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The Tetley's Challenge Cup - Fourth Round Match Thread


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Poll: Will you be watching any of these games? (54 member(s) have cast votes)

Will you be watching any of these games?

  1. I'll watch the BBC televised game only. (25 votes [46.30%])

    Percentage of vote: 46.30%

  2. I'll watch the BBC televised game and attend one other game. (16 votes [29.63%])

    Percentage of vote: 29.63%

  3. I'll watch the BBC televised game and attend more than one other game. (2 votes [3.70%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.70%

  4. I won't watch the BBC televised game but I will attend one other game. (9 votes [16.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.67%

  5. I won't watch the BBC televised game but I will attend more than one other game. (1 votes [1.85%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.85%

  6. I won't watch the BBC televised game or attend any other game. (1 votes [1.85%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.85%

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#381 Trojan

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 10:17 PM

Hudds did plenty of holding down at the PTB. 

 

 

No one's saying they didn't, but they got punished for it - 13-5 penalty count - Saints got away with plenty of holding down and a high tackle on Robinson - but in the end it wasn't  Ferres who cost them the game it was having a perfectly good field goal disallowed, had it counted there'd have been no time for Saints to recover possession and equalise.


Edited by Trojan, 07 April 2014 - 10:19 PM.

"Your a one trick pony Trojan" - Parksider 10th March 2013

#382 yipyee

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 11:27 PM

They didn't. Brown said he hadn't been able to see it and Anderson also said to the BBC (not on camera but it was reported) that he hadn't seen it but that he took Brough at his word. So the two coaches hadn't actually seen the drop goal during the match and couldn't comment on it post match. Walsh said he thought it went over but he didn't know. So there was no consensus. There still isn't.


and brough had his back to the incident....

its like taking a shot a snooker and celebrating before it falls into the pocket only for it to rattle in the pocket and bounce back out.....

#383 yipyee

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 11:34 PM

No one's saying they didn't, but they got punished for it - 13-5 penalty count - Saints got away with plenty of holding down and a high tackle on Robinson - but in the end it wasn't Ferres who cost them the game it was having a perfectly good field goal disallowed, had it counted there'd have been no time for Saints to recover possession and equalise.


I thought the sameish thing when walsh kicked the 2, I.e.
get the ball back and be in drop goal range! Only for brough to kick the ball out so Huddersfield got possesion in drop goal range.... didn't cas drop a goal against wigan with less than a minute left only for wigan to win a short kick-off and score a winning try??

What I am saying is you dont know that saints wouldnt have scored anyway!

In fact saints did Huddersfield a favour as their first drop goal attempt was with 5 mins left before their 5ish repeat sets!!!!

#384 TBC

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 11:41 PM

They didn't.  Brown said he hadn't been able to see it and Anderson also said to the BBC (not on camera but it was reported) that he hadn't seen it but that he took Brough at his word.  So the two coaches hadn't actually seen the drop goal during the match and couldn't comment on it post match. Walsh said he thought it went over but he didn't know.  So there was no consensus.  There still isn't.

If he thought it went over then surely he thought it went over. How can he think it went over and then say he didn't know if it went over?

#385 yipyee

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 11:49 PM

If he thought it went over then surely he thought it went over. How can he think it went over and then say he didn't know if it went over?


well brough was play acting pretending it went over so this may have led people to the wrong conclusion. ...maybe he is a victim of his own actions, I am fed up of seeing brough, wellens and most the leeds players trying to intimidate and change referees decisions!
It made me lol when mcdermot accused the refs being influenced by the catalan croud!

#386 Saintslass

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 08:10 AM

If he thought it went over then surely he thought it went over. How can he think it went over and then say he didn't know if it went over?

That's what he said.  Ask him!



#387 Saintslass

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 08:11 AM

well brough was play acting pretending it went over so this may have led people to the wrong conclusion. ...maybe he is a victim of his own actions, I am fed up of seeing brough, wellens and most the leeds players trying to intimidate and change referees decisions!
It made me lol when mcdermot accused the refs being influenced by the catalan croud!

Brough and Wellens are captains and so they are entitled to speak to the ref on occasions.  Brough has taken it to another level this season though and Wellens has been a pain in the backside for a while in this regard.



#388 Marv Woodburn

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 08:17 AM

 

 

I rather think it is time to, er, drop the subject.

I see what you've done there!



#389 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 10:07 AM

They didn't. Brown said he hadn't been able to see it and Anderson also said to the BBC (not on camera but it was reported) that he hadn't seen it but that he took Brough at his word. So the two coaches hadn't actually seen the drop goal during the match and couldn't comment on it post match. Walsh said he thought it went over but he didn't know. So there was no consensus. There still isn't.

So what you're saying is that the people that saw it say it went over, and the people that didn't see it say they aren't sure?

Hmmm...
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#390 bobbruce

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 10:30 AM

So what you're saying is that the people that saw it say it went over, and the people that didn't see it say they aren't sure?

Hmmm...


Not everyone who saw it said it went over.

#391 ckn

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 11:38 AM

Phil Bentham "no regrets"

 

How to make friends and influence people.


Arguing with the forum trolls is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good you are, the bird will **** on the board and strut around like it won anyway


#392 Saintslass

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 11:40 AM

Phil Bentham "no regrets"

 

How to make friends and influence people.

Here's an article from the YEP in which the video ref says he would have had to have referred it back to the on field ref, so killing dead the theory that it should have gone to the video ref:

 

http://www.yorkshire...ham-says-video-call-would-not-have-spared-huddersfield-1-6547688



#393 MrFussy

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 11:55 AM

Here's an article from the YEP in which the video ref says he would have had to have referred it back to the on field ref, so killing dead the theory that it should have gone to the video ref:

 

http://www.yorkshire...ham-says-video-call-would-not-have-spared-huddersfield-1-6547688

Excellent!



#394 Leeds Wire

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 12:05 PM

It made me lol when mcdermot accused the refs being influenced by the catalan croud!

Please tell me you are kidding! When did he say this?



#395 Dave T

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 12:07 PM

Here's an article from the YEP in which the video ref says he would have had to have referred it back to the on field ref, so killing dead the theory that it should have gone to the video ref:

 

http://www.yorkshire...ham-says-video-call-would-not-have-spared-huddersfield-1-6547688

But ref's call has been scrapped in SL, so how could they do that?

 

My understanding is that once it has been passed to the VR, he will make the decision.

 

EDIT: I assume they mean that the VR would have just gone with the Ref's steer.


Edited by Dave T, 08 April 2014 - 12:09 PM.


#396 longboard

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 12:30 PM

A few reflections.

I enjoyed most of the game at Hudds on Sunday. Leaving aside the smidgeon of controversy, I thought the match was fairly typical of Huddersfield's season so far. There was sterling defence at  times and a struggle to achieve fluency in attack. The passing and timing was poor at times, which slowed down the attack; this has been the case for a lot of the games so far. It took the Giants a long time to get going in the first half and the possession and territory stats showed this clearly. Hudds got into the game at the back end of the first half and were certainly in a good position to win going into the last quarter. 

 

Ferres' bizarre dangerous tackle changed the likelihood of a win. Ferres is a senior player and he let the team down and the impact will continue during his suspension and it will add to the disruptions Hudds have already had through injury. It's just as well that he didn't drop Lomax, or ram his head into the pitch; he was lucky that Lomax's arm and shoulder made contact with the ground cushioning the impact. I reckon that a lack of intent argument won't count much in Ferres' defence in the disciplinary compared to the recklessness of the attempted tackle. Wellens and Manu were so incensed by the foul play by Ferres that they ran in and pushed Kopczak. It just shows how emotion can cloud people's views of what has happened. It would help Hudds if we could play tough cup ties at home, without getting a man sent off......  :rtfm:

 

I thought Hudds showed spirit in defence in the last 15 mins but showed little composure when trying for the winning points. Hindsight is 20:20 and all that, but perhaps they should have pressured the Saints line more. 

 

D Brough's kicking has been patchy this season, along with his all round play, certainly compared to last year.  All the Hudds players who were in the World Cup haven't looked very sharp so far; it could be coincidence, or just reflective of the form team as a whole I suppose. When I watched the TV coverage of the match late on Sunday there was an interesting comment from D Brough while reflecting on the Giants' stuttering form compared to last season to the effect that last year the Hudds players had a "bond." Perhaps there isn't such a bond this season..... He also seemed to imply that P Anderson's game strategy was pretty basic compared to Nathan Brown's. I may be over interpreting what he said and he is not not most articulate of people and the interview would obviously have been edited but the comments stood out for me.

 

With regard to Mr Bentham's decision on the disputed attempted drop goal, I disagreed with it but it is hard to call the kicks that are higher than the posts. I see no reason to judge it as other than an honest call on his part. The word is that if he had gone to the video ref about the drop goal, Ian Smith would have handed it back to him,,although I thought the procedure on that had changed:-

 

http://www.examiner....rsfield-6933413

 

I guess that an assessor's report of Mr Bentham's display would be more critical of other areas of his performance rather than his judgement on the drop goal eg his missing the clear offsides in the last ten minutes as Saints defended their line. I can understand why he wouldn't want to give a probably match deciding penalty though.

 

As for D Brough nattering at Mr Bentham through much of the game, well he needs to stop it. Brough is in danger of whinging as much as D McGuire, or P Wellens. If it carries on we'll be seeing him standing with his hands out appealing on every decision. Brough didn't chelp at refs as much last season. He needs to concentrate on what he can control, rather than indulge in behaviour that is likely to alienate referees. His chat to the ref didn't seem to do any good for Hudds on Sunday.

Phil Bentham is an honourable man.

 

Saints have some good young players and it was interesting to see them live in action. They were particularly lively at the start of the match. Playing in a tight tense cup game will be good experience for them. Lomax is a fine player and great to watch; he's got real class. He maybe should have got a warning for dangerous contact  with L Robinson when he was in the air but Hudds didn't make a fuss about the incident. Walsh had a decent game and no doubt will be sharper after a couple more games. He showed good technique and composure with the touchline conversion, as well as for the drop goal. I thought the Hudds forwards were getting on top in the second half and other teams' coaches will be looking at that in terms of how to handle Saints. The Giants forwards did play better than they have for a while.

 

All in all it was a cracking cup tie. Hudds were a bit unfortunate to lose. They have a game against Hull on Thursday and that is now more important then last Sunday's game. What odds on D Brough scoring a drop goal? As for the comments about hoping Saints are beaten in the next round because of a bit of controversy on Sunday, well I hope it is a belting game vs Leeds with the better team winning. Saints were not responsible for the decisions some fans and other observers dispute.



#397 Eldujo

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 01:53 PM

Here's an article from the YEP in which the video ref says he would have had to have referred it back to the on field ref, so killing dead the theory that it should have gone to the video ref:

 

http://www.yorkshire...ham-says-video-call-would-not-have-spared-huddersfield-1-6547688

It's not the decision which irritated. It's that they never bothered checking,considering they go to the screen for pretty much everything, why they didn't for this? Brough and Bentham might both say they were 100% but I seriously doubt either were. If it had gone through the posts maybe but as it went over the top, there must be some element of doubt when it's as close as it clearly was. If they'd gone to the screen and decided against, I'd have had no problem there as it was inconclusive.

 

There'd still be an outcry no doubt as one view looked good and one looked bad but the ref didn't know that when he made his decision.

 

 

But ref's call has been scrapped in SL, so how could they do that?

 

My understanding is that once it has been passed to the VR, he will make the decision.

 

EDIT: I assume they mean that the VR would have just gone with the Ref's steer.

I think you're right that they don't just bat it back to on field ref. They do seem to confer with each other though. I'm pretty sure I heard Ian Smith ask Bentham what his view was when they couldn't get a clear view of the Wardle try.



#398 terrywebbisgod

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 02:19 PM

well brough was play acting pretending it went over so this may have led people to the wrong conclusion. ...maybe he is a victim of his own actions, I am fed up of seeing brough, wellens and most the leeds players trying to intimidate and change referees decisions!
It made me lol when mcdermot accused the refs being influenced by the catalan croud!

Ah,that old chestnut,the old "Leeds players intimidating the ref".Pull the other one.If that was the case wouldn't Leeds get every call going.Yet another ABL rears it's ugly head.


Once you have tasted excellence,you cannot go back to mediocrity.

#399 Saint Billinge

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 02:34 PM

A few reflections.

I enjoyed most of the game at Hudds on Sunday. Leaving aside the smidgeon of controversy, I thought the match was fairly typical of Huddersfield's season so far. There was sterling defence at  times and a struggle to achieve fluency in attack. The passing and timing was poor at times, which slowed down the attack; this has been the case for a lot of the games so far. It took the Giants a long time to get going in the first half and the possession and territory stats showed this clearly. Hudds got into the game at the back end of the first half and were certainly in a good position to win going into the last quarter. 

 

Ferres' bizarre dangerous tackle changed the likelihood of a win. Ferres is a senior player and he let the team down and the impact will continue during his suspension and it will add to the disruptions Hudds have already had through injury. It's just as well that he didn't drop Lomax, or ram his head into the pitch; he was lucky that Lomax's arm and shoulder made contact with the ground cushioning the impact. I reckon that a lack of intent argument won't count much in Ferres' defence in the disciplinary compared to the recklessness of the attempted tackle. Wellens and Manu were so incensed by the foul play by Ferres that they ran in and pushed Kopczak. It just shows how emotion can cloud people's views of what has happened. It would help Hudds if we could play tough cup ties at home, without getting a man sent off......  :rtfm:

 

I thought Hudds showed spirit in defence in the last 15 mins but showed little composure when trying for the winning points. Hindsight is 20:20 and all that, but perhaps they should have pressured the Saints line more. 

 

D Brough's kicking has been patchy this season, along with his all round play, certainly compared to last year.  All the Hudds players who were in the World Cup haven't looked very sharp so far; it could be coincidence, or just reflective of the form team as a whole I suppose. When I watched the TV coverage of the match late on Sunday there was an interesting comment from D Brough while reflecting on the Giants' stuttering form compared to last season to the effect that last year the Hudds players had a "bond." Perhaps there isn't such a bond this season..... He also seemed to imply that P Anderson's game strategy was pretty basic compared to Nathan Brown's. I may be over interpreting what he said and he is not not most articulate of people and the interview would obviously have been edited but the comments stood out for me.

 

With regard to Mr Bentham's decision on the disputed attempted drop goal, I disagreed with it but it is hard to call the kicks that are higher than the posts. I see no reason to judge it as other than an honest call on his part. The word is that if he had gone to the video ref about the drop goal, Ian Smith would have handed it back to him,,although I thought the procedure on that had changed:-

 

http://www.examiner....rsfield-6933413

 

I guess that an assessor's report of Mr Bentham's display would be more critical of other areas of his performance rather than his judgement on the drop goal eg his missing the clear offsides in the last ten minutes as Saints defended their line. I can understand why he wouldn't want to give a probably match deciding penalty though.

 

As for D Brough nattering at Mr Bentham through much of the game, well he needs to stop it. Brough is in danger of whinging as much as D McGuire, or P Wellens. If it carries on we'll be seeing him standing with his hands out appealing on every decision. Brough didn't chelp at refs as much last season. He needs to concentrate on what he can control, rather than indulge in behaviour that is likely to alienate referees. His chat to the ref didn't seem to do any good for Hudds on Sunday.

Phil Bentham is an honourable man.

 

Saints have some good young players and it was interesting to see them live in action. They were particularly lively at the start of the match. Playing in a tight tense cup game will be good experience for them. Lomax is a fine player and great to watch; he's got real class. He maybe should have got a warning for dangerous contact  with L Robinson when he was in the air but Hudds didn't make a fuss about the incident. Walsh had a decent game and no doubt will be sharper after a couple more games. He showed good technique and composure with the touchline conversion, as well as for the drop goal. I thought the Hudds forwards were getting on top in the second half and other teams' coaches will be looking at that in terms of how to handle Saints. The Giants forwards did play better than they have for a while.

 

All in all it was a cracking cup tie. Hudds were a bit unfortunate to lose. They have a game against Hull on Thursday and that is now more important then last Sunday's game. What odds on D Brough scoring a drop goal? As for the comments about hoping Saints are beaten in the next round because of a bit of controversy on Sunday, well I hope it is a belting game vs Leeds with the better team winning. Saints were not responsible for the decisions some fans and other observers dispute.

 

Well said and without bias. 



#400 longboard

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 02:55 PM

Well said and without bias. 

 

When emotion is involved objectivity can go straight out the window. What we feel about an event is often different from what happened. I try and be reasonably objective. This means my posts are not as entertaining as those of people who have a good old rant! 

Talking of emotion, it seemed to me that D Brough didn't handle the emotions in the last 15 mins of the game as well as L Walsh did. Walsh had been worked up earlier and pushed Jerry McGilvray at the play the ball and he was lucky to get the penalty.  He calmed himself down though and slotted the kick. Danny B looked anything but calm in the last 15 minutes.

 

Sometimes you have to take the brough with the smooth.  :ph34r:


Edited by longboard, 08 April 2014 - 04:22 PM.





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