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International expansion

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#21 westlondonfan

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Posted 24 April 2014 - 06:05 AM

I think you miss understand me then, I wasn't saying China would become some dominant RL nation. But the NRL, well Canberra and Manly, were looking at taking an NRL game there and I think the NRL should be dong more to promote the game in the Far East, as they will need a new market to grow into, with Australia and NZ having only small populations. Even the AFL have taken games to China, so why can't the NRL? Yeah it would be about money, but that's the point!
 
I don't think the idea of development officers is unrealistic or fantasy. These areas have done well to grow the sport with no money, so imagine a development officer going into schools and promoting and developing the game. It's more important imo to have domestic grassroots, and schools playing RL in countries, than trying to big up another nation with heritage players. 
 
In terms of a new powerhouse rising, the only likely candidates I can see anytime soon are France or Italy (if they're stuffed with Aussies).


Agreed but I think you could add PNG to that. Second most populated country In Australasia, RL is national sport , gave England a good game during last WC in Australia?

#22 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 24 April 2014 - 09:20 AM

There will be no new powerhouses in RL until we have an RLIF with some kind of power.
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#23 gutterfax

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Posted 24 April 2014 - 08:37 PM

There will be no new powerhouses in RL until we have an RLIF with some kind of power.

As long as you have a RLWC where the majority of the players come from 2 countries and play in one of 2 leagues, expansion will remains pipe dream. France needs it's own pro comp.......10 more top tier clubs fighting withe the existing 28 (from next year) with a standard cap across the world.....and limits on foreign players.

#24 The Parksider

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 06:02 AM

As long as you have a RLWC where the majority of the players come from 2 countries and play in one of 2 leagues, expansion will remains pipe dream. France needs it's own pro comp......................

 

It's one of those threads where with respect we're off on one spending £Millions we cannot afford in far away countries to create an RL culture out of nothing when they won't even play the game in Liverpool, Manchester or Sheffield.

 

Nobody doubts that International RL is the pinnacle of the game and vital to it, but if there is any policy that can be afforded and can improve the games standing in the world of sport, and can inspire people to take it up it's professional International RL which is what made those £Millions of profit last year in the first place.

 

The posts suggesting the way forward is improving such as France and PNG into teams that can compete and give the big three a game is a good dose of realism. The former has always necessitated Toulouse's entry to Super League rather than throwing £Millions around the world on the idea the Chinese or the soccer mad South African black population may just fall in love with the game en masse. 



#25 Mr Wind Up

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 06:17 AM

Nobody doubts that International RL is the pinnacle of the game and vital to it, but if there is any policy that can be afforded and can improve the games standing in the world of sport, and can inspire people to take it up it's professional International RL which is what made those £Millions of profit last year in the first place.

 

The posts suggesting the way forward is improving such as France and PNG into teams that can compete and give the big three a game is a good dose of realism. 

 

Well put.



#26 bamfordsbeans

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 07:09 AM

The optism of the world cup seems to be evaporating very quickly.However the lack of planning with fixtures is self inflicted.Surely it is not too difficult to have fixtures planned 3 or 4 years in advance.
The main consolation I take is compared to where we are 10 to 15 years ago and the number of countries having at least minimal activity.Again it all comes down to money and the commitment to spread the gospel.

#27 Mr Wind Up

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 09:02 AM

And most of the money is created by the two professional leagues. But what's in it for them to spend that money on outsiders? Talent? Maybe. Does it pay off to go down that route? Probably not. 



#28 Grollo

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 07:58 PM

There will be no new powerhouses in RL until we have an RLIF with some kind of power.

Agreed. But how to wrestle power from the nation that, to be fair, has done more for it's own competition than anyone else?

Great Britain/England is making a mess of it's own backyard, so how can we expect them to improve the expansion of the game?

I do feel disappointed at times, we have some of the most backward thinking supporters in World Sport.


Edited by Grollo, 25 April 2014 - 08:03 PM.

What you are aware of you are in control of; what you are not aware of is in control of you.

#29 jus de couchon

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 08:17 PM

The small profit made from the RLWC is unlikely to make a significant difference to any future planning at International level.The unpalatable truth is "organic" growth is the only sustainable way to plan ahead. The ESLs continued fixation for Innovation is counterproductive to progress.

#30 RugbyLeagueGeek

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Posted 26 April 2014 - 10:21 AM

The small profit made from the RLWC is unlikely to make a significant difference to any future planning at International level.The unpalatable truth is "organic" growth is the only sustainable way to plan ahead.

Can you plan 'organic' growth? Or does this just happen? There is doesn't seem to be any development strategy that I'm aware of in the UK, so any spreading of the game is just by chance as opposed to design.



#31 keighley

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Posted 26 April 2014 - 11:32 AM

As long as you have a RLWC where the majority of the players come from 2 countries and play in one of 2 leagues, expansion will remains pipe dream. France needs it's own pro comp.......10 more top tier clubs fighting withe the existing 28 (from next year) with a standard cap across the world.....and limits on foreign players.

 

That's not strictly true. The majority of the English, Australian, New Zealand and French teams come from their respective countries.



#32 keighley

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Posted 26 April 2014 - 11:39 AM

The optism of the world cup seems to be evaporating very quickly.However the lack of planning with fixtures is self inflicted.Surely it is not too difficult to have fixtures planned 3 or 4 years in advance.
The main consolation I take is compared to where we are 10 to 15 years ago and the number of countries having at least minimal activity.Again it all comes down to money and the commitment to spread the gospel.

 

I don't know what the funding levels are but the growth if international RL in Europe is nothing short of amazing and I would support funding of the RLEF based on that. China is a step too far, I think but Canada, Jamaica and, to a lesser extent, the USA could use a little help to further progress some excellent expansionary activity.



#33 keighley

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Posted 26 April 2014 - 11:41 AM

And most of the money is created by the two professional leagues. But what's in it for them to spend that money on outsiders? Talent? Maybe. Does it pay off to go down that route? Probably not. 

 

No ghe money available for international expsnsiin was created by the orld Cup tournament and a lot of that was created by fixtures involving the lesser powers.



#34 jus de couchon

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Posted 26 April 2014 - 06:44 PM

Having a one off game in China or New York or anywhere you like is a worthless suggestion.



#35 londonrlfan

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Posted 26 April 2014 - 07:23 PM

Why? We're always saying we need more money in the game, so why not go where the money is? If I was someone like Koukash, I'd be taking a Salford pre-season match to Dubai and play against of the NRL teams. 



#36 The Parksider

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 04:49 AM

Can you plan 'organic' growth? Or does this just happen? There is doesn't seem to be any development strategy that I'm aware of in the UK, so any spreading of the game is just by chance as opposed to design.

 

The "spreading" of the game would seem to be on the back of League being a version of "Rugby" that some prefer to take rather than the archaic and over-technical Union version. Countries are well aware of the game thanks to globalisation, and RL having a big presence in Australia, and so a minority of sportspeople in a number of countries choose to take it up, just like round here some people choose to take up Lacrosse and play for Leeds at the local Adel Sports club.

 

That somehow there's a country or countries that are going to embrace the game to the extent of threatening to end the domination of the Aussies (or even give England a game), if only we had a "development plan" and the small matter of a few £Million to fund it whilst the country takes to the game so completely it generates it's own funding is just a very nice fantasy, but it isn't going to happen.

 

The growth of any sport must be on the back of people wanting to actually play it, and we don't have to look any further than our own backyard to see whether people do, and to what extent. We love the game sure, and so we love to point out which school has just switched to League, which Midlands town now has a amateur club, or which country has formed a small national league. We aren't as good at taking as much notice when the same players, clubs and leagues disband or contract. 

 

As a big league fan do I really want to see a £Million being spent on the game in Serbia, or do I want that money being spent at home to bolster our own game and maybe build a little infrastructure where it would count and where we would see and benefit from the results? Marketing the game in far away places when it's in danger of contracting in our own back yard seems an odd thing to do, and so leaving the growth of the game in far away new places to "chance" is clearly all we can do.



#37 keighley

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 02:05 PM

The "spreading" of the game would seem to be on the back of League being a version of "Rugby" that some prefer to take rather than the archaic and over-technical Union version. Countries are well aware of the game thanks to globalisation, and RL having a big presence in Australia, and so a minority of sportspeople in a number of countries choose to take it up, just like round here some people choose to take up Lacrosse and play for Leeds at the local Adel Sports club.

 

That somehow there's a country or countries that are going to embrace the game to the extent of threatening to end the domination of the Aussies (or even give England a game), if only we had a "development plan" and the small matter of a few £Million to fund it whilst the country takes to the game so completely it generates it's own funding is just a very nice fantasy, but it isn't going to happen.

 

The growth of any sport must be on the back of people wanting to actually play it, and we don't have to look any further than our own backyard to see whether people do, and to what extent. We love the game sure, and so we love to point out which school has just switched to League, which Midlands town now has a amateur club, or which country has formed a small national league. We aren't as good at taking as much notice when the same players, clubs and leagues disband or contract. 

 

As a big league fan do I really want to see a £Million being spent on the game in Serbia, or do I want that money being spent at home to bolster our own game and maybe build a little infrastructure where it would count and where we would see and benefit from the results? Marketing the game in far away places when it's in danger of contracting in our own back yard seems an odd thing to do, and so leaving the growth of the game in far away new places to "chance" is clearly all we can do.

 

Ideally we need to do both. Where there is a big SL club such as Leeds, then Leeds need to take up the mantle of development there to be fair, the rhinos are doing just that. This frees up money for development in other areas of the UK and for international agendas.

 

Whilst both of these areas are unlikely to produce either a SL team or an international colossus any time soon, both could. have and will produce players, some of whom will be good enough to supplement the current pro leagues players pool. This alone is sufficient reason to persevere with funding og both areas.

 

The last world cup showed the value of the lesser nations in that they played a significant part in the overall success of the tournament. I can see the likes of Serbia, Russia and Italy contributing and qualifying for future world cups adding value to the competition and maybe pulling in more TV viewers.

 

Seeing as how the money from the WC was generated by an international tournament, I think these profits should be ploughed back into that area of the game for the benefit of international expansion and north Leeds or all Leeds should be left to the Rhinos to finance.



#38 JonNgog

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 04:35 PM

That's not strictly true. The majority of the English, Australian, New Zealand and French teams come from their respective countries.


PNG , Fiji and Wales too.

#39 Bob8

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 06:25 PM

The "spreading" of the game would seem to be on the back of League being a version of "Rugby" that some prefer to take rather than the archaic and over-technical Union version. Countries are well aware of the game thanks to globalisation, and RL having a big presence in Australia, and so a minority of sportspeople in a number of countries choose to take it up, just like round here some people choose to take up Lacrosse and play for Leeds at the local Adel Sports club.

.....

This is key.  Media used to be local and national.  Indeed, whatever sport a region was playing at the onset of mass media is almost certainly the sport it plays today. 

 

However, things are changing and media is less geographically based and as a result sport is less and less geographically based.  Forty years ago, the only team sports in Copenhagen were soccer, handball and a small amount of rugby union.  Now, there is soccer, handball, rugby league, american football, gaelic football, cricket, roller derby, korfball and a small amount of rugby union.   The same will be happening in Leeds, Wigan and St Helens.


"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

”I am all for expansion but not to start and string the teams all over the place” – stewpot01 – 11 July 2014

"2013 is on course to be one of the most disastrous in its history." - Creditwhereitsdews - 2nd January 2013


#40 jus de couchon

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 06:44 PM

The International sporting landscape may be permanent now. NFL in America. Football in Brazil. Table tennis in China. Perhaps spending money to Introduce a foreign game is throwing money away. In the ESL Bradford and London are bleeding as are several others. Best to grow the game from a strong position than speculate the hard earned on some whimsical overseas experiment.




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