Kev out of the game at the earlist opportunity.


Well said

#48 Daltoni

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 11:52 PM

please don't pick hock for England he might give a couple of penaltys away, it just isn't the done thing in England, sod that! lets stick it up em and give it to em rough n ready, did the aussies worry when les boyd and the likes were roughing us up? simple answer- no, its world cup- its war - its do or die-nice gets get hurt and the good die young- step up hock - step up james graham - step up any player who cares about smashing the opposition, am glad frank Bruno types like crabtree and jjb are not in contention, they may worry more about damaging their tv persona rather than the other team.

Great post, I agree with most of what your saying, I think Michael McIlorum has been picked for the same reason, hard as nails! (Thought Lunt might have pipped him) Problem is when you've got Westwood, Hock, Mcillorum and O’Loughlin in the same team the penalties could start racking up! Nothing wrong with a bit of biff though, we wont win a world cup without it. Cant wait for the 26th!



#49 terrywebbisgod

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 07:37 AM

Interesting isn't it. Smith is a top drawer player, but when asked to explain why, it's not that easy, and it all gets a bit intangible. Also if Smith gets picked for dream teams or accolades it's right and supports his skills, but Sinfield winning the Golden Boot is somehow wrong.

I'm not looking to shoot you down, what my point is is that Sinfield and Smith share a lot of the same qualities but are perhaps judged differently. Influence, presence, leadership and crucial decision making are hard to measure and easy to overlook, so your point about Farrah is a good one. I guarantee that when the time comes you'll be looking to take Sir Kev out of the game at the earlist opportunity.

Spot on.


Once you have tasted excellence,you cannot go back to mediocrity.

#50 boxhead

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 08:26 AM

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Cam Smith is a Hooker that is the benchmark for others to aspire to, his reading of the game, distribution, kicking and runs from dummy half  and control of a game are the benchmark.

He is widely regarded as the best at his craft and is a certain selection at Club, State and Test level.

 

Sinfield is not regarded by many as the best player in his position, in fact he has played in several different positions and is not the number one player in any of those spots, his selection at Test level has not always been a given, he is a utility player that complements the Leeds team in a special way but this has not translated to Test level in the same way.

His best skills are Goal kicking, and leadership.

He seems like a pretty good bloke and represents the game well.

Will he be the game breaker or deciding factor for England in the coming World Cup? I would be very surprised unless it comes down to Goals


Edited by AndyCapp, 08 October 2013 - 08:31 AM.





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