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26/10/13: World Cup Game 1 - Australia v England

Sat 26th Oct 2.30pm BBC1

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Poll: Who will win? (111 member(s) have cast votes)

Who will win?

  1. Australia by 13 points or more (44 votes [40.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 40.00%

  2. Australia by 7 to 12 points (18 votes [16.36%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.36%

  3. Australia by 1 to 6 points (3 votes [2.73%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.73%

  4. Draw (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  5. England by 1 to 6 points (22 votes [20.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.00%

  6. England by 7 to 12 points (17 votes [15.45%])

    Percentage of vote: 15.45%

  7. England by 13 points or more (6 votes [5.45%])

    Percentage of vote: 5.45%

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#701 Kenilworth Tiger

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:16 PM

Well ive never been a massive fan of Sinfield on the International stage but I thought he was one of, if not the, stand out performer today. I'm genuinely not sure you can pick fault with any part of his game which can't be said for many others.

Silly penalties
Stupid missed tackle on Slater
Aus being more clinical

They were 3 reasons for the defeat today in my opinion.

That said there were many many positives - we are genuinely not that far behind the Aussies. They are beatable
Now then, it's a race between Sandie....and Fairburn....and the little man is in........yeees he's in.

I, just like those Castleford supporters felt that the ball should have gone to David Plange but he put the bit betwen his teeth...and it was a try

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The real Mick Gledhill is what you see on here, a Bradford fan ........, but deep down knows that Bradford are just not good enough to challenge the likes of Leeds & St Helens.


#702 redjonn

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:22 PM

Sinfield was not the reason we lost today, anyone whom thinks its all down to Sinfield has a serious pre-deposed bias.  It wasn't Sinfield that made all the knock-on's, gave away penalties like high shots or silly holding on, or poor play the balls.... Some of them where given by the hero's like Burgess that cost us valuable field position as we gained momentum... It wasn't Sinfield that failed to handle a high ball well enough all-be-it a difficult one that led to a try nor was it Sinfield that failed to put pressure on the Aussie kicker that most times allowed him loads of time,   it wasn't Sinfield that failed to organize themselves and allowed the ref to cause a problem at the scrum on half time and players not getting into position or allowing themselves to be out of position at a crucial time.     Yes Sinfield missed a couple of goal kicks but other that that he did OK even if he didn't illuminate his every play.  In the first 20mins when we where on top wasn't Sinfield playing in the position that he gets criticized for England yet when Widdop was on we where losing our way... OK I personally may prefer Widdop but I can't put the blame on Sinfield like some numskulls in this forum whom seemed to be more focused on him and willing him to fail and deeming him at fault if he didn't side step two players, twirl around another two as they came in and went on a blistering run and then finished off with a 60 yard cross field pass missing out the other 9 Aussies to create a try.... that of course after he'f thrown the whole crowd a dummy...  you could argue that another player may have caused more problems for more than the 20 mins we did but even that player who in fans heads that have an issue with whomever they don't agree with will always be prefect and have a prefect game would have changes the penalties and mistakes that gave up easy field position.

 

Having said all that I did think England played better than expected at times but the errors made it easier for the Aussie's than it could have been given England's positives..


Edited by redjonn, 26 October 2013 - 08:25 PM.


#703 MamaKangaroo

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:22 PM

Charnley could have gone under the posts! Little things again!


He couldn't. He started to but the Aussies where coming across to stop him. Don't know if you could tell that from the TV. Making sure it was down was the right thing to do.

#704 Railway End

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:53 PM

I felt a bit of deju vu today with how we played against the Aussies in the 4 nations a couple of years ago.

 

Chase and Sinfield didn't work then and aren't working now.  I've not watched the game back yet, but I can only recall Chase taking the ball to the line once when he put Ferres into a hole early in the game.  I don't remember Sinfield taking the line on from first man.  Everything through the halves is very easy to defend against, they know what's coming, therefore the outside backs are working off scraps.

 

For Cas, Chase's key attribute is his ability to engage defenders before releasing someone into space  or making a gap for himself.  For England it appears he is playing to a strict game plan where he operates almost solely on the left and his job is to simply draw and pass.  At club level he operates on both sides and demands the ball at nearly every play.  I can't believe for a minute that once Rangi pulls on a white shirt he doesn't want to try a sidestep, doesn't want to run across the field dummying to inside runners, doesn't want to do a chip over or grubber through the line.  If McNamara feels that Chase's normal off the cuff game is too risky in the big games (and I agree with him) then why does he play him? Certainly not for his defensive abilities.

 

For me Sinfield was the better out of the two but is too slow for an international half and does not take the line on enough.  The Aussies know he will pass so can automatically drift wide giving our centres and wingers no space.  Thurston and Cronk both mixed their games up well today and easily outplayed their opposites.  In my opinion they were the only real difference between the teams.

 

The Answer?  I'm not sure with the players we have.  To give Chase a free reign will probably work against Ireland & Fiji but not against the big two.  At the risk of going back in time and playing people out of position, I'd maybe put O'Loughlin at 6 and Widdop at 7 with Sinfield at 13.  If they were in the squad I'd have had Brough and Smith.

 

As lots of others have mentioned, if we had cut out 50% of the penalties and held the ball better we would have won today as the Aussies didn't look anywhere near full speed.


Edited by Railway End, 26 October 2013 - 08:55 PM.

"Rugby League is rugby in the simplest form in the sense that it's about great defence, great tackling technique, good handling, good passing, catching and great kicking."

 

 Stuart Lancaster - England Rugby Union Head Coach - October 2013


#705 Just Browny

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:54 PM

The only negative I'd say about Sinfield was his goalkicking. He'd never miss those in a big game for Leeds. That was hard to take as a fan of a club who has seen him bang over much harder kicks under massive pressure.

As a halfback I thought he did fine and I can't think of many eligible players who would have been better. England's kicking game was far better than I've seen in many years actually.

I can confirm 30+ less sales for Scotland vs Italy at Workington, after this afternoons test purchase for the Tonga match, £7.50 is extremely reasonable, however a £2.50 'delivery' fee for a walk in purchase is beyond taking the mickey, good luck with that, it's cheaper on the telly.


#706 redjonn

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:55 PM

I think that was put into practise today.

 

It was... but it doesn't help his argument. Always reminds my of what one of the great long standing winning coach's in American football used to say... "the best quarter back is always the one that doesn't play to many fans,,,, particularly the most audible".      When pressed he says... because he's the player that never makes mistakes, he can't he ain't playing and so in the dream like world of the fan the one whom doesn't play is always perfect.



#707 Dave T

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:19 PM

just catching up, but absolutely stunned anybody would suggest dropping Westwood.

Now if it was Mossop(terrible), T.Burgess(dire), or G.Burgess(liability at times) I could get it.

Add Graham andO'loughlin and we'll be ok.

#708 Fax1978

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:20 PM

TBH i was more than impressed with eng performance today a little less errors and penalties there was a win there begging to be wrestled from the grasp of aus.

Hill was a handful and the ctrs played much better, especially defensively, than I ever expected. I think the only changes may be T Burgess dropped for Graham who will start with hill, oloughlin to start with ferres on the bench and Albert not in the 17.

All in all a win would have been great but it's a good start and I think our next big test will be Fiji I bet they give the aus a real good game.

#709 Daltoni

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:22 PM

[quote name="Dave T" post="2818222" timestamp="1382822383"]



Tom Burgess dire, are you for real, what game were u watching?


Edited by Daltoni, 26 October 2013 - 10:42 PM.


#710 Derwent

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:23 PM

Positives - the inexperienced lads like Hill, Watkins & big George stood up very well

Negatives - too many basic errors, some poor discipline, a bit one dimensional

Was disappointed with Sam Burgess today he was pretty woeful - the only 2 things of note he did were the shot on Thaiday and the missed tackle on Slater. Big improvement needed. He seemed to spend the first 30 mins at right centre, maybe it was a ploy to combat Inglis.

Sinfield's tactical kicking was poor, but having said that I noticed that all kickers today were struggling for any distance and direction on the ball.

All in all a disappointing end after a bright start, but I didn't think either team played all that well and there's improvement to come in both of them. The question is can we go up the extra gears that the Aussies will undoubtedly find ?

Workington Town. Then. Now. Always.


#711 Dave T

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:30 PM

[quote name="Daltoni" post="2818225" timestamp="1382822543"]

[quote name="Dave T" post="2818222" timestamp="1382822383"]

just catching up, but absolutely stunned anybody would suggest dropping Westwood.

Now if it was Mossop(terrible), T.Burgess(dire), or G.Burgess(liability at times) I could get it.

Add Graham andO'loughlin and we'll be ok.

Tom Burgess dire, are you for real, what game were u watching?[/quote]happy to be corrected as it was difficult to keep up in a stadium with no announcements, but my first impression is off the pace and he played very limited time.

Are you thinking od George, much more subjective...

#712 Dave T

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:31 PM

jeez. sort the quoting out.

#713 YCKonstantine

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:33 PM

Tom Burgess dire, are you for real, what game were u watching?

George was immense, Tom not so much.

It's time to park the camels.


#714 Just Browny

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:34 PM

Tom Burgess didn't do a great deal. That's ok, Graham will replace him. George was immense.

I can confirm 30+ less sales for Scotland vs Italy at Workington, after this afternoons test purchase for the Tonga match, £7.50 is extremely reasonable, however a £2.50 'delivery' fee for a walk in purchase is beyond taking the mickey, good luck with that, it's cheaper on the telly.


#715 TheBinman

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:36 PM

Tom burgess wasn't dire at all made some very strong carries but came up with an error and isn't at the same level as George but wasn't dire, as for George a liability? his was class today along with hill and Sam burgess. With graham and oloughlin to add to that pack Wat played today we should feel very confident

#716 Dave T

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:44 PM

Tom was a liability. George was ok in spells.

The problem is that the Burgess clan only want to get involved within 10m of the tryline.

Westwood and Ferres outplayed all three of the sunshine kids pretty easily.

#717 dkw

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:50 PM

Tom was a liability. George was ok in spells.

The problem is that the Burgess clan only want to get involved within 10m of the tryline.

Westwood and Ferres outplayed all three of the sunshine kids pretty easily.

I'm not sure which game you watched but I can definitely remember g burgess making plenty of yards from within our own 20 quite a few times, as well as s burgess. Westwood was a liability in the tackle, but excellent with ball.

#718 TheBinman

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:53 PM

Tom was a liability. George was ok in spells.

The problem is that the Burgess clan only want to get involved within 10m of the tryline.

Westwood and Ferres outplayed all three of the sunshine kids pretty easily.


Westwood showed today he is a international class forward but the errors and ill discipline let him and the team down has to cut it out, ferres was solid all round and went alright but dint outshine the burgess clan as you say. Sam put in a very good performance not his best but was still very good and out performed ferres, George offerd great go forward good yards found his front all the time leaving markers on the floor allowing robes to get out and as soon as he went off and Tom came on the game changed.

#719 frombanginfront

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:59 PM

I thoroughly enjoyed that game, even if it spoke volumes for why the 2-ref system is streets ahead of what we're forced to look at in this tournament, and it wasn't the result I wanted. Perenara had a fair game, for what he saw of it at least. England failed to create opportunities in the first half, where they had enough possession in order to do so, and the ref also failed to punish Australia for a myriad forward passes. Whilst that "try" was nothing of the sort.

 

I love Souths, and I'm a fan of the Burgess boys, but Tom in both games and interviews is always quick to show us that he certainly isn't the brains in the family. He does stupid things all the time, and as dangerous as he can be he is unlikely to ever be the player George is. McNamara would have been better off playing him in a short burst, or having Luke there instead. Or anyone else, for that matter.



#720 Dave T

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 10:00 PM

I'm not sure which game you watched but I can definitely remember g burgess making plenty of yards from within our own 20 quite a few times, as well as s burgess. Westwood was a liability in the tackle, but excellent with ball.

i look forward to watching it back, but the Burgess boys never sppear to sprint onto the ball in their own half.
Id rather have the grafters than the glory hunters, but thays just me.




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