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No Graham


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#41 Saintslass

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 08:26 PM

Stupid decision to leave Graham out. Simple fact, we need our best players out on the park.

 

I can see it now, battered by Australia, fail to make the final, and overall losers again.

 

Worry not, we can all then sit back and say, "But Steve Mac showed them who was boss"

 

Graham is a super player, and the Australians must be sat in their hotel peeing in their tracksuits laughing at us.

While I agree that Graham is a super player, I don't agree that it was a stupid decision to leave him out and as a Saints fan I am a big fan of James Graham as a player. However, regardless of my respect for him as a player if he acted unprofessionally then he should know without a shadow of a doubt that just because he now plays for the NRL and indeed is a super player, he cannot disrespect the coach, the team or indeed the fans by picking and choosing which rules he abides by.  This is a team sport and the team must be as one.  If they are not then they don't deserve to be in the team, either permanently or on match day. 

 

We have the cover and now the inexperienced guys have their chance to make their mark.  Jammer might have lost his place for the rest of this tournament but assuming his absence is because of discipline issues (and we have no confirmation of that of course) then that is his own fault.  If others given their opportunity shine then us fans won't care who is on the pitch so long as they put in a fab performance and, preferably, beat everyone!



#42 dkw

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 08:50 PM

OK good. So by your reckoning we should beat them this time.

I'm looking forward to it.

Where did I say that? Again, more rubbish that has nothing to do with the point. So which wum were you then.

Edited by dkw, 24 October 2013 - 08:50 PM.


#43 OMEGA

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 09:13 PM

How do you know he hasn't? Maybe the players are just thick...


He quite obviously hasn't because around 20% of his squad were out on the beer!

IMO doing it now does more damage than it saves, he should have taken Hock & Co into a room and laid into them with the biggest verbal spray they'll ever receive and it should have been done behind closed doors with no publicity and no official statements.

#44 redjonn

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 09:29 PM

And not out drinking when they aren't supposed to be, or missing training sessions. That, more than anything McNamara is doing, is why they will continue to beat us.

 

yep, you mean there more professional approach... and I'm sure the Aussie public would expect no less.   As somebody else said if the players felt the need to relax over a drink following the Italy performance then they should have asked the manager if it would be OK and the rational why. You know the mature and professional approach - a grown up discussion.    Having said that why is the answer alcohol if the need to relax and get over a performance.... has to say something about the culture, mentality and emotional intelligence if that's the only thing they know...the answer to all issues -  turn to the alcohol.



#45 Bostik Bailey

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 09:45 PM

Well if alcohol isn't the answer, you've obviously asked the wrong question :)

#46 redjonn

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 10:07 PM

Well if alcohol isn't the answer, you've obviously asked the wrong question :)

chuckle....



#47 joe elliot

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 10:16 PM

Every biography that I have read recently has stated that team bonding was lacking and that the only times they achieved anything was when they were allowed to relax. Everytime someone mentions stamping his authority, all that says to me is that Mcbannana has no authority.
It's ok being professional but it's rugby and if you feel no affinity with your team mate then your onto a loser.
It's not a club side it's an international team, they don't need to practice tackling, discipline and punctuality he should be concentrating on combinations, bonding and history of the shirt. I really hope I'm wrong but mcbannana is leading us to the biggest missed opportunity ever
waddell

#48 The Future is League

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 12:04 AM

For those saying that Graham should still play despite breaking the no alcohol rule. Can they name me a successful coach in any sport who would have tolerated a player breaking a no alcohol rule?



#49 boxhead

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 04:57 AM

Its getting plenty of coverage Downunder.

 

YOU'VE got to love England. The Poms sure know how to serve up a scandal.

All year they have been building up this Rugby League World Cup as the global sporting event of 2013 - but in the countdown to the tournament kick off, early Sunday morning Australian time, the host nation is now on the verge of imploding.

While Australia's preparations have been faultless, England are in turmoil after Canterbury's star prop James Graham was sensationally left out of England's 19-man squad named to take on Australia in the tournament opener at Millennium Stadium.

Graham's omission follows coach Steve McNamara's dramatic decision to sack Gareth Hock for breaking a team booze ban and missing a recovery season in the wake of England's shock defeat to Italy last weekend.

Hock was furious that he was the only player sent home after claiming up to seven other players had also broken the no alcohol policy the team had put in place until after the Australian game.

Hock said the players went out to drown their sorrows after their humiliating loss to Italy last weekend but instead of it bonding them together it appears to have sunk their World Cup dream.

All week there has been a guessing game going on here about who else was out on the town with Hock but so far England's team management have refused to reveal the other players involved, although it is understood they have been disciplined.

http://www.news.com....l-1226746421015



#50 zorquif

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 06:27 AM

I wonder if it is a ploy. Especially with lockers being left out (or was he out on the pop too?). We always bust our hides trying to beat the aussies in the group stages/round robin type things and then they smash us into next week in the knock out stages/finals.

 

So, do we show a bit of discipline, so what if we lose this (banking on coming secon in the group) and also rest a couple of the lads ready to be on top form in the knock outs?

 

Or maybe I am overthinking it.



#51 boxhead

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 06:32 AM

I wonder if it is a ploy. Especially with lockers being left out (or was he out on the pop too?). We always bust our hides trying to beat the aussies in the group stages/round robin type things and then they smash us into next week in the knock out stages/finals.

 

So, do we show a bit of discipline, so what if we lose this (banking on coming secon in the group) and also rest a couple of the lads ready to be on top form in the knock outs?

 

Or maybe I am overthinking it.

The Kiwis are no easybeats, I would think that you would be best trying to win every game.



#52 shrek

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 06:38 AM

He quite obviously hasn't because around 20% of his squad were out on the beer!

IMO doing it now does more damage than it saves, he should have taken Hock & Co into a room and laid into them with the biggest verbal spray they'll ever receive and it should have been done behind closed doors with no publicity and no official statements.

I'd agree it should have been dealt with behind closed doors, but, given they've been in camp for a while, we've no idea of what has and hasn't been going on so for all we know this may just have been the final straw, who knows.  Time to put it to bed for mine and start looking forward to the game.

 

With regards Graham, on last weeks form drinks scandal or not everyones places were in doubt if you ask me, so not to fussed he's not made the cut this week.



#53 hoff

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 06:43 AM

What if the whole Hockgate / Graham affair was instigated to throw off the aussies? Maybe hock was badly injured and had to withdraw and Graham picked up a knock. The Aussies would naturally head into the opening game off guard expecting a shambolic England team only for England to come out guns blazing and scythe them down like a cluster of serated terrapins.......

Either way England will win

#54 zorquif

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 06:46 AM

The Kiwis are no easybeats, I would think that you would be best trying to win every game.

 

Do you not think that NZ will win group B?



#55 XIII

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 07:00 AM

What if the whole Hockgate / Graham affair was instigated to throw off the aussies? Maybe hock was badly injured and had to withdraw and Graham picked up a knock. The Aussies would naturally head into the opening game off guard expecting a shambolic England team only for England to come out guns blazing and scythe them down like a cluster of serated terrapins.......
Either way England will win


We can live in hope!

#56 Trojan

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 07:22 AM

Completely agree, after Tompkins and Sam Burgess he was my next definite in the starting 13. Canterbury player of the year, one of the best performing props in the NRL, respected or at least highly regarded by all in the Aus squad (apart from Slater perhaps he he) and bags of experience which is what this England squad lacks. He will be massively missed and his absents is a real dent to our chances of an upset. He's so passionate when he plays and can lift any team with a good carry, IMO there is no replacement prop who can fill his boots.

this
"Your a one trick pony Trojan" - Parksider 10th March 2013

#57 Cumbrian Fanatic

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 07:23 AM

While I agree that Graham is a super player, I don't agree that it was a stupid decision to leave him out and as a Saints fan I am a big fan of James Graham as a player. However, regardless of my respect for him as a player if he acted unprofessionally then he should know without a shadow of a doubt that just because he now plays for the NRL and indeed is a super player, he cannot disrespect the coach, the team or indeed the fans by picking and choosing which rules he abides by.  This is a team sport and the team must be as one.  If they are not then they don't deserve to be in the team, either permanently or on match day. 

 

We have the cover and now the inexperienced guys have their chance to make their mark.  Jammer might have lost his place for the rest of this tournament but assuming his absence is because of discipline issues (and we have no confirmation of that of course) then that is his own fault.  If others given their opportunity shine then us fans won't care who is on the pitch so long as they put in a fab performance and, preferably, beat everyone!

Think this is the best post on this subject so far.

 

A couple of things, assuming Graham has been dropped because of the drinking and not any other reason such as injury, the rules he broke according to the press release are those agreed by the team and management, rules he presumeably agreed to abide by not those laid down. I past threads many have touted Graham as being England captain, something I would previously have agreed with. Is this how we expect a possible captain in waiting to behave? or would we expect them to set an example? 

 

The above said, even if we beat the Aussies, I would expect Graham to be back in the side for the following games. Lets all hope the players make his inclusion difficult by playing so well and the Graham justifies any future selection by being the ulitimate player both on and off the pitch.


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#58 Exiled Wiganer

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 07:24 AM

Its getting plenty of coverage Downunder.
 
YOU'VE got to love England. The Poms sure know how to serve up a scandal.
All year they have been building up this Rugby League World Cup as the global sporting event of 2013 - but in the countdown to the tournament kick off, early Sunday morning Australian time, the host nation is now on the verge of imploding.
While Australia's preparations have been faultless, England are in turmoil after Canterbury's star prop James Graham was sensationally left out of England's 19-man squad named to take on Australia in the tournament opener at Millennium Stadium.
Graham's omission follows coach Steve McNamara's dramatic decision to sack Gareth Hock for breaking a team booze ban and missing a recovery season in the wake of England's shock defeat to Italy last weekend.
Hock was furious that he was the only player sent home after claiming up to seven other players had also broken the no alcohol policy the team had put in place until after the Australian game.
Hock said the players went out to drown their sorrows after their humiliating loss to Italy last weekend but instead of it bonding them together it appears to have sunk their World Cup dream.
All week there has been a guessing game going on here about who else was out on the town with Hock but so far England's team management have refused to reveal the other players involved, although it is understood they have been disciplined.
http://www.news.com....l-1226746421015



I am not sure whether you are Australian, or whether you are based in Australia.
While that article is true to an extent, anyone who spent more than 2 minutes on research would have noticed that this is building up into by far the most successful World Cup the Code has had, with far better and well informed coverage than we have ever seen. That's the story. England's travails are a single cloud in a clear sky.

#59 boxhead

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 07:24 AM

Do you not think that NZ will win group B?

Yes and my point was if England lose against Oz they will meet the Kiwis in the Semis.



#60 Exiled Wiganer

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 07:26 AM

Our home record against the Kiwis speaks for itself.




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