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Anybody with legal expertise?


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#1 bbfaz

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 01:02 AM

Yes, this probably belongs in the Community section but I thought it'd get more views here.  I've been speaking with one of the other amateur clubs in London and they've been hit with a "cease and desist" order from an after school sports class.  They were not a registered rugby club, although during this little spat they've suddenly registered themselves with the RFU.  The guy has put a lot of work in to launch in 2014 but will now have to put off until 2015 if at all and likely under a different name.  Anybody with any legal expertise in this area or know anybody who has?  He has no money to fight this, it's a shoestring amateur operation.


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#2 Bedford Roughyed

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 05:19 AM

Someone tried to stop us using the 'Tigers' name when we started.  We told them to sod off.  Nothing more heard. 


With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on!

#3 ckn

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 06:41 AM

A cease and desist from doing what?  You'll need to be a bit more specific...


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#4 EastLondonMike

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 07:59 AM

Why not just change the name?..


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#5 brooza

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 08:08 AM

Why not just change the name?..

But why should they if there's no legal reason to and they have an established brand (no idea who the club is)


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#6 Bob8

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 08:15 AM

Normally, cease and desist letters are to make a point rather than to have any effect.  Clubs called "All Blacks" will occasionally have stiff letters from the  NZRU, but it is to protect their trademark and demonstrate that they claim with right to the term and prevent New Earswick All Blacks passing themselves off as the New Zealand national rugby union team.

 

Sometimes it is more serious and seeking expertise is the best option.


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#7 zorquif

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 09:29 AM

What are they basis the cease and desist letter on? What rights are they trying to exercise?



#8 Tonka

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 09:49 AM

I am assuming that the after school sports club is saying that your mate's club must cease and desist from using the same or a similar name.

 

The name of the sports club may have IP protection.  It could be protected a number of ways: copyright, design rights, trade marks.

 

Here is a good note on the subject (slightly outdated but still holds good: http://www.out-law.com/page-5541)

 

I'd be surprised if an after school club has any of the above, but it is possible.  It isn't even clear that it is a recognised organisation that could lay claim to such rights.

 

I highly doubt (althoguh it's not impossible) that the after school sports club has any appetitie or the funds to actually seek a remedy from the Court - so your mate's club can probably press on.

 

To keep the peace though if it can be re-branded without to much additional cost then do that.  Or why not try a joint initiative e.g. joint fund-raising ? (don't know if the club is also rugby though)

 

THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE!



#9 Griff

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 11:11 AM

If there's a dispute over the name, why does he need to cease operating ?

 

As EastLondonMike says, why not just change the name ?


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#10 The 4 of Us

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 11:24 AM

If there's a dispute over the name, why does he need to cease operating ?

As EastLondonMike says, why not just change the name ?


Brooza says why should they. Short answer is because they can't afford not to.

Lots of people have very good legal cases problem is the cost of pursuing them. May sound harsh but if he's worried about the principal of the matter, he needs to put his money where his mouth is or find another solution and move on.

#11 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 11:32 AM

I don't quite understand the question. Legal advice to do with what?

What has he been asked to cease and desist from doing? You've not actually said.
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#12 zorquif

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 12:15 PM

As with Tonka, this is just informal and is not to be taken to constitute advice...

 

However, copyright does not protect ideas, or such things as names or titles - UK IPO website

 

For the purposes of registration, a design is legally defined as being "the appearance of the whole or part of a product resulting from the features of, in particular, the lines, contours, colours, shape, texture or materials of the product or ornamentation." - so I can't see how a name could fall under design right

 

So we are left with trademarks or passing off...



#13 Tonka

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 01:29 PM

As with Tonka, this is just informal and is not to be taken to constitute advice...

 

However, copyright does not protect ideas, or such things as names or titles - UK IPO website

 

For the purposes of registration, a design is legally defined as being "the appearance of the whole or part of a product resulting from the features of, in particular, the lines, contours, colours, shape, texture or materials of the product or ornamentation." - so I can't see how a name could fall under design right

 

So we are left with trademarks or passing off...

 

I wondered if it was the particular logo that could be copyright protected or design registered... 



#14 Tonka

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 01:31 PM

Passing off it will be



#15 bbfaz

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 02:25 PM

Finding out more info guys.


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#16 Griff

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 02:39 PM

Brooza says why should they. Short answer is because they can't afford not to.
 

 

Can't they ?  Well, that depends on how they perceive the risk.  We can't make such judgment calls on the basis of the scant information provided.

 

Either way - I wouldn't be closing down the club or postponing operations for a year.  Not necessary at all.  There are other options.


Edited by Griff, 10 April 2014 - 02:41 PM.

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#17 zorquif

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 02:42 PM

I wondered if it was the particular logo that could be copyright protected or design registered... 

 

 

The logo could be copyright, I am not sure about design rights - only if it was part of a product (say a shirt). But in that case, change them!

 

Passing off would be a funny one to look into. The other club is a different sport - I suppose that as long as he says to every new comer 'look, we are RL NOT RU, they are down the road, and we have nowt to do with them' there could be no misrepresentation, so passing off would fail...






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