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Eyesore In The Corner

Whats the legalities?

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#21 southsider

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 01:37 PM

Neil, I have today spoken to two ex directors and also a current director, they all verified that we still have the right of way under the club.

Livo, apparently a family member of the current owner of the club has been storing building materials underneath. This was how I first became aware of the situation, because it was fenced off, thus impeding the right of way across.

#22 D11

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 09:23 PM

Neil, I have today spoken to two ex directors and also a current director, they all verified that we still have the right of way under the club.

Livo, apparently a family member of the current owner of the club has been storing building materials underneath. This was how I first became aware of the situation, because it was fenced off, thus impeding the right of way across.

I looked into this matter in great detail and can assure you that the right of way has gone , hence the fencing has now been put up.  When  I was dealing with the financial side me and my solicitor looked into the possibility of purchase of the club and there was a lot of dealing which had gone on in the past and the right of way was kept at the time due to it being a fire escape, however the new entrance removed the requirement.


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#23 eddo

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 02:53 AM

Sounds like an accidental demolition ball to me  :sclerosis:



#24 morty

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 06:17 AM

Sounds like an accidental demolition ball to me  :sclerosis:

Give Mylee Cyrus a call ..I hear shes good with a wrecking ball :shout:


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#25 southsider

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 04:41 PM

Why would anybody in their right minds relinquish a right of way, whether it was needed or not ? The mind boggles !!!!
If it HAS happened however, someone wants their ###e kicking.

#26 Dave W

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 05:02 PM

This covenant thing has always baffled me. How did SJ obtain the sole rights for alcohol sale in CP in the first place? A little deal he struck with himself when he was "running" the club (into the ground) back in the 80s?

 

These Johns(t)on's certainly like to have their little hand grenades to lob back over their shoulders when they flounce off, don't they?



#27 livo

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 05:44 PM

If the club had the right of way at one point does that mean we own(ed) the peice of land under there. 


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#28 D11

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 05:59 PM

If the club had the right of way at one point does that mean we own(ed) the peice of land under there. 

 

The club and the ground were owned by Barrow Rugby at one point many years ago but Steve Johnston stepped in at a time when the club was again  in financial desperation and pulled them out of the mire by buying the club at an agreed fee.  I believe the right of way was kept as it was required as a fire exist due to the lack of a gate in that corner. The new entrance and gate means that the right of way is no longer justified. The covenant was created (as I am led to believe) to protect the alcohol selling rights of the night club and remains in place until either the owner relinquishes the legal covenant or the building is demolished.


"we all make mistakes that's why they put rubbers on pencils"


#29 Plan of Attack

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 10:20 PM

Cant we just get a articulated lorry to "accidently" back into the building, It would have to be demolished then!  ;)


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#30 atp

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 12:50 PM

I feal it's a legal minefield, as the covenant is in place and the person/people who have it are getting a return on it ie Payment from Barrow RL for the use of the bar along side the snack bar on the popular side then they can keep it in place as long as they wish. If instead of building the bar next to the snack bar the Raiders bar was extended in size and the point of selling alcohol did not change (the bar area in the raiders bar) or stayed within the perimeter of the original building then there would be no problem as permission to sell alcohol from this area has been agreed with both parties at no cost . This is what I have been led to believe if I have it wrong then I apologise in advance. But I am sure if the old club was to be demolished tomorrow the covenant will still stand as the holder/holders are getting a return on it.

#31 richie keay

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 06:41 PM

If the covenant still still stands why can't the building be demolished then, surely the most important thing for Barrow RLat this most in time is the health and safety of the public/ officials/players on match days. Imagine a scenario where the Duke Street entrance and the area up to the grandstand had to be closed due to the building being unsafe, we wouldn't be able to play at Craven Park because the emergency services wouldn't be able to get in! 


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#32 Paul Ballantyne

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 06:44 PM

The emergency services would just use the gate at the hindpool end surely?



#33 atp

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:01 PM

I can't see any reason why the remains of the club can't be demolished and removed, that would have to be negotiated between the BoD and the club owners. The emergency services always used the hindpool entrance before the roundabout was put just outside the entrance. It was then thought safer to use the Duke St end.

#34 Paul Ballantyne

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:39 PM

I'm not being funny but why would the club owner have to negotiate with the BoD to demolish his own building? The sooner the better for me as it's an embarrassment.

#35 D11

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 05:51 AM

My understanding is that if the building is removed then the license for that premises is also removed and then the covenant has no legal standing but the owner of the club could apply for planing to re build the club beforehand and once planning is there and the license then the covenant remains. The BOD negotiated the deal with the owner which now sets an annual income for the owner which now also complicates the matter. ( the deal was done whilst i was financial officer but carried out in my absence). The future of the old club and the covenant lies with the owner of the club.


"we all make mistakes that's why they put rubbers on pencils"


#36 mick wilson

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 09:21 PM

This covenant thing has always baffled me. How did SJ obtain the sole rights for alcohol sale in CP in the first place? A little deal he struck with himself when he was "running" the club (into the ground) back in the 80s?

 

These Johns(t)on's certainly like to have their little hand grenades to lob back over their shoulders when they flounce off, don't they?

Maybe johnson lost the covenant in one of the many burglaries or fires he always suffered annually when it was accounts season?  



#37 mick wilson

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 09:26 PM

I feal it's a legal minefield, as the covenant is in place and the person/people who have it are getting a return on it ie Payment from Barrow RL for the use of the bar along side the snack bar on the popular side then they can keep it in place as long as they wish. If instead of building the bar next to the snack bar the Raiders bar was extended in size and the point of selling alcohol did not change (the bar area in the raiders bar) or stayed within the perimeter of the original building then there would be no problem as permission to sell alcohol from this area has been agreed with both parties at no cost . This is what I have been led to believe if I have it wrong then I apologise in advance. But I am sure if the old club was to be demolished tomorrow the covenant will still stand as the holder/holders are getting a return on it.

Could the bar be improved this way to increase the service and revenue without breaking any existing legal agreements?

 

Should we have bought the Kill One when it was on offer & have that as the club house, would this have saved the club 5K per season? 



#38 mick wilson

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 09:33 PM

Surely someone could threaten the Council due to its inactivity to protect the public and force the issue of removing this H & S Issue with the building or anyone who gets free legal aid to bring a lengthy expensive law suit against johnson that would cost him a fortune to fight due to his neglect of duty (re) this dangerous building, As long as it doesn't harm the club obviously, where theres a will etc



#39 atp

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 10:05 PM

Could the bar be improved this way to increase the service and revenue without breaking any existing legal agreements?
 
Should we have bought the Kill One when it was on offer & have that as the club house, would this have saved the club 5K per season?

extending the Raiders bar area has been looked at but finances would not allow it, in my opinion it would have been better extending the Raiders bar with a window to sell beer to supporters on the terraces!
But the new bar was built before the present BoD were elected.

#40 D11

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 09:38 AM

extending the Raiders bar area has been looked at but finances would not allow it, in my opinion it would have been better extending the Raiders bar with a window to sell beer to supporters on the terraces!
But the new bar was built before the present BoD were elected.

 

The deal for selling alcohol from the outside bar was carried out by the present BOD. Extending the Raiders Bar requires Planning permission and a further deal/permission from the Covenant owner.


"we all make mistakes that's why they put rubbers on pencils"





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