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new structure idea


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#21 Griff

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 07:53 PM

you misunderstand...


theres no carry over points...just a 2x12 regular season,then top 8 play offs,middle 8 relegation/promotion play offs & a bottom 8 championship divisional cup...


no silly pointless extra games

 

So it's different to what we've got for 2015, then ? 

 

I see.

 

Not that I think it's much better, mind. Imho, the problems are the short notice at which the last wad of fixtures will be produced, plus the fact that there'll be no promotion or relegation, owing to the First Twelve teams being a lot better than the Second Twelve teams.

 

Sure - some rich bloke might throw money at a club once in a while but is that really good for the game ?


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#22 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 09:16 PM

If we are to have two leagues of twelve with this crazy formular where teams end up playing 30 games . Then for the sake of three extra games why not have two leagues of 12 playing each other in there own league three times for 33 games with one up one down . Top five play offs 16 home games and 16 away games a season plus the magic weekends . A fair and simpilar system where every team can budget for the season better and with the guarantee of one up one down . Super league premiership and super league championship is the way to go.

Because you're not talking a 33 games. You're talking 33 games + 4 weeks of play-offs.

The new system is 30 games + 2 weeks play-offs which is only one week longer than the current system (27 games + 4 weeks play-offs). Your system is 6 weeks longer than the current system. That's ridiculous.
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#23 gutterfax

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:19 AM

next year, London v Fev for the right to lose to Wakefield in the million pound game will be a blockbuster of epic proportions.....state of Origin will do well to heed our warning...



#24 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 07:53 AM

next year, London v Fev for the right to lose to Wakefield in the million pound game will be a blockbuster of epic proportions.....state of Origin will do well to heed our warning...

More interesting a game than Parramatta vs Wests in a wooden spoon match.
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#25 The Parksider

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 08:19 AM

next year, London v Fev for the right to lose to Wakefield in the million pound game will be a blockbuster of epic proportions.....

 

1998 winner takes all Featherstone.v.Wakefield 8,224

1999 winner takes all Dewsbury.v.Hunslet 5,783

2000 winner takes all Dewsbury.v. Leigh 8,847

2001 winner takes all Oldham.v.Widnes 8,974

2002 winner takes all Fartown.v.Leigh 9,051

followed by 9,186,11,005, 13,300, 13,024, 20,814 & 7,104

 

Great games and some good crowds building to some excellent ones.

 

The new format has no grand final winner takes all really, just a continuation of pseudo league fixtures, and then again between mismatched sides. I think fans aren't daft and are likely to pick up (if they haven't already done so) on how loaded the dice will be in these roll-offs.

 

I don't see the excitement of those wonderful grand finals returning.



#26 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 08:34 AM

1998 winner takes all Featherstone.v.Wakefield 8,224
1999 winner takes all Dewsbury.v.Hunslet 5,783
2000 winner takes all Dewsbury.v. Leigh 8,847
2001 winner takes all Oldham.v.Widnes 8,974
2002 winner takes all Fartown.v.Leigh 9,051
followed by 9,186,11,005, 13,300, 13,024, 20,814 & 7,104

Great games and some good crowds building to some excellent ones.

The new format has no grand final winner takes all really, just a continuation of pseudo league fixtures, and then again between mismatched sides. I think fans aren't daft and are likely to pick up (if they haven't already done so) on how loaded the dice will be in these roll-offs.

I don't see the excitement of those wonderful grand finals returning.

There's a 4th vs 5th game with the winner going into SL. That's akin to a play-off grand final.
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#27 Scubby

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 09:55 AM

I was (and am) a big critic of this new system but it is here now and I am prepared to watch how it plays out over the new few seasons.

 

There is no point moaning about it - it's done.



#28 The Parksider

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 09:58 AM

So it's different to what we've got for 2015, then ? 

 

I see.

 

Not that I think it's much better, mind there'll be no promotion or relegation, owing to the First Twelve teams being a lot better than the Second Twelve teams.

 

Sure - some rich bloke might throw money at a club once in a while but is that really good for the game ?

 

Not sure that I see that well on this mish mash.

 

Anyway as the tables stand if London and Bradford go down they receive very large parachute payments.

Leigh in sparkling form and a rejuvinated Doncaster would add to the above pair as the top four CC clubs.

 

So as it stands the play offs next year could be professional clubs Hull and HKR, Wakefield and Catalans with Bradford and London still running professionally on those big parachute payments.

 

Bottom of the pile are Leigh and Doncaster, still running semi pro??

 

This could easily happen, and isn't it a massive ask for either of those two championship clubs to take on those professional clubs??? As it stands the 4v5  "final" which I missed would be Catalans.v.Bradford.

 

Finally where would Featherstone Rovers be in all of this or Sheffield Eagles or Halifax?? What effect would this new structure have on these clubs who would effectively be squeezed down to third tier status should all things stay as they are??

 

Take the wishful thinking out of all this and the new structure in which tiers 1 and 2 of the game are just 16 clubs, relegates such as Fev, Sheffield and Halifax to the third division of late season play offs even if they end their seasons very successfully (Last year 3rd. & 4th. in the Championship were Fax and Leigh who won most of their games). This new structure pushes the top two Championship clubs to the bottom of an eight club play off under four big pro clubs and two ex-SL clubs with fat parachute payments.

 

In recent years such as Fev and Halifax have been there or thereabouts contesting grand finals (2010's belter) that in other years (1998 -2008) would have seen one of them in Superleague.

 

Reducing SL to 12, paying out massive parachute payments and loading the play off dice in favour of pro clubs against part timers surely puts the recently stifled ambitions of several CC clubs even further backwards rather than advancing them??

 

I may be wrong (again?) but if my club were a top CC club I'd be crying "foul" not "Can't wait for P & R to return".


Edited by The Parksider, 25 March 2014 - 10:07 AM.


#29 The Parksider

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 10:01 AM

There is no point moaning about it - it's done.

 

Nobody is moaning or being negative, we are discussing the practical merits of the system, and looking at how it works. My fear is that if it works to current form and funding you will hear the biggest moans ever in around 18 months time. As for it being "done" the fair question is when will it be undone.



#30 Griff

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 11:40 AM

 

There is no point moaning about it - it's done.

 

It's never done.  There's always more change.  That's Rugby League.


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#31 superten

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Posted 28 March 2014 - 05:23 PM

is there to be minimum standards to be able to compete in the super league or championship ? Would Sheffield say if they won play off be allowed in super league playing at Owlerton ? What the formats for teams below the top two divisions as 13 teams will be out of top two leagues. Are standards going to be set to let teams in the lowest league be able to go up ?  


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#32 Griff

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Posted 28 March 2014 - 06:10 PM

is there to be minimum standards to be able to compete in the super league or championship ? Would Sheffield say if they won play off be allowed in super league playing at Owlerton ? What the formats for teams below the top two divisions as 13 teams will be out of top two leagues. Are standards going to be set to let teams in the lowest league be able to go up ?  

 

Yes, there will be minimum standards is the short answer.  The rest of your questions call for speculation, though.


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#33 Oxford

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Posted 30 March 2014 - 09:07 AM

I'm more confused by all your confusion than I ever was with the proposed new structure. A different suggestion for every post,
a different model for each some looking backwards some forwards, these go up those go down. it was better when we...... ,what about
this and that and don't forget the internationals? I need a lie down!

#34 JM2010

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 07:27 PM

Does anyone think that all 24 teams could be full time at some point in the future. I think it is highly unlikely especially given the differences in funding. This would be the best way for the new structure to work as clubs could move between both without too much upheaval .The clubs would need similar levels of funding for this to be viable
With strict criteria for any promoted clubs from what is now championship 2. Wishful thinking I know, but it's my ideal scenario based on the new structure

#35 bamfordsbeans

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 07:51 PM

I think 24 full time teams is too ambitious for the time being.I think 20 is more realistic and although in the minority I was in favour of a 2 x 10 team approach.

#36 JM2010

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 08:07 PM

I think whatever the structure more full time teams should be the aim with more competitive games. However, this should be done in the right way rather than clubs going full time for the sake of it before their ready. Clubs should only be allowed to go full time if they can prove they've got the finances/income and if other areas if the club are up to scratch eg development, marketing, attendances etc

#37 Griff

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Posted 09 April 2014 - 12:52 PM

Going forward, less, rather than more, full time teams seems the better bet.


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#38 Steve Slater

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 09:08 PM

Not sure that I see that well on this mish mash.

 

Anyway as the tables stand if London and Bradford go down they receive very large parachute payments.

Leigh in sparkling form and a rejuvinated Doncaster would add to the above pair as the top four CC clubs.

 

So as it stands the play offs next year could be professional clubs Hull and HKR, Wakefield and Catalans with Bradford and London still running professionally on those big parachute payments.

 

Bottom of the pile are Leigh and Doncaster, still running semi pro??

 

This could easily happen, and isn't it a massive ask for either of those two championship clubs to take on those professional clubs??? As it stands the 4v5  "final" which I missed would be Catalans.v.Bradford.

 

Finally where would Featherstone Rovers be in all of this or Sheffield Eagles or Halifax?? What effect would this new structure have on these clubs who would effectively be squeezed down to third tier status should all things stay as they are??

 

 

Bit of a contradiction there: What makes you think that Leigh & Doncaster would be the top teams out of the current Championship when Fev have been spending the most? The truth is that money doesn't always talk, just like Batley knocking out Leigh & Fev in last year's play-offs, and the closer the gap in pay differentials the greater the chance of an upset. If we get only one club from the bottom tier earning promotion every year or two it will be a step in the right direction. Of course, it could be more interesting if the top four clubs from the lower tier got an increase in salary cap and were allowed a transfer window before the start of the middle round of 8.



#39 Griff

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Posted 11 April 2014 - 08:52 AM

Of course, it could be more interesting if the top four clubs from the lower tier got an increase in salary cap and were allowed a transfer window before the start of the middle round of 8.

 

Who would they buy ?  Who'd be available at the sharp end of the season ?  Would you want to change a winning team ?

 

No thanks - it's going to be a bit like DR, isn't it ?


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#40 Steve Slater

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Posted 11 April 2014 - 05:49 PM

Who would they buy ?  Who'd be available at the sharp end of the season ?  Would you want to change a winning team ?

 

No thanks - it's going to be a bit like DR, isn't it ?

True, but it would get the current SL also-rans moaning a bit more






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