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#41 chrisl1

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 11:10 PM

The interesting part is who goes with London?

I thought at one time it woulld be Bradford, but lately the RFL seem to have given a lot of vocal support to them. If you held a gun to my head i would say its a toss up between Wakefield and Widnes.

As VW says there is no reason why Widnes should not be in Super League  next season. 


Edited by chrisl1, 24 October 2013 - 11:16 PM.


#42 superten

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 10:01 AM

I am in the camp for a smaller super league but only in return for more international matches. If we take super league down to 12 playing 22 weekly rounds plus the magic week end to make 23 , Top six make playoffs round 1 3rd v 6th and 4th v 5th 1st and 2nd getting a bye. Round two 1st v lowest rank team and second v the other with the final between the two winners . So that's 26 weeks for the league instead of the current 31. We could then use those weeks for a European  international competition. A six team five week comp either played in one country which is my own preferred option or spread through out. Look how the world cup is taking off this year we need to build on this . We failed to build on Wales success in 1995 and Ireland in 2008 lets not do the same after this world cup . Another point on world cup as much as im looking forward to it I do think the quarter final venues are poor. Only the DW STADIUM good enough for quarters in my eyes. If they wanted a quarter final in wales it should have been at Cardiff or Swansea. For West Yorkshire it should have been at Huddersfield.  I would have looked at Reebox Bolton as an option for a quarter final and the KC in Hull .Also would have given London two group matches one involving Australia and one involving New Zealand .  So back to European cup go for 2015 along with smaller super league. Let Wales host it say two pools of three where teams play every team from the other pool for three matches . Top two in each pool make semis and then a final so five games.  


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#43 Steve Slater

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 09:19 PM

Brilliantly put.

 

The blood of the sport will not just be on the hands of the RFL but also the hands of the stubborn fans of Featherstone, Halifax, Leigh and their ilk who simply would not man up and move on.

I don't think it's the fault of clubs like Featherstone, Leigh and Halifax that London are struggling, but rather the big guns in Super League!

They are very good at saying that certain small town clubs should move aside to let them in Super League, then saying that certain clubs can't be relegated- That's artificial! If they can be artificial to put the smaller club's noses out of joint, why can't they be artificial in the case of London and let them have more of the Sky money so they can attract the best players and compete at the very top? The reason is that they would have to give something up and maybe not win as many trophies if they were to make the Broncos successful.

For years they have been happy to let them squander at the foot of Super League, but they don't want them to be successful in case it's at their expense instead of clubs like Fev, Fax & Leigh!



#44 Segovia Carpet

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 09:26 PM

why not castleford or salford? widnes are on a secure financial footing mate and are continuing to build. we will be in super league without a doubt.


So will Salford VW

#45 EastLondonMike

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 12:49 PM

Capital challenge next year will not feature the Broncos..

 

http://www.skolarsrl...enge-opponenta/

 

Doesn't bode well for the 2014 season at all.


Edited by EastLondonMike, 01 November 2013 - 12:49 PM.

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#46 GIANTSTRIDES

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 02:11 PM

So the plan is to abandon London after what 35 years or whatever it has been, and bring in a system to prop up teams who have had 100 years and are still permanently always teetering , or at best struggling. ( and yes that would include the Giants if they were in that catagory )

 

Has the RFL sounded out Sky to see how they feel about dropping London, Probably not It's not really their style to think ahead.

 

If super league goes down to 12, why can the Super league clubs not pass the "two clubs money" on to London,

not long ago they were going ( and rightly so IMO) to buy Bradford to keep them alive, which i think is what gave the RFL a nudge that Super league can survive without the RFL if it has too, Dont think the opposite would apply, So the theorists about Bradford supporting The RFL out of nescessity could be short lived.

 

London is worth saving for me, and to talk of dropping Catalan is madness, Still what do they matter , when you can always tootle down the road and watch a good local derby, even if it is at a low level.


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#47 zorquif

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 02:22 PM

I think there should be an SL team in London, but arguing that clubs up north are teetering after 100 years and london have only had 35 years to teeter seems a little hollow.

 

Absolutely shouldn't drop catalans, but surely we need to now be looking into how to make their sucess into a) international sucess and B) a better league in France? How long were NZ/Auckland warriors  about until NZ started competing? Or did they always because of their boys playing in the NRL?

 

You last sentence doesn't make sense to me. London have had 35 years to improve rugby league in the uk. Have they? If not, what evidence is there to say that they will in the next 35?

 

I know that seems a little negative, but I am struggling to see the answers. To give them three clubs' worth of money would seem unfair to the northern teeterers (if you will), but I definitely think that they should get a london weighting - and I don't think 10% would suffice. I can't see what else you can do to attract the stars - I mean plenty of young lads snap up the chance to move to london, why not league players?



#48 RugbyLeagueGeek

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:15 PM

I mean plenty of young lads snap up the chance to move to london, why not league players?

Because the job market dictates that the best Rugby League jobs (and better pay - i.e. the money goes alot further) are not in London - they're up north. This is why the salary cap and share of tv money probably needs to be around 3x what it is now for London to ever have a successful RL team.



#49 Mushy

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:18 PM

This is a very odd thread. It suggests the RFL have a plan, and are capable of closing down, propping up or maybe even setting clubs up in the first place. I can't see any evidence of their ability to do any of these.

The Broncos were in SL for a couple of reasons - the Global News Corp plan in 1996 thought it might be a good idea, but mainly because some independent businessmen put their money on the line to run the club in the top league. Since then the Broncos have been like most other clubs - they stayed in the league on merit and because people still wanted to put their own money into them. If they aren't around next year it's because no one wants to fund them any more and that's the same story you will find in any professional sport. Clubs come and go, and sometimes fellow clubs or the overall organisation help them out from time to time.

For better or for worse there isn't any grand plan to retreat to the heartlands or expand SL elsewhere because this suggests a level of organisational competence or funding hitherto not seen in the sport.

Personally I think a rubbish Broncos don't do the game any favours and getting a successful business plan together to make them good seems tough.

Meanwhile to claim elsewhere in this thread that SL will diminish or become part time is crazy talk for me. There are enough successful businessmen and philanthropists in the game to make sure this doesn't happen. There aren't enough to go around yet so as ever some clubs will do well and others won't - that's professional sport. A lot of the current internal disputes are sabre rattling and powers struggles rather than a sign of impending doom. And again this happens in every sport from time to time.

And regardless, aren't we having a wonderful World Cup? Cheer up folks!!!

#50 zorquif

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:34 PM

Because the job market dictates that the best Rugby League jobs (and better pay - i.e. the money goes alot further) are not in London - they're up north. This is why the salary cap and share of tv money probably needs to be around 3x what it is now for London to ever have a successful RL team.

 

I am all for London having an increased salary cap, but you can really think it should be three times the salary cap for teams up north? How come the London wieghting isn't that much for other professions (which do see northerners going down south)?

 

EDIT: Sorry, just read what you said again - it's not JUST the money, but the better jobs being up north. I take it this means winning teams too. But would making London able to just completely buy their way to the top whilst also denying other clubs (e.g. Salford) not be a bit, well, wrong?


Edited by zorquif, 01 November 2013 - 03:37 PM.


#51 EastLondonMike

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:41 PM

Get someone in charge of the club who knows what they're doing. thats the best place to start.


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#52 nadera78

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:44 PM

Well, the RFL bought Odsal for Bradford and they found a saviour for Salford, let's see if they have anything for London.

 

It's not looking good though. Might have to play the Lotto tonight.


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#53 RugbyLeagueGeek

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 04:12 PM

I am all for London having an increased salary cap, but you can really think it should be three times the salary cap for teams up north? How come the London wieghting isn't that much for other professions (which do see northerners going down south)?

 

EDIT: Sorry, just read what you said again - it's not JUST the money, but the better jobs being up north. I take it this means winning teams too. But would making London able to just completely buy their way to the top whilst also denying other clubs (e.g. Salford) not be a bit, well, wrong?

I'm no expert on economics, but with house prices in London over 300% higher than equivalents in the north coupled with the lack of local talent in sufficient numbers to draw upon (compared to say Leeds which has Bradford, Wakey, Cas etc on its doorstep), I would guess that you would need around 3x the money to entice quality players to enable you to run a successful SL club in London.

 

Whether it is 'fair' all depends on your perspective and the definition of 'fair'. Some people think that London should have the same proportion of TV money as the northern clubs to allow a level playing field. But given the economical issues and lack of players that London have to contend with, it isn't anything like a level playing field. I.e. £1.8 million in London will likely buy the same quality of team that £0.6 million would up north.

 

Regardless of whether it is 'fair' or not, I cannot see London ever being successful as long as they essentially have to compete with one hand tied behind their back. I've heard many people argue that if you're expanding your business into new areas, then greater money needs to be ploughed into the venture to ensure its success. This would certainly need to be the case with London.



#54 Viking Warrior

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 04:42 PM

So will Salford VW



all the lancashire clubs will mate, i am sick of hearing the same old drivel about my club when it is just that......drivel
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#55 RLX111

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 04:45 PM

The Strange Case of the disappearing Rugby Club ?



#56 Viking Warrior

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 04:47 PM

Well, the RFL bought Odsal for Bradford and they found a saviour for Salford, let's see if they have anything for London.
 
It's not looking good though. Might have to play the Lotto tonight.


actually mate eamon mcmanus found a saviour for salford fat nige just jumped on the band wagon, he even stole the rallying call i gave to ashley gibson on twitter....."save our salford" all the rfl have done is look after yorkshire clubs making sure they keep them in super league, i wouldn't be surprised if one day it came that they asked crusaders to fall on their proverbial sword to save wakefield.
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#57 Exiled Wiganer

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 04:52 PM

Having been down here for over 20 years, I think the only things we need to achieve in London are - sustaining the massive strides on the junior/amateur side and having enough events in London to keep league followers in the city engaged/happy. I don't think we need an SL club based here to do those things. Londoners simply don't feel attached to "London" in the same way that people in other places do. Hence, we don't need to worry about losing a "London" fan base, because it was only ever going to be an impossible dream. What the world record crowd at Wembley in 3 weeks will show, once again, is that there is massive interest in TGG, if the game is good enough.

5 big events a year, the Skolars and a Championship Broncos and all will be very well indeed.

In this week of all weeks, everything is possible!



#58 RLX111

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 05:22 PM

Having been down here for over 20 years, I think the only things we need to achieve in London are - sustaining the massive strides on the junior/amateur side and having enough events in London to keep league followers in the city engaged/happy. I don't think we need an SL club based here to do those things. Londoners simply don't feel attached to "London" in the same way that people in other places do. Hence, we don't need to worry about losing a "London" fan base, because it was only ever going to be an impossible dream. What the world record crowd at Wembley in 3 weeks will show, once again, is that there is massive interest in TGG, if the game is good enough.

5 big events a year, the Skolars and a Championship Broncos and all will be very well indeed.

In this week of all weeks, everything is possible!

just read london league taking 1900 to wembley-not all in vain -if departed.



#59 Toby Chopra

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 05:47 PM

Having been down here for over 20 years, I think the only things we need to achieve in London are - sustaining the massive strides on the junior/amateur side and having enough events in London to keep league followers in the city engaged/happy. I don't think we need an SL club based here to do those things. Londoners simply don't feel attached to "London" in the same way that people in other places do. Hence, we don't need to worry about losing a "London" fan base, because it was only ever going to be an impossible dream. What the world record crowd at Wembley in 3 weeks will show, once again, is that there is massive interest in TGG, if the game is good enough.

5 big events a year, the Skolars and a Championship Broncos and all will be very well indeed.

In this week of all weeks, everything is possible!

This.

 

As I posted on another thread, I'm a southerner with no rugby league roots, but grew up watching RL on Grandstand in the 80s, and I bet there are millions like me. Was never interested in treking a long way to see the Broncos but would be interested in a more local club, even if at a lower level. But main draw is big events a Wembley like CC and internationals. Aussies should play at Wembley every year, just like the RU team does at Twickers. Would become a regular fixture on the London sporting calendar. This World Cup has really caught peoples interest - we're bringing up 8 from Sussex for the Wembley semis - people will always turn out for elite international sport, whatever it is. Don't waste this chance RFL!



#60 GIANTSTRIDES

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 07:48 PM

How big a influence on the amatuer game have the Broncos had though. There must surely be a lot of youngsters down there that want to play at a high level but would never concider moving up north for one reason or another.

 

If they give up on London i think that could spell the end of the expansion dream, which surprise surprise is exactly what some people want.

 

It does seem extreme to give them 3 clubs money fair enough, but it may attract the right invester and set the job up right  once and for all, the finding of the right ground would be vital as well i would think.


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