Jump to content


League Express

Podcast

Photo
- - - - -

RFL want Great Britain tour in 2015


  • Please log in to reply
74 replies to this topic

#21 THE RED ROOSTER

THE RED ROOSTER
  • Coach
  • 2,261 posts

Posted 11 April 2014 - 03:56 PM

Those in the Rugby league  "bubble" fail to appreciate what a tough sell to the Australian sporting public any side be it GB or England is for a tour down there. The fact is you only get respect if you beat the Green and Gold on a reguiar basis and that has not happened. The Australian sporting public looks forward to a GB / England tour in thev same way many of you look forward to your club playing this years London Broncos.

 

In short a foregone conclusion of a 3-0 hammering with siren voices down under wondering why players are beng required to play in this series instead of resting up for another tough season in the NRL.

 

For once I am with Nigel Wood "you cannot invite yourself to someone elses party" - Particularily if you are seen as a party pooper..


I am an oil trader and successful at that but, but marketing, finance, business management, human resources etc are not my strengths


 

 

David Hughes to Ian Lenagan Page 134 - A Pastel Revolution - Fletcher and Gordas - 2006

 

Being an outsider, it is easiest to see what is wrong with the sport. It's a fantastic sport that has been undersold and under-marketed  because people who run it probably want to keep it the way it is

 

 

Dr Marwan Koukash to Joanthan Lieu. Sunday Telegraph 9th March 2014

 

 


#22 londonrlfan

londonrlfan
  • Coach
  • 842 posts

Posted 11 April 2014 - 04:07 PM

Some very interesting points here. I've argued the toss with another of our writers, if anyone wants to have a look: http://www.totalrl.c...tain-tour-2015/

 

What the question for me is: what are the benefits of having this? Is it just for a nostalgia trip or is there an expectation that this will fill the grounds in Australia? Because I don't believe it will.

 

The basis for it seems to be based on other people's reactions:

A) It will grow the game in the UK due to GB being 'high profile' - even though 100 years of GB did nothing to grow the sport outside of England

B. It will give Welsh and Scottish players a chance to play at a big level - even though they could qualify for the Four Nations and the only 'Welsh' and 'Scots' being mentioned so far are English or Australian

 

The worst thing that could possibly happen for me is for GB to play a 'Queensland selection' and lose! How damaging would that be for IRL? No doubt the usual suspects would be calling for NSW and Queensland to be international teams. 


Edited by londonrlfan, 11 April 2014 - 04:07 PM.


#23 foozler

foozler
  • Coach
  • 957 posts

Posted 11 April 2014 - 04:29 PM

GB Tour to Australasia could be a great idea but quite frankly I want to see England play someone in the UK at some point in the next 18 months, not have to wait until Autumn 2016 at the earliest, although that assumes the NRL clubs don't ask for another fallow year ahead of the World Cup (and yes I am ignoring any Exiles fixtures as they really don't count for anything IMO).

 

I would much sooner see a European Nations cup in 2015 with England, Wales, Scotland, Ireland, France plus ANOther for example so that I can get to an international rugby match. I don't care if the games involving England are a bit one sided, I would love to see Danny Brough line up for Scotland against Sinfield or Widdop, Matty Russell v Tomkins or Hardaker. I'm sure you could get decent crowds for France v Scotland in Avignon for example, or Wales v Scotland in Wrexham or England v Scotland at Huddersfield.

 

Any GB tour needs to be planned properly and should be post 2017 at the earliest.



#24 a j cougar

a j cougar
  • Coach
  • 1,648 posts

Posted 11 April 2014 - 06:04 PM

Lets not be pedantic about GB or UK definitions as you may wish to look up what countries actually constitute GB...My point in the previous post that last year's WC already galvanised the international game and showed the way forward to develop it; being nostalgic about the past is not it!


I'm not being pedantic, merely making the point that you don't need political union to exist for there to be a team that represents the British Isles

#25 Big Picture

Big Picture
  • Coach
  • 1,163 posts

Posted 11 April 2014 - 07:56 PM

The basis for it seems to be based on other people's reactions:

A) It will grow the game in the UK due to GB being 'high profile' - even though 100 years of GB did nothing to grow the sport outside of England

Your "100 years of GB" is off β€” there was no such team as Great Britain until after World War II.  Games against Australia and New Zealand before then involved England, not GB, as programs and advertisements from those years show very clearly.  As I've said before,

 

Tours where the same countries play each other over and over again = a small-time international sport with too few contries for a real international program.  They're a relic of the past and should stay in the past.



#26 RSN

RSN
  • Coach
  • 3,965 posts

Posted 11 April 2014 - 08:38 PM

It'll be pointless and a tad fake. I'd pick Rhys Evans and Ben Flower so the side has a bit of credibility.

#27 Padge

Padge
  • Coach
  • 18,018 posts

Posted 11 April 2014 - 11:11 PM

Can we not have the empire v the rest of the world.

 

That way we can have Australia on our side and thrash those pesky rubbish nations.



Visit my photography site www.padge.smugmug.com
Radio 5 Live: Saturday 14 April 2007
Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king"

 

This country's wealth was created by men in overalls, it was destroyed by men in suits.


#28 RugbyLeagueGeek

RugbyLeagueGeek
  • Coach
  • 629 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 12:02 AM

Your "100 years of GB" is off β€” there was no such team as Great Britain until after World War II.  Games against Australia and New Zealand before then involved England, not GB, as programs and advertisements from those years show very clearly. 

That's not correct. There's a clear distinction between the games played as England and games played as 'Northern Union' in the early 1900s, and there was definitely a GB team before WW2.



#29 Vikingstorm

Vikingstorm
  • Coach
  • 2,934 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 07:07 AM

I disagree. I think it can only be a good thing to bring back the GB tour. As long as nothing else suffers as a result of course.

I just don't like the Tag England.....Great Britain Rugby League is a Brand....regardless of where the players come from

 

 

It gives us a distinction from Union


[QUOTE]β€œTHE enemy should be in no doubt that we are his Nemesis and that we are bringing about his rightful destruction. There are many regional commanders who have stains on their souls and they are stoking the fires of Hell for Saddam. As they die they will know their deeds have brought them to this place. Show them no pity. But those who do not wish to go on that journey, we will not send. As for the others, I expect you to rock their world.

#30 Padge

Padge
  • Coach
  • 18,018 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 08:05 AM

I just don't like the Tag England.....Great Britain Rugby League is a Brand....regardless of where the players come from

 

 

It gives us a distinction from Union

 

Only in your head.



Visit my photography site www.padge.smugmug.com
Radio 5 Live: Saturday 14 April 2007
Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king"

 

This country's wealth was created by men in overalls, it was destroyed by men in suits.


#31 Johnoco

Johnoco
  • Coach
  • 19,745 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 08:13 AM

I just don't like the Tag England.....Great Britain Rugby League is a Brand....regardless of where the players come from


It gives us a distinction from Union

GB RL is a brand to a handful of people, not the wider public. And if it's irrelevant where the players come from, why not call them Europe?

No I don't care if you're if you're into different bands

No cause for so much hatred, I'm just a different man

Pull off that cover, I will too, and learn to understand

With music deep inside we'll make world unity our plan

 

7 Seconds -Walk Together, Rock Together


#32 yipyee

yipyee
  • Coach
  • 1,100 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 10:07 AM

Is this so they don't have to be bothered organising a home tournament?

#33 redjonn

redjonn
  • Coach
  • 853 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 10:40 AM

I think having GB tours on a infrequent, say 4 yearly basis, is a good idea.  Having individual nations internationals plus GB concept seems sensible to me. Even though currently the team may not be much different that England one has to hope that the game in the other home nations manages to develop over the forthcoming years and hence bringing more non English players into potentially being available.

 

Otherwise if we don't think the game will develop in the other home nations we may as well pull the plug now in those area's. Surely you have to take long term view that the game will develop, otherwise why bother, and hence the GB format on a 4 year cycle makes sense.   Two or three tours hence it would be 8 to 12 years thus if we don't believe the game will strengthen in the other home nations to produce some candidates then we may as well say that the home nations will be forever weak and wonder whether its worth persisting. I'm more positive and think its worth the effort.



#34 redjonn

redjonn
  • Coach
  • 853 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 10:45 AM

Your "100 years of GB" is off β€” there was no such team as Great Britain until after World War II.  Games against Australia and New Zealand before then involved England, not GB, as programs and advertisements from those years show very clearly.  As I've said before,

 

Tours where the same countries play each other over and over again = a small-time international sport with too few contries for a real international program.  They're a relic of the past and should stay in the past.

 

Your comment in last paragraph actually reminded me of the five/six nations. Yet interest is amazingly high. Yep other nations for tours and world cups but the big interest is the six nations and NZ and Australia.   That is playing the same teams over and over again yet huge demand.



#35 RugbyLeagueGeek

RugbyLeagueGeek
  • Coach
  • 629 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 10:49 AM

Tours where the same countries play each other over and over again = a small-time international sport with too few contries for a real international program.  They're a relic of the past and should stay in the past.

 

How many 'big-time' international sports don't have tours?
 



#36 Big Picture

Big Picture
  • Coach
  • 1,163 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 11:37 AM

Your comment in last paragraph actually reminded me of the five/six nations. Yet interest is amazingly high. Yep other nations for tours and world cups but the big interest is the six nations and NZ and Australia.   That is playing the same teams over and over again yet huge demand.

You misunderstood me then, the Six Nations is a tournament, not a tour.  Tours like the one proposed typically involve only involve two countries, not a group of countries who all play each other.  They're two different things.



#37 Big Picture

Big Picture
  • Coach
  • 1,163 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 12:08 PM

How many 'big-time' international sports don't have tours?
 

Considering that tours like the one proposed typically involve only involve two or three countries, pretty much all of them.

 

The three biggest team sports in the world are soccer, basketball and handball.  In those sports there are many national teams, which play many games a year against many different countries.  The majority of these games are played in continental championships, world cups or the Olympics (and their respective qualifying tournaments).  Any other games played are friendlies and much less important than those in tournaments.  If the English soccer team ever went on a tour like the proposed GB one, it must have been long before our time.


Edited by Big Picture, 12 April 2014 - 12:24 PM.


#38 redjonn

redjonn
  • Coach
  • 853 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 01:22 PM

You misunderstood me then, the Six Nations is a tournament, not a tour.  Tours like the one proposed typically involve only involve two countries, not a group of countries who all play each other.  They're two different things.

 

Yep I agree to your six nations comment but the NZ and Aussies in autumn internationals are tours. Yes more than just England but then less national teams is the failure of RL over many decades to be interested in expanding RL and having interest including fans in international game rather than their own narrower interest in their local clubs.

 

So whilst not ideal in comparison to union a GB tour that included secondary fixtures, as in mid week equivalent in Union Lions tours, that included the likes of Fiji, Samoa, PNG etc and club games.  Of course for me it would be every 4 years or so with national England/NZ tours here and/or 4 nations competition.  I'm sure NZ would be happy to tour here and we there even if Aussies turn nose up.


Edited by redjonn, 12 April 2014 - 01:28 PM.


#39 RugbyLeagueGeek

RugbyLeagueGeek
  • Coach
  • 629 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 06:09 PM

The three biggest team sports in the world are soccer, basketball and handball.

Personally, I would only class soccer as a 'big-time' international sport out of those 3. The top level of basketball is the NBA - there isn't an international competition that generates huge publicity or global interest. In terms of handball I couldn't name you a single team, let alone the name of any international competition. Just because these sports have loads of international fixtures doesn't mean that their respective international structures are commercially successful.

 

I'm not sure international RL should be looking to either basketball or handball as a blueprint for a successful international sport. Soccer is a global behemoth with immense financial backing that is impossible to compete with, so I'm not sure RL will get very far trying to emulate that sport either. Which leads me to sports like RU and cricket, both of which have tours.

 

I think RL needs to play to its strengths and plan an international calendar that works for the sport, rather than trying to mimic other sports that may have completely different strengths and weaknesses to ours. For me, this would probably contain elements of both international tournaments and tours, because I see international RL being far more similar to the likes of cricket and RU than it is to soccer or handball.



#40 Johnoco

Johnoco
  • Coach
  • 19,745 posts

Posted 12 April 2014 - 06:22 PM

Reasonable comment RLG.

I still think bringing back GB is wrong though. :P

No I don't care if you're if you're into different bands

No cause for so much hatred, I'm just a different man

Pull off that cover, I will too, and learn to understand

With music deep inside we'll make world unity our plan

 

7 Seconds -Walk Together, Rock Together





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users